116d-118d-110d-123d, which car to buy?

[cragswinter]

Just back from the ring, & a mate is getting a little tired of his 182 Clio, great little car but a succession of faults has him wondering about changing.

Due to insurance he must have a 2.0 or less, with a turbo fitted purely for economy rather than performance (how they figure that out I don't know?).

Seeing folks out there with 120d's that have been chipped up got us looking in the classifieds & there are some good buys out there.

But what are specifically the differences?

123d is twin turbo yes?

We were thinking the best compromise would be a 120d M-sport with a remap, good day to day mpg & still good fun out at the ring & spa.

Car will do say half a dozen track days a year, not worried about being the absolute fastest thing out there but something quick(ish) & fun to drive is key.

Any experiences? Any advice?

[stevesuk]

cragswinter said:

Due to insurance he must have a 2.0 or less, with a turbo fitted purely for economy rather than performance (how they figure that out I don't know?).

....

We were thinking the best compromise would be a 120d M-sport with a remap, good day to day mpg & still good fun out at the ring & spa.

If you're worried about insurance, you'd surely have to declare a remap anyway to keep everything legal and above board?

We used to have a standard 120d, and it was pretty rapid and handled nicely. Before the 130i was launched, the 120d was pretty much the performance flagship of the range, certainly quicker than the 120i. Beware though - they do have plenty of niggly faults/failures too. DSC pumps can fail (very common, and used to cost well over £1000 to put right, although I believe a repair kit is now available), as can the electronic steering lock. Have a look at www.babybmw.net, who are a helpful bunch.

Ours was a very early model (late 2004) so was 163 BHP and long before efficient dynamics. On a sedate, quiet A-road run, we once managed just over 50mpg. On a motorway run without focussing on economy, it was more like mid to high 40s.

Have you also considered the equivalent 3 series? More space inside, better build quality and probably just a nice to drive?

[14-7]

I've had a 123d coupe for 6 months now. The power delivery doesn't feel like much but when you look at the speedo it does surprise you sometimes. People say the 120d feels quicker due to the power delivery of the single turbo but in reality the 123d is quicker but not by much. The 123d also has different gearing to the 120d. The 120 is the better motorway cruiser due to lower gearing.

Remap wise the 123d will do 250bhp no problem. Others have pushed them to 280 ish which is a sizeable increase but wouldn't fancy that myself due to the increased wear on parts.

[StottyZr]

What’s his budget? The 116d is a great buy, IIRC its free to tax, very low insurance and remaps from 115hp to 180hp (yes, a 56% increase in power) as its the same engine as the 118d minus oil cooling I believe.

The 120d is the best all-rounder, but he may be disappointed with the performance coming from a 182. Only with a remap will the 120d be faster, and even then it will only be a couple of car lengths from 30-110.

I'd recommend a 123d (biased opinion) I've just paid £611 in a group buy for a remap with dpf delete which should take the car up to 520nm and 275hp. As this is done with a dpf delete its not overly stressing the components (can be mapped to 270 with dpf in place!) and this turned a pretty quick car into a seriously quick car.

Also as you asked, difference between 120d and 123d... (stolen from the babybmw forum)

1. Second turbo
2. Electronic LSD
3. Heavier duty brakes (same as the 130i I believe)
3. Heavier duty Clutch
4. Heavier duty Gearbox (same as 330d I think)
5. Different final drive so shorter gears
6. Different Intercooler
7. Different oil
8. Fuel system with higher injection pressure (2000 vs. 1800bar)
9. Boost pressure 2bar instead of 1,55bar

Some great information on there which should help you mate make his descision.

http://babybmw.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=34360&...

[cragswinter]

I think the thing with the 123d is the diminishing returns on investment thing-they command quite a premium.

Something that can be bought for 10k & chipped to decent performance would work very well, even if it doesn't have the bigger brakes, oil cooling & shorter gear ratios of its bigger brother

[Flying machine]

I bought a 123 for a commuter car having looked at the 120 and 123. I bought the 123 because it felt smoother and a little quicker, possibly the feeling of the smaller turbo spinning up sooner? They're not that quick, but I do quite like it and it surprised me. As usual, best advice is to go and try both for yourself.

Oh, the other things that I noticed - 123's tend to have better spec and yes they are more expensive to buy as not as many around. My 123 gets 46.3 mpg - not reset since I bought it