Manual V8 Vantage help me pressure-test two very different
Discussion
I'm looking for a manual V8 Vantage to keep for the long term (~15 years), based in Belgium. I'll drive it regularly but gently, and may fit a double plate clutch/lightweight flywheel upgrade down the line. Two hard requirements: manual gearbox and LHD. Alongside the driving, capital preservation genuinely matters to me — I'm a keeper, not a flipper, but I'd rather not watch money quietly evaporate either.
I've narrowed it to two cars that could hardly be more different, and I'd value an objective read from people who actually live with these cars.
CAR A — 2014 V8 Vantage S "SP10", 6-speed manual
- ~28,800 km, Ceramic Grey, 3 owners, full history (early years at official AM, more recently at the selling independent specialist, who has looked after it for 6 years). German dealer, warranty. ~€90,400.
- The appeal: special edition, the first V8 Vantage S offered with a manual, 436 PS + sports exhaust. The selling dealer claims ~150 worldwide; my understanding is that total SP10 production was ~384 across both gearboxes, so I'd welcome clarity on the true manual-coupe numbers.
CAR B — 2009 V8 Vantage 4.7, 6-speed manual (standard car)
- ~23,000 km, one owner for 17 years, bought from and always serviced by Aston Martin Antwerp. Genuinely close to new, not a single stone chip to the front paint. Belgian car. ~€95,000.
- The appeal: exceptional condition and provenance, a single fastidious owner, very low miles.
HERE'S THE TWIST THAT SHAPES MY THINKING — BELGIAN ROAD TAX
In Flanders these cars carry ~€4,700/year in annual road tax until they reach "oldtimer" status at 25 years, after which it drops to a flat ~€100. So the 2009 car hits that break around 2034; the 2014 SP10 not until ~2039 — roughly 5 extra years of full tax for the SP10. (A less favourable formula also arrives in 2027, so registering before then matters, and you can hand in your plates over winter for a pro-rata refund — though that tactic actually shrinks the gap between the two cars, since it lowers the full-tax years for both equally.)
MY CURRENT REASONING (please poke holes in it)
- The SP10's premium is rarity-based, and rarity survives use — I can drive it without eroding what I paid for.
- Car B's premium is condition/mileage-based, and I'd erode exactly that by using it. Paying €95k for 23,000 km that I'll turn into 60,000+ feels like pre-funding a quality I then consume.
- The tax timing favours Car B (earlier oldtimer status), but the winter-suspension option softens that advantage.
- So I currently lean towards the SP10 — unless Car B can be negotiated into the low-€80k range.
WHERE I'D REALLY VALUE YOUR EXPERIENCE
1. Long term, does a manual SP10 hold a durable premium over a standard 4.7 manual, or do they eventually converge? This is the single biggest variable in my thinking.
1,b : is the driving different and does it feel and is faster. I want to try it on the track five times Every year.
2. Known weak points on the 4.7 manual at low mileage, and what would you prioritise on a PPI?
3. Real-world SP10 manual production numbers — how rare is it actually?
4. Simply: which would you buy, and why?
Thanks in advance. I'm trying to weigh this as objectively as I can, and outside perspective from people who own these cars is exactly what I'm missing.
My $0.02
edited to add
Second thoughts: I may be wrong about the dash and the seats, as I'm not sure about when the "Phase 2" waterfall was introduced. I'll stand by the brakes, though
- These cars will never be an investment imho, so buy one because you like it.
- The 2014 car will have improvements over the early car (setting aside the extra 10 bhp, which you won't notice in the real world). It has better brakes, better dash, better suspension, and (I think) better seats
- The 'S' exhaust sounds glorious - I've just had one retro-fitted to my 2015 non-'S' V8V
- I wouldn't worry about the numbers - these are not collectable specials like the GT8 or GT12
- The 2009 car sounds a bit optimistic in price, but it's only one-owner and low mileage until you buy it and drive it - then it's just another low-mileage early Vantage
- You stand to lose more on the 2009 car
edited to add
Second thoughts: I may be wrong about the dash and the seats, as I'm not sure about when the "Phase 2" waterfall was introduced. I'll stand by the brakes, though
Edited by LTP on Friday 17th July 17:36
I totally disagree - IMO these are undervalued and due to see a gentle appreciation, enough to cover running costs over time. It’s basically the last beautiful NA manual sportscar left that hasn’t seen a big value appreciation.
The Vantage S is seen as the gold standard of how a V8 Vantage should drive and any variant of that is a safer bet than a standard 4.7 IMO. Can’t comment on the tax thing.
My pick would be a higher mileage early car if you’re going to track it - you are unlikely to lose value through using & tracking it whereas you will almost certainly eat through the residuals on a low mileage standard production 4.7 if you use it as described.
The Vantage S is seen as the gold standard of how a V8 Vantage should drive and any variant of that is a safer bet than a standard 4.7 IMO. Can’t comment on the tax thing.
My pick would be a higher mileage early car if you’re going to track it - you are unlikely to lose value through using & tracking it whereas you will almost certainly eat through the residuals on a low mileage standard production 4.7 if you use it as described.
Lorenzoo said:
I'm looking for a manual V8 Vantage to keep for the long term (~15 years), based in Belgium.
3. Real-world SP10 manual production numbers, how rare is it actually?
3. Real-world SP10 manual production numbers, how rare is it actually?
There were a huge number of Limited and Special Editions.
This page answers your production numbers question.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Gooly said:
I totally disagree - IMO these are undervalued and due to see a gentle appreciation, enough to cover running costs over time. It s basically the last beautiful NA manual sportscar left that hasn t seen a big value appreciation.
I hope you're right, but it's not showing for mine in the last 7+ years. Which one have you got?
I am sorry, I am new in the forum and Just thinking about buying my dreamcar as a 39 year old.
Its not all about depreciation, but its one factor for me to take into consideration. I Just want to make a fully informed decision as I never drove the S variant.
For now everyone is more inclined toward the S Version.
Would that also be the case if the prestine low mileage was 70000-75000?
Its not all about depreciation, but its one factor for me to take into consideration. I Just want to make a fully informed decision as I never drove the S variant.
For now everyone is more inclined toward the S Version.
Would that also be the case if the prestine low mileage was 70000-75000?
Lorenzoo said:
I am sorry, I am new in the forum and Just thinking about buying my dreamcar as a 39 year old.
Its not all about depreciation, but its one factor for me to take into consideration. I Just want to make a fully informed decision as I never drove the S variant.
For now everyone is more inclined toward the S Version.
Would that also be the case if the prestine low mileage was 70000-75000?
Its not all about depreciation, but its one factor for me to take into consideration. I Just want to make a fully informed decision as I never drove the S variant.
For now everyone is more inclined toward the S Version.
Would that also be the case if the prestine low mileage was 70000-75000?
Depreciation - I bought a 2 year old V8V 4.7 in 2011.
Value reduction so far maybe £20,000 during 15 years.
Had I instead bought (say) a new BMW 3 series for similar money, it would probably be worthless by now.
You shouldn't need to worry too much.
One other point. I think the V8VS models all have sports suspension (extra firm).
When you test drive (are you in UK), it should not be difficult to find a shocking road surface.
Standard suspension is hard enough for me.
The situation with the Belgian Road Tax makes your situation interesting as buying an older car could make sense. As others have said I don't think the value of these cars is going to be very different in 15 yrs. The biggest factors will be the 4.7 and the 6speed which both have.
All of the V8 Vantages are beautiful cars. They all have far more in common than they do differences however spec changes do make quite a difference to their character. IMHO you cannot buy the perfect Vantage because they never sold the perfect combination at the same time.
The 2 cars you have listed are actually quite different apart from engines and gearboxes being a pre-facelift standard and facelift sport 'SP10'. As you intend to keep this car for a long time you should work out exactly what you want.
Sorry this is going to get nerdy. Probably exposes my detail focus and OCD.
Mechanically-
The V8S/post MY12.25 introduced bigger front brakes, the later antiroll bars(thinner at the front and thicker at the rear) and quicker steering rack. They make the car more dynamic, particularly turning into corners enthusiastically. However most of them are on the sports suspension which as 'Dewi 2' says is quite stiff, too stiff on bad roads IMO but may be fine on European roads.
The V8S sport shocks were new but there was also a new comfort option with shocks CG33 fitted (I believe this was a no cost option but most came on sports shocks BG33) If the car is for road usage(even fast road), the CG33 shocks are the ones to have as they allow the car to breathe with the road compared to the sports shocks but have better body control especially at the rear than the earlier 4.7 Bilstein 9G33 standard shocks. Later cars also came on slightly wider wheels and tyres, the forged options are very nice.
Interior-
All of the 4.7s apart from the last few years have the Volvo based interior which has a good reputation for reliability. The late cars have the haptic centre console, which looks great but has had issues. Generally the earlier cars have higher quality interiors, they tried to cost cut interiors including using cheaper leather with the earlier leather becoming an optional upgrade.
Styling
This is subjective but earlier cars in my view are prettier. The MY09 will have the earlier car styling including smaller wing mirrors(good) and the 8 bar grill but may have the N400 skirts or the original undercut ones.
The differences between the pre and post facelift cars are most obvious on lighter coloured cars with added black on lower front and rear. I particularly prefer the rear on the earlier car , it just looks lower and wider.
The preface lift car AMLV above is mine that I have owned for over 10yrs. When I bought it there was a big price difference to a V8S as they were only a couple of years old. It's an MY2010.5 car, the first year not to have the smaller mirrors and to be fitted with 6 bar grill.
I didn't drive a V8S until a few years later but there was quite a difference. As above I preferred the dynamic nature of the 'S' but the sport suspension struggled on my local rural roads when pressing on. The new Comfort was the sweet spot. It left me with a bit of a problem as prefered the earlier styling, loved the Hardley Green colour, the interior of mine and it has all the options I wanted including the B&O HiFi. Also with only about 20% of the 4.7s being 6 speed manual there is limited choice in the used market. I decided I would upgrade the car I had to be closer mechanically to the V8S.
I fitted the later rollbars and the CG33 shocks which greatly improved it dynamically but I would like the quicker steering rack. The bigger brakes would be nice too, but I haven't missed them since I went to 2 piece semi floating discs. I also upgraded to the AMR twin plate clutch, lithium battery and exhaust valve switch. After a bit of a muppet moment when I damaged a side skirt I changed the N400 skirts to V8S skirts which are the only bit of the face lift that I prefer.
So after 10 years of ownership and driving multiple cars. My perfect car would be a pre-facelift car with small mirrors, a six bar grill and V8S side sills. It would have all the mechanical upgrades of the facelift car but modified with a twinplate clutch, after market headers, sports cats, a tune and a CarPlay info system.
So to back to your question...
What do you want? You probably need to go and drive both to experience the difference. In your post you say you will drive it frequently but gently, this more cruiser use may suit the standard car better. It does mean you could potentially buy the MY09 with cash for upgrades with the same total ownership cost as the SP10. Beware some options are very expensive or impossible to retrofit, such as the fixed back sets and the B&O HiFi.
However if you like the colour and the interior spec of the SP10 you may want to get that as the changes are significant. The darker colour hides many of the cosmetic changes on the facelift car. Check the shock part no. if it's too stiff for you, change to the CG33 shocks. This will be much easier way of getting the great V8V.
A final word of caution, the AM techs tell me the low milage cars have far more issues than the ones that are used frequently. I wouldn't be put off by a car that has more km, especially if it's closer to your dream car than the ones you listed. I bought mine with 30,000km and it now has 115,000km, I drive it regularly and very enthusiastically. It's only had a minor few issues; a door module, LED light and Windscreen washer pump. Which ever you're going to buy make sure you get the car properly checked, there is lots of sense in getting a warranty especially for that 1st year.
Good luck, keep us updated.
All of the V8 Vantages are beautiful cars. They all have far more in common than they do differences however spec changes do make quite a difference to their character. IMHO you cannot buy the perfect Vantage because they never sold the perfect combination at the same time.
The 2 cars you have listed are actually quite different apart from engines and gearboxes being a pre-facelift standard and facelift sport 'SP10'. As you intend to keep this car for a long time you should work out exactly what you want.
Sorry this is going to get nerdy. Probably exposes my detail focus and OCD.
Mechanically-
The V8S/post MY12.25 introduced bigger front brakes, the later antiroll bars(thinner at the front and thicker at the rear) and quicker steering rack. They make the car more dynamic, particularly turning into corners enthusiastically. However most of them are on the sports suspension which as 'Dewi 2' says is quite stiff, too stiff on bad roads IMO but may be fine on European roads.
The V8S sport shocks were new but there was also a new comfort option with shocks CG33 fitted (I believe this was a no cost option but most came on sports shocks BG33) If the car is for road usage(even fast road), the CG33 shocks are the ones to have as they allow the car to breathe with the road compared to the sports shocks but have better body control especially at the rear than the earlier 4.7 Bilstein 9G33 standard shocks. Later cars also came on slightly wider wheels and tyres, the forged options are very nice.
Interior-
All of the 4.7s apart from the last few years have the Volvo based interior which has a good reputation for reliability. The late cars have the haptic centre console, which looks great but has had issues. Generally the earlier cars have higher quality interiors, they tried to cost cut interiors including using cheaper leather with the earlier leather becoming an optional upgrade.
Styling
This is subjective but earlier cars in my view are prettier. The MY09 will have the earlier car styling including smaller wing mirrors(good) and the 8 bar grill but may have the N400 skirts or the original undercut ones.
The differences between the pre and post facelift cars are most obvious on lighter coloured cars with added black on lower front and rear. I particularly prefer the rear on the earlier car , it just looks lower and wider.
The preface lift car AMLV above is mine that I have owned for over 10yrs. When I bought it there was a big price difference to a V8S as they were only a couple of years old. It's an MY2010.5 car, the first year not to have the smaller mirrors and to be fitted with 6 bar grill.
I didn't drive a V8S until a few years later but there was quite a difference. As above I preferred the dynamic nature of the 'S' but the sport suspension struggled on my local rural roads when pressing on. The new Comfort was the sweet spot. It left me with a bit of a problem as prefered the earlier styling, loved the Hardley Green colour, the interior of mine and it has all the options I wanted including the B&O HiFi. Also with only about 20% of the 4.7s being 6 speed manual there is limited choice in the used market. I decided I would upgrade the car I had to be closer mechanically to the V8S.
I fitted the later rollbars and the CG33 shocks which greatly improved it dynamically but I would like the quicker steering rack. The bigger brakes would be nice too, but I haven't missed them since I went to 2 piece semi floating discs. I also upgraded to the AMR twin plate clutch, lithium battery and exhaust valve switch. After a bit of a muppet moment when I damaged a side skirt I changed the N400 skirts to V8S skirts which are the only bit of the face lift that I prefer.
So after 10 years of ownership and driving multiple cars. My perfect car would be a pre-facelift car with small mirrors, a six bar grill and V8S side sills. It would have all the mechanical upgrades of the facelift car but modified with a twinplate clutch, after market headers, sports cats, a tune and a CarPlay info system.
So to back to your question...
What do you want? You probably need to go and drive both to experience the difference. In your post you say you will drive it frequently but gently, this more cruiser use may suit the standard car better. It does mean you could potentially buy the MY09 with cash for upgrades with the same total ownership cost as the SP10. Beware some options are very expensive or impossible to retrofit, such as the fixed back sets and the B&O HiFi.
However if you like the colour and the interior spec of the SP10 you may want to get that as the changes are significant. The darker colour hides many of the cosmetic changes on the facelift car. Check the shock part no. if it's too stiff for you, change to the CG33 shocks. This will be much easier way of getting the great V8V.
A final word of caution, the AM techs tell me the low milage cars have far more issues than the ones that are used frequently. I wouldn't be put off by a car that has more km, especially if it's closer to your dream car than the ones you listed. I bought mine with 30,000km and it now has 115,000km, I drive it regularly and very enthusiastically. It's only had a minor few issues; a door module, LED light and Windscreen washer pump. Which ever you're going to buy make sure you get the car properly checked, there is lots of sense in getting a warranty especially for that 1st year.
Good luck, keep us updated.
I would be cautious about any predictions regarding the value of cars over the next ten years. I believe the market is getting smaller and smaller, and it s highly questionable whether those who buy gas-powered manual sports cars in 10 15 years will opt for the same model we ve just purchased. Some cars have been on the market for a very long time and wait years for a buyer.
It s better to choose the car that gives you the most enjoyment.
And if you re worried that your car will lose value with every kilometer driven, then choose one that already has a lot of mileage on it - that way, the depreciation will be less.
It s better to choose the car that gives you the most enjoyment.
And if you re worried that your car will lose value with every kilometer driven, then choose one that already has a lot of mileage on it - that way, the depreciation will be less.
Edited by Granturadriver on Saturday 18th July 07:05
Gassing Station | Aston Martin | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff