Parts Prices - Vantage Rear Sub Frame
Discussion
My rear subframe (2007 V8V) is a bit rusty, nothing too bad and had it wax treated a couple of years back just to stop it getting worse.
Thinking about having it refurbed. Looked at a few posts and videos and one (a BR video from about 3-4 years ago) mentioned that it's usually just surface rust but it could, in very rare cases, compromise the structure and require a new subframe. A price of 'about £3.5k' was mentioned for a new item.
Just out of interest I checked the price of a subframe for an early car (steel tubular).
£11,056 + VAT!!!!!
Almost £13.5k for a tubular steel subframe. That really is a whole new level of taking the piss.
Thinking about having it refurbed. Looked at a few posts and videos and one (a BR video from about 3-4 years ago) mentioned that it's usually just surface rust but it could, in very rare cases, compromise the structure and require a new subframe. A price of 'about £3.5k' was mentioned for a new item.
Just out of interest I checked the price of a subframe for an early car (steel tubular).
£11,056 + VAT!!!!!
Almost £13.5k for a tubular steel subframe. That really is a whole new level of taking the piss.
LPH said:
My rear subframe (2007 V8V) is a bit rusty, nothing too bad and had it wax treated a couple of years back just to stop it getting worse.
Thinking about having it refurbed. Looked at a few posts and videos and one (a BR video from about 3-4 years ago) mentioned that it's usually just surface rust but it could, in very rare cases, compromise the structure and require a new subframe. A price of 'about £3.5k' was mentioned for a new item.
Just out of interest I checked the price of a subframe for an early car (steel tubular).
£11,056 + VAT!!!!!
Almost £13.5k for a tubular steel subframe. That really is a whole new level of taking the piss.
If you were in any doubt as to the condition of yours, I reckon if you posted a few pics there are plenty of well informed folks on here who could either reassure you it was just surface rust or confirm it was a bit further gone and needed something a bit more invasive/expensive.Thinking about having it refurbed. Looked at a few posts and videos and one (a BR video from about 3-4 years ago) mentioned that it's usually just surface rust but it could, in very rare cases, compromise the structure and require a new subframe. A price of 'about £3.5k' was mentioned for a new item.
Just out of interest I checked the price of a subframe for an early car (steel tubular).
£11,056 + VAT!!!!!
Almost £13.5k for a tubular steel subframe. That really is a whole new level of taking the piss.
Coincidentally, I was watching that BR video just yesterday - best approach if you are going to need a full refurb seemed to be to catch it early enough to do a swap out for one of their pre-refurbed items.
Related question, and hopefully helpful to OP if theirs is not too far gone: what do folks on here recommend as the best preventative measures to preserve current condition of the notorious rear subframes?
The rust was pointed out by Aston Engineering at its service in 2020. They said it wasn't bad and suggested a clean up and waxing it just to stop it getting any worse.
Went from this:
To this:
And still looks OK, albeit it bit dirty now.
So it's probably fine but I think I will get it done eventually.
Went from this:
To this:
And still looks OK, albeit it bit dirty now.
So it's probably fine but I think I will get it done eventually.
Edited by LPH on Wednesday 26th April 09:53
LPH said:
£11,056 + VAT!!!!!
Almost £13.5k for a tubular steel subframe. That really is a whole new level of taking the piss.
Holy hell! That really does remove the urine. Almost £13.5k for a tubular steel subframe. That really is a whole new level of taking the piss.
I had mine looked at late last year and it`s holding up well after 16 years, A couple of lights areas but nothing major and given a seal for now, but maintenance is king and it`ll certainly get a refurb when required!
Every time AM comes with type of part cost it just runs off current owners and potential new buyers. Then cars with dodgy repairs or painted to look good just past on to next owner. AM wonders why they have financial problems Year after year.
I am thinking of moving to a current Vantage but with parts and labor it makes the car almost not getting excited over. There goes brand loyalty.
I am thinking of moving to a current Vantage but with parts and labor it makes the car almost not getting excited over. There goes brand loyalty.
You can just imagine the conversation between the engineers and the accountants.
“The car is mostly aluminum - we should design and build an aluminum rear subframe”
“Too expensive to make it strong enough - it will add £1,000 to the price of the car”
“Ok, how about tubular stainless steel? it will last the lifetime of the car and be really strong”
“Too expensive and nobody will care that it’s shiny, ‘cos it’s under the car. It will add £500 to the price of the car”
“Well what do you suggest then?”
“Just get some mild steel and paint it black - nobody will notice….”
As I do various little jobs on my V8V, I notice lots of really daft design choices an really cheapskate material specifications. Given that it was a c. £80k(?) car new, I just can’t understand why (for instance) they didn’t use stainless fittings for the undertray. They probably saved £10 by using cheap mild steel screws, but instead, they inflict corroded and seized fasteners on future owners. False economy and slightly tarnishing for the brand.
All forgiven when out for a drive though…..
“The car is mostly aluminum - we should design and build an aluminum rear subframe”
“Too expensive to make it strong enough - it will add £1,000 to the price of the car”
“Ok, how about tubular stainless steel? it will last the lifetime of the car and be really strong”
“Too expensive and nobody will care that it’s shiny, ‘cos it’s under the car. It will add £500 to the price of the car”
“Well what do you suggest then?”
“Just get some mild steel and paint it black - nobody will notice….”
As I do various little jobs on my V8V, I notice lots of really daft design choices an really cheapskate material specifications. Given that it was a c. £80k(?) car new, I just can’t understand why (for instance) they didn’t use stainless fittings for the undertray. They probably saved £10 by using cheap mild steel screws, but instead, they inflict corroded and seized fasteners on future owners. False economy and slightly tarnishing for the brand.
All forgiven when out for a drive though…..
Let's not get too over-excited here. I don't think many (if any) new owners worry about the cost of non-consumable replacement parts that have been engineered for a 10 year life. "I like the Vantage but I've heard the subframes get rusty and may rot out in 15 years time and cost £10k to replace, so I think I'll by a 911 as its rear subframe is much cheaper if it rots". I don't think so.
This thread is concerning the cost of a new Vantage rear subframe in case one rots out (as though we are talking about a 70's Alfa Sud). I'm willing to be proven wrong but I don't think I've heard of a Vantage (or DB9) rear subframe that has rotted though - yet. Yes they get scabby. And, because the rest of the body is in aluminium, when you look underneath an older car this scabbiness sticks out like a sore thumb.
People criticise AML and ask why they couldn't have powder-coated the subframes, or galvanised them. Why would they? As Nigel says, the vehicle had a target life and the accelerated durability and corrosion tests, to Ford standards at the time, showed that they met the targets. They also had a cost target. Furthermore, the subframe painting was done by a sub-contractor and when the part was new there would have been no way of knowing if the part met the original corrosion spec, short of regularly sticking an expensive part in a salt-spray tank.
As an aside, the new DB11 and Vantage both have aluminium rear subframes. But I'm sure something else will fail on 15-yo versions that this forum will then moan about.
This thread is concerning the cost of a new Vantage rear subframe in case one rots out (as though we are talking about a 70's Alfa Sud). I'm willing to be proven wrong but I don't think I've heard of a Vantage (or DB9) rear subframe that has rotted though - yet. Yes they get scabby. And, because the rest of the body is in aluminium, when you look underneath an older car this scabbiness sticks out like a sore thumb.
People criticise AML and ask why they couldn't have powder-coated the subframes, or galvanised them. Why would they? As Nigel says, the vehicle had a target life and the accelerated durability and corrosion tests, to Ford standards at the time, showed that they met the targets. They also had a cost target. Furthermore, the subframe painting was done by a sub-contractor and when the part was new there would have been no way of knowing if the part met the original corrosion spec, short of regularly sticking an expensive part in a salt-spray tank.
As an aside, the new DB11 and Vantage both have aluminium rear subframes. But I'm sure something else will fail on 15-yo versions that this forum will then moan about.
Edited by LTP on Thursday 27th April 09:24
Nigel_O said:
I just can’t understand why (for instance) they didn’t use stainless fittings for the undertray. They probably saved £10 by using cheap mild steel screws, but instead, they inflict corroded and seized fasteners on future owners. False economy and slightly tarnishing for the brand.
Assuming your number is right, £10 per car x 7000 cars per year is £70k straight on the bottom line for no effort. You also have to factor in the production and logistics costs and complexities. Astons were not engineered for the hobbyist - which is why technically you have to take the engine out if the wiper mechanism fails. How many other small-volume (not specialist) cars use stainless fasteners for things like undersheets?Nigel_O said:
All forgiven when out for a drive though…..
I agree. Sounds like they got the important bits right, thenIve had a look at the subframe on my 2012 car, and with a quick wipe over with ACF50 it looks like superficial surface corrosion at worst. Its done 73k miles in all weather so far. Im pretty sure it will out last me. Maybe if someone buys it in 20 years time they might want to tart it up a bit 
Being a guy thats used to owning classic cars (911's and Integrale) that surface rust in the subframe photos looks very superficial. A bit of wire brushing or a dremel with a wire brush end and then a lick of decent rust protection like Lanoguard etc. will give you a good solid protected frame. (thats all the specialists are doing). Top up the rust protection every couple of years and all good. Surprised its not galvanised?
MJ911 said:
Being a guy thats used to owning classic cars (911's and Integrale) that surface rust in the subframe photos looks very superficial. A bit of wire brushing or a dremel with a wire brush end and then a lick of decent rust protection like Lanoguard etc. will give you a good solid protected frame. (thats all the specialists are doing). Top up the rust protection every couple of years and all good. Surprised its not galvanised?
The rust in the pictures might be superficial, but (given the low res pictures) it's hard to tell unless you inspect the underside of the car closely on a ramp. At the very least it's ugly and will only get worse over time.Wire brushing and/or dremeling will only get to those parts of the subframe that are accessible, what about the non accessible areas where things are hinged, or tight against the chassis, or inside that open tube section? A proper repair involves removing the whole subframe, inspecting it, possibly vapour/shot-blasting/welding then powdercoating and re-installing.
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