Jap Coupe in My sights
Discussion
Hi all,
Been looking around for some kind of Japanese coupe - hopefully you guys can help me out on which one to choose, as there seems to be plenty of them.
I need the car to be something of a halfway house in between a beast and something relatively driveable:
I'm thinking about a 1.6-2 Litre Engine, (ideally not turbo) so as it doesn't rinse my fuel unless I boot it (but when the occasion arises, there is sufficient clout to get up and go)
RWD/4WD. Pretty Please.
Insurance - Something that won't kill me on insurance - when I get the car I should be 21 with (hopefully) 1 years NCB.
I'm thinking along the lines of a 180SX, or similar - anyone got any ideas?
Been looking around for some kind of Japanese coupe - hopefully you guys can help me out on which one to choose, as there seems to be plenty of them.
I need the car to be something of a halfway house in between a beast and something relatively driveable:
I'm thinking about a 1.6-2 Litre Engine, (ideally not turbo) so as it doesn't rinse my fuel unless I boot it (but when the occasion arises, there is sufficient clout to get up and go)
RWD/4WD. Pretty Please.
Insurance - Something that won't kill me on insurance - when I get the car I should be 21 with (hopefully) 1 years NCB.
I'm thinking along the lines of a 180SX, or similar - anyone got any ideas?
If you're looking at 4WD, almost all of your options have a turbo. Rear wheel drive will have a nice mix. I'm pretty sure the 180sx was turbocharged?
Here's a cheap (<10k) little list to get you started although I'm not sure of your budget:
Honda S2000
Honda Integra DC2/DC5
Honda Prelude (2.0, 2.2 & 2.3)
Mazda MX5
Mazda MX6
Mitsubishi FTO
Nissan 180/200sx
Toyota Levin
Toyota Trueno
Toyota Celica (ST202 - NA, ST205 - Turbo'd 4WD, 190 - NA)
Take your pick.
Here's a cheap (<10k) little list to get you started although I'm not sure of your budget:
Honda S2000
Honda Integra DC2/DC5
Honda Prelude (2.0, 2.2 & 2.3)
Mazda MX5
Mazda MX6
Mitsubishi FTO
Nissan 180/200sx
Toyota Levin
Toyota Trueno
Toyota Celica (ST202 - NA, ST205 - Turbo'd 4WD, 190 - NA)
Take your pick.
Edited by TotalControl on Tuesday 2nd June 03:05
/slaps self in the face with a wet fish for not giving you guys a budget to work with
something along the lines of 4k. It's flexible as is everything that I have laid down, but you have to be realistic.
Yeah, I am aware the 180SX is turbo'd, just shows you the kind of thing that I am looking for.
I am gonna plump out and say no to the MX5/S2000 group. I don't want a car with a flanel for a roof.
Teggys are nice, not sure if one really fits in my budget mind.
Preludes are something I have been looking at, anyone know anything more about them?
MX6 I'm not sure on, correct me if I'm wrong but aren't they 2.5L engines? And FWD.
What the hell is a Toyota Levin/Trueno?
Unless you mean those AE86 things, in which case hell yes, where, how much, one now please.
something along the lines of 4k. It's flexible as is everything that I have laid down, but you have to be realistic.
Yeah, I am aware the 180SX is turbo'd, just shows you the kind of thing that I am looking for.
I am gonna plump out and say no to the MX5/S2000 group. I don't want a car with a flanel for a roof.
Teggys are nice, not sure if one really fits in my budget mind.
Preludes are something I have been looking at, anyone know anything more about them?
MX6 I'm not sure on, correct me if I'm wrong but aren't they 2.5L engines? And FWD.
What the hell is a Toyota Levin/Trueno?
Unless you mean those AE86 things, in which case hell yes, where, how much, one now please.
Edited by Loque on Tuesday 2nd June 03:28
MX5 with a hard top? 
200SX NA (2.0) meant to be a nice drive, obviously not as entertaining as the turbo but 150-200bhp so they still go ok.
MR2 Mk1 (1.6) or 2 (2.0) NA
AE86 is RWD, later Levin/Treuno FWD though.
Integra, Prelude, MX6, FTO, Celica (ex.GT4 and pre-'85ish models) all FWD.
200SX NA (2.0) meant to be a nice drive, obviously not as entertaining as the turbo but 150-200bhp so they still go ok.
MR2 Mk1 (1.6) or 2 (2.0) NA
AE86 is RWD, later Levin/Treuno FWD though.
Integra, Prelude, MX6, FTO, Celica (ex.GT4 and pre-'85ish models) all FWD.
Edited by GravelBen on Tuesday 2nd June 03:49
NA S15's (Spec-S=Na, Spec-R=turbo) are much cheaper than turbos here in NZ, in fact often cheaper than S14 turbos so worth looking into - I don't know what UK prices are like though. The Autech S15 is the top NA with 200bhp and the better chassis/drivetrain bits of the turbo but good luck finding one!
I wouldn't write off the MX5 until you've tried one either - they really are quite brilliant to drive.
You could try an NA R32 Skyline though they're slightly bigger than other options suggested.
I wouldn't write off the MX5 until you've tried one either - they really are quite brilliant to drive.
You could try an NA R32 Skyline though they're slightly bigger than other options suggested.
Edited by GravelBen on Tuesday 2nd June 04:01
Skyline will be a 2.5 NA or turbo if in GTS-T form (RWD). If you want, you can also look into the Supra NA's as well. Very affordable prices.
If you want a good, solid coupe in the price range suggested then you'll be looking at fine examples from the FWD variants.
Edited to add: If you're after something nice then how about a Mk3 MR2? It's NA, Can have a hard top and is a 1.8. Affordable too. I'm personally looking into one but then again i've just turned 25.
If you want a good, solid coupe in the price range suggested then you'll be looking at fine examples from the FWD variants.
Edited to add: If you're after something nice then how about a Mk3 MR2? It's NA, Can have a hard top and is a 1.8. Affordable too. I'm personally looking into one but then again i've just turned 25.
Edited by TotalControl on Tuesday 2nd June 16:02
as above best value option including the cost of insurance at 21 will be a 2.0 na mr2. loads around and british models means insurance will be alot better. They are also a nice drive. for upto £4k to spend i would go for a late rev5 model on a 99 or 2000 plate, or save some cash and buy any rev3 onwards car for about £2k for a nice example.
keep 'em coming guys
On the Skyline front a 2.5 Turbo might be a bit much although I've seen a few 2.0 non turbos around, are they worth the effort?
MR2s are an interesting one, great looking car. I heard they are a bit of a female dog to drive though? Can anyone shed any light on that?
Supras. Hmmm. *Shuffles off to classifieds once more*
On the Skyline front a 2.5 Turbo might be a bit much although I've seen a few 2.0 non turbos around, are they worth the effort?
MR2s are an interesting one, great looking car. I heard they are a bit of a female dog to drive though? Can anyone shed any light on that?
Supras. Hmmm. *Shuffles off to classifieds once more*
MR2 sounds like the best bet on the criteria you've set out above.
ETA: can you actually buy a Nissan 180SX in this country? I thought the 180 was the Japanese name for the S13 200SX?
Also if you're considering Supras then you're considering bigger than 2 litre engines... you could always have a look at a Mitsi GTO, plenty within your budget, or even a 300ZX if you don't mind bending over at the pumps and when it comes to insuring it... you can also get non-turbo ones:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1991-NISSAN-300-ZX-2-2-RED-R...
ETA: can you actually buy a Nissan 180SX in this country? I thought the 180 was the Japanese name for the S13 200SX?
Also if you're considering Supras then you're considering bigger than 2 litre engines... you could always have a look at a Mitsi GTO, plenty within your budget, or even a 300ZX if you don't mind bending over at the pumps and when it comes to insuring it... you can also get non-turbo ones:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1991-NISSAN-300-ZX-2-2-RED-R...
Edited by -Lummox- on Tuesday 2nd June 18:07
200SX then, you know what I mean. Much as I'd love a Silvia, or Sil80, I doubt I could afford the insurance on a grey import.
Come to think of it this is probably a good place to ask what it is like, insurance on imports? I understand that it is more, but how much more are we talking about here.
Been looking at Supras and 200ZX's. Nope. Can't afford to be dragged over the coals every five miles to fill up. Unfortunately. 3 Litres is just too big an engine for me at the moment.
Rx8 for 4 grand for a start? Nope, and if I could afford to run one, I'd buy an RX7. But I can't so.
I'm definitely looking into the MR-2s though. Has anybody got any ownership experience, or reading material where I can learn a little more about them. It would have to be a MkII, MkI's are a bit too old and MkIII's just aren't me. They seem to have a good complement of engines though. Though I understand the UK did not get any Turbo Models at all? Is this correct? Not that I am after one, just pure curiosity really.
Come to think of it this is probably a good place to ask what it is like, insurance on imports? I understand that it is more, but how much more are we talking about here.
Been looking at Supras and 200ZX's. Nope. Can't afford to be dragged over the coals every five miles to fill up. Unfortunately. 3 Litres is just too big an engine for me at the moment.
Rx8 for 4 grand for a start? Nope, and if I could afford to run one, I'd buy an RX7. But I can't so.
I'm definitely looking into the MR-2s though. Has anybody got any ownership experience, or reading material where I can learn a little more about them. It would have to be a MkII, MkI's are a bit too old and MkIII's just aren't me. They seem to have a good complement of engines though. Though I understand the UK did not get any Turbo Models at all? Is this correct? Not that I am after one, just pure curiosity really.
MR2's sound right up your street. They're good cars, frugal on the juice, cheap to run and insure, and great fun. Handle well and look decent enough.
Personally I'd avoid the NA versions of more commonly turbo variant cars, possibly with the exception of supras as the NA version isn't as bad (it's still a bit disappointing though). Non turbo 200sx's are pretty tame and dull, you'd get bored with a turbo one before long and start looking for things to get a few extra bhp on the cheap, with the NA you don't have that option and they're already slow. The turbos aren't exactly thirsty, you can click 30mpg with relative ease on a run.
You seem to be making the mistake of assuming a big engine or a turbocharged engine = bad MPG. It doesn't. 4WD doesn't help, so if you've got a real thing about MPG be cautious.
The NA skylines are a bit rubbish imo, and if you're running cost budget is as tight as you seem to be making out, give them a wide berth. I fail to see the appeal of them, but each to their own.
AE86's are fun, but their 'cult' status with the drifters means they're way way way overvalued these days for what you're getting, and imo over-rated. Still, they're kinda cool and drifty fun
No idea what the first Lexus IS200's are fetching these days, might be able to pick on of those up in your budget?
Personally I'd avoid the NA versions of more commonly turbo variant cars, possibly with the exception of supras as the NA version isn't as bad (it's still a bit disappointing though). Non turbo 200sx's are pretty tame and dull, you'd get bored with a turbo one before long and start looking for things to get a few extra bhp on the cheap, with the NA you don't have that option and they're already slow. The turbos aren't exactly thirsty, you can click 30mpg with relative ease on a run.
You seem to be making the mistake of assuming a big engine or a turbocharged engine = bad MPG. It doesn't. 4WD doesn't help, so if you've got a real thing about MPG be cautious.
The NA skylines are a bit rubbish imo, and if you're running cost budget is as tight as you seem to be making out, give them a wide berth. I fail to see the appeal of them, but each to their own.
AE86's are fun, but their 'cult' status with the drifters means they're way way way overvalued these days for what you're getting, and imo over-rated. Still, they're kinda cool and drifty fun
No idea what the first Lexus IS200's are fetching these days, might be able to pick on of those up in your budget?
Running costs are an issue I'll admit, especially when I have to lump insurance into the mix. I don't know what it would be quite honestly, but I wouldnt be suprised if it came out with something like over a grand.
As for fuel efficiency. In my head I have an idea of 30 being the magic number as far as MPG goes. Maybe you could all shed a little light on how things would go on that one.
I'll pass on the IS200, I need it to be two-three door. I'm not planning on ferrying anyone around.
I must be badly educated on the matter, but please do explain why a larger engine/turbo need not equate to poor fuel consumption. Yes I understand this concept of being able to achieve higher speeds at lower revs, but still is this enough? And how do Turbos fit into that equation.
I have to admit though - I'm getting really tempted by these MR2s.
As for fuel efficiency. In my head I have an idea of 30 being the magic number as far as MPG goes. Maybe you could all shed a little light on how things would go on that one.
I'll pass on the IS200, I need it to be two-three door. I'm not planning on ferrying anyone around.
I must be badly educated on the matter, but please do explain why a larger engine/turbo need not equate to poor fuel consumption. Yes I understand this concept of being able to achieve higher speeds at lower revs, but still is this enough? And how do Turbos fit into that equation.
I have to admit though - I'm getting really tempted by these MR2s.
Without wishing to delve too deep into the science behind it, there's a lot more to fuel consumption than displacement. I managed a genuine 30mpg in a 4.4 litre V8 this afternoon, and that's sat in not far off 2 tonnes of BMW 7 series. Gearing, weight, efficiency and so on all have a part to play. Consider that a 6 litre V8 corvette, or a 5.7 litre V8 monaro can hit 30mpg.
Turbos can be very handy. Take a 200sx for example, at cruising speeds on the motorway etc you'll find they're pretty much off boost, so the turbo isn't really doing anything. This means less air being swallowed by the engine, which means less fuel being poured in, which means smaller bangs in the cylinders, which in turn means better fuel consumption.
When you feel a bit fruity and fancy pedalling it a bit harder, of course the turbo will be doing it's thing, and the fuel consumption will drop, but you'll find they're not actually that thirsty. Quite nicely geared, pretty light at around 1300kg's for an S13 model iirc, and that jekyll & Hyde split personality thanks to the blower. So achieving circa 30mpg is entirely possible even in a slightly modified one. around town you can expect that to drop a bit with all the stop starting etc, but the combined figure is pretty reasonable. Don't ask me what it is, but none of my 200's were especially thirsty.
Stick a small engine in a big heavy car, and you'll find it's overall lack of grunt results in your working it harder to get anything fun out of it, and the economy suffering as a result.
rotary engines are a different ball park altogether, avoid them like the plague if you're remotely worried about fuel consumption or running costs.
Turbos can be very handy. Take a 200sx for example, at cruising speeds on the motorway etc you'll find they're pretty much off boost, so the turbo isn't really doing anything. This means less air being swallowed by the engine, which means less fuel being poured in, which means smaller bangs in the cylinders, which in turn means better fuel consumption.
When you feel a bit fruity and fancy pedalling it a bit harder, of course the turbo will be doing it's thing, and the fuel consumption will drop, but you'll find they're not actually that thirsty. Quite nicely geared, pretty light at around 1300kg's for an S13 model iirc, and that jekyll & Hyde split personality thanks to the blower. So achieving circa 30mpg is entirely possible even in a slightly modified one. around town you can expect that to drop a bit with all the stop starting etc, but the combined figure is pretty reasonable. Don't ask me what it is, but none of my 200's were especially thirsty.
Stick a small engine in a big heavy car, and you'll find it's overall lack of grunt results in your working it harder to get anything fun out of it, and the economy suffering as a result.
rotary engines are a different ball park altogether, avoid them like the plague if you're remotely worried about fuel consumption or running costs.
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