Having a hard time with my first BMW (2008 E63 630i)
Discussion
Hi all,
I bought an approved used BMW 630i M Sport with around 74,000 miles on the clock from an approved network of BMW dealers whose name starts with an S and ends in ytner (I won't say which one) and it didn't look like an approved used car at all. The paint was destroyed and has thousands of swirl marks. The right side headlight washer cover is missing. The rear bumper is not aligned (car has been in a supermarket ding which one of previous owners sorted without insurance) and the interior looks worn. Needless to say, this car was not loved by its previous owners.
I took a chance on it because I was looking to get a 3 series on hire purchase and sourced a bunch of 325i and 330i M Sport models from 2008-2010. However, this one was lurking on the approved used search engine results for the same money as the 3 series and I thought it would be amazing to get myself into a 6 (I'm still quite young).
Anyway - I got there to have a look at it and had a good walk around and look inside. After a visit or two more, I decided to take a leap of faith. On the day I was meant to pick it up, the rear driver side Pirelli P Zero run flat was sunk to the floor. I mean... it was FLAT as a pancake. How on earth did they not notice this? It was sat under LED lights the entire time. Ridiculous really. Anyway the very first disagreement began there because they refused to replace the rear tyres in a pair. So after a week of messing me about with excuses like "our mechanics ordered our tyre the next day but they ordered the wrong brand" and "our delivery is delayed" I finally get the car delivered to my driveway while I was at work. I get home anxious - in both ways, good and bad. I wanted to see what I had gotten myself into, I wanted to learn how to drive a car that was 5 metres long (I was getting out of a MK4 Golf GTI to get into this overnight) and I also wanted to see what was wrong with the car and what I didn't like so much.
I put they key in and started it and it idled worse than a 80s lorry. The cabin was shaking uncontrollably. I took it down my road and the engine cut out at the lights. It had a colossal cold start misfire and rough engine idle (that hasn't gone away to this day). I didn't know as much as I do now but I took it back after a few days and they just put it down to the characteristics of the N53 engine. Another time I took it back, they replaced injector 1 and spark plug 1 and didn't replace all 6. I kept saying this isn't normal, it isn't supposed to rev by itself but they put it down to "BMW straight-6 engines normally putting these sensations and characteristics into the cabin".
Between those visits and today, it has been back twice for a gear lever replacement, once for a total iDrive replacement and various small visits to try and get stuff sorted. Mind you, I have an Approved Used warranty for a year (so until March 2019).
Here is my dilemma - I love the car. I really do. I tried to return it in the first two weeks and the guy who sold it to me turned ugly and started quoting a bunch of UK sales law quotes to me saying I can't give it back once I've entered a finance agreement. The car knocks and bangs, the engine idles like crap, I personally think it isn't making all of its power, the suspension is finished, the brakes are awful and the paint is in hideous condition. They refuse to open up the head/block, they refuse to replace more than 1 injector/1 spark plug and they always end up just giving my car back after "testing it" saying its fine.
I'm honestly at a loss because they haven't valued me as a customer at all and the engine is not in its best condition right now - I drive it every day and I'm scared of it. It gets through oil mighty fast as well. I haven't had it serviced in my ownership and I definitely cannot afford 6 injectors and for it to be compression tested so I am just driving it along with all its noises and roughness. The run-flat they replaced brand new at the beginning of my ownership is also punctured and I am filling it with air weekly.
Did I bite off more than I could chew with this 6 series? Yes. I wasn't ready for the costs. But should this have been my situation after buying a car that has been stamped approved used? Hell no.
Any advice would be appreciated. Is it even worth trying to look into everything? Will someone do it for a reasonable price? All these things have scared me sh*tless in my first half-year of BMW ownership.
I bought an approved used BMW 630i M Sport with around 74,000 miles on the clock from an approved network of BMW dealers whose name starts with an S and ends in ytner (I won't say which one) and it didn't look like an approved used car at all. The paint was destroyed and has thousands of swirl marks. The right side headlight washer cover is missing. The rear bumper is not aligned (car has been in a supermarket ding which one of previous owners sorted without insurance) and the interior looks worn. Needless to say, this car was not loved by its previous owners.
I took a chance on it because I was looking to get a 3 series on hire purchase and sourced a bunch of 325i and 330i M Sport models from 2008-2010. However, this one was lurking on the approved used search engine results for the same money as the 3 series and I thought it would be amazing to get myself into a 6 (I'm still quite young).
Anyway - I got there to have a look at it and had a good walk around and look inside. After a visit or two more, I decided to take a leap of faith. On the day I was meant to pick it up, the rear driver side Pirelli P Zero run flat was sunk to the floor. I mean... it was FLAT as a pancake. How on earth did they not notice this? It was sat under LED lights the entire time. Ridiculous really. Anyway the very first disagreement began there because they refused to replace the rear tyres in a pair. So after a week of messing me about with excuses like "our mechanics ordered our tyre the next day but they ordered the wrong brand" and "our delivery is delayed" I finally get the car delivered to my driveway while I was at work. I get home anxious - in both ways, good and bad. I wanted to see what I had gotten myself into, I wanted to learn how to drive a car that was 5 metres long (I was getting out of a MK4 Golf GTI to get into this overnight) and I also wanted to see what was wrong with the car and what I didn't like so much.
I put they key in and started it and it idled worse than a 80s lorry. The cabin was shaking uncontrollably. I took it down my road and the engine cut out at the lights. It had a colossal cold start misfire and rough engine idle (that hasn't gone away to this day). I didn't know as much as I do now but I took it back after a few days and they just put it down to the characteristics of the N53 engine. Another time I took it back, they replaced injector 1 and spark plug 1 and didn't replace all 6. I kept saying this isn't normal, it isn't supposed to rev by itself but they put it down to "BMW straight-6 engines normally putting these sensations and characteristics into the cabin".
Between those visits and today, it has been back twice for a gear lever replacement, once for a total iDrive replacement and various small visits to try and get stuff sorted. Mind you, I have an Approved Used warranty for a year (so until March 2019).
Here is my dilemma - I love the car. I really do. I tried to return it in the first two weeks and the guy who sold it to me turned ugly and started quoting a bunch of UK sales law quotes to me saying I can't give it back once I've entered a finance agreement. The car knocks and bangs, the engine idles like crap, I personally think it isn't making all of its power, the suspension is finished, the brakes are awful and the paint is in hideous condition. They refuse to open up the head/block, they refuse to replace more than 1 injector/1 spark plug and they always end up just giving my car back after "testing it" saying its fine.
I'm honestly at a loss because they haven't valued me as a customer at all and the engine is not in its best condition right now - I drive it every day and I'm scared of it. It gets through oil mighty fast as well. I haven't had it serviced in my ownership and I definitely cannot afford 6 injectors and for it to be compression tested so I am just driving it along with all its noises and roughness. The run-flat they replaced brand new at the beginning of my ownership is also punctured and I am filling it with air weekly.
Did I bite off more than I could chew with this 6 series? Yes. I wasn't ready for the costs. But should this have been my situation after buying a car that has been stamped approved used? Hell no.
Any advice would be appreciated. Is it even worth trying to look into everything? Will someone do it for a reasonable price? All these things have scared me sh*tless in my first half-year of BMW ownership.
Silverbullet767 said:
@Silverbullet767Unfortunately I have had the car since March and that is out of the question but I did raise this very point with evidence to the salesman and he ended up squashing it with approval from his manager. Since then, I have changed my contact there to two other people and they are who I tend to deal with whenever I have had issues.
UCZ15 said:
Silverbullet767 said:
@Silverbullet767Unfortunately I have had the car since March and that is out of the question but I did raise this very point with evidence to the salesman and he ended up squashing it with approval from his manager. Since then, I have changed my contact there to two other people and they are who I tend to deal with whenever I have had issues.
The Customer services manager for the UK (of Feb 2017, may have changed by now) is Daniel.Henderson@bmw.co.uk
OP, you've been treated in a shockingly poor way by the supplying dealer....in hindsight, you should have posted on here as soon as you had the first problems & you'd have been advised on what you needed to do/say. I hope you get your car sorted although I've had personal experience of a dealer trying to wriggle out of a BMW backed warranty claim on a used car due to "fair wear and tear".
I'd be straight on the phone to BMW, sod trying to talk to the dealer if that's their attitude. Make a log of everything that's happened, what's been done, how many times they've had it etc. If they've attempted to fix the same fault several times unsuccessfully you might actually get somewhere. Don't let them fob you off. Unfortunately the AUC scheme doesn't mean you'll get a good car - but you do get a decent warranty and the weight of BMW behind you to have a stern word with the supplying dealer. That's why you pay a premium.
I have a 2009 530i with the N53 at over 100K miles, they do clatter a bit at start up and the direct injection does make a tappity sound at idle if you have the bonnet open. Otherwise the engine in mine is smooth, quiet and free revving, taking it up through 6000rpm just sounds good, not like the engine is going to die. I have occasionally had to put up to a litre of oil in between services, but that can vary a lot from engine to engine I understand.
A compression test should not cost much, they can also suffer from carbon build up on the intakes, I've never checked mine, but one of those cheap Amazon/eBay endoscopes stuck down a plug hole might give you an idea if that is an issue.
ETA: Mine had all of the coil packs, injectors and hpfp replaced before I bought it.
A compression test should not cost much, they can also suffer from carbon build up on the intakes, I've never checked mine, but one of those cheap Amazon/eBay endoscopes stuck down a plug hole might give you an idea if that is an issue.
ETA: Mine had all of the coil packs, injectors and hpfp replaced before I bought it.
Edited by Toltec on Wednesday 28th November 17:38
I had a 2009 530i touring with the N53 engine bought from a main dealer in 2013. At first I had a lot of engine issues but once sorted the car ran okay. Unfortunately until I got BMW customer services involved my supplying dealer did not play ball. Your issue is almost certainly that all injectors need replacing although you may also have a HPFP on the way out. (I had both and many other bits replaced at circa 40K miles.. ) BMW will probably not do anything about the paint or interior but they should get the mechanicals sorted. Get them involved ASAP.
The car sounds like a heap of s
t, unfit for purpose.
I bought an AUC 8 Series 15-20 years ago from a shower in Coventry (now a S****r) and suspecting all was not well, got my local dealer to look over it. They found all manner of faults, put it right and charged BMW for the warranty work.
So, a trip to another dealer for a health check would be in order, presenting the findings to the tossers who sold you this pup.
t, unfit for purpose. I bought an AUC 8 Series 15-20 years ago from a shower in Coventry (now a S****r) and suspecting all was not well, got my local dealer to look over it. They found all manner of faults, put it right and charged BMW for the warranty work.
So, a trip to another dealer for a health check would be in order, presenting the findings to the tossers who sold you this pup.
bmwmike said:
They really are useless
N53 early injectors are made of chocolate. Latest are better and dealer shouldreplace all plugs, injectors, and coilpacks under AUC warranty.
Oil usage depends how much, they sometimes like a drop though mine uses very little.
U do understand warranty will only cover defective items- why would they replace all six injectors coils and plugs ? If it has a misfire then it will throw an engine light and the op hasn’t mentioned this. The engine might have an issue but even dealers cant blindly Chuck parts at it for no justified reason.N53 early injectors are made of chocolate. Latest are better and dealer shouldreplace all plugs, injectors, and coilpacks under AUC warranty.
Oil usage depends how much, they sometimes like a drop though mine uses very little.
Elliot2000 said:
bmwmike said:
They really are useless
N53 early injectors are made of chocolate. Latest are better and dealer shouldreplace all plugs, injectors, and coilpacks under AUC warranty.
Oil usage depends how much, they sometimes like a drop though mine uses very little.
U do understand warranty will only cover defective items- why would they replace all six injectors coils and plugs ? If it has a misfire then it will throw an engine light and the op hasn’t mentioned this. The engine might have an issue but even dealers cant blindly Chuck parts at it for no justified reason.N53 early injectors are made of chocolate. Latest are better and dealer shouldreplace all plugs, injectors, and coilpacks under AUC warranty.
Oil usage depends how much, they sometimes like a drop though mine uses very little.
The official fix if the injectors are older than index 11 is to replace ALL the injectors. If the car is under AUC warranty (?) and I'd understood it to be, then BMW need to follow BMW's fix and replace all the injectors plugs and coilpacks.
Case in point my own car which had two faulty injectors, they eventually replaced all six once the master technician had learned how to read the computer instructions.
Edit to add.. OP says car is under AUC warranty. You can take it to any BMW dealer doesn't have be the kwikfitner/shytner you bought it from.
Knocking and banging does not sound good. A misfire as prior poster says will throw a code and EML. Is EML lit? Can you get access to a code reader? Decent independent near by for a second opinion?
N53 - one of bmws great sixes IMO when they're running right but not for the faint hearted. I'd be leaning on that warranty asap but be armed with codes etc.
Edited by bmwmike on Wednesday 28th November 23:58
Elliot2000 said:
bmwmike said:
They really are useless
N53 early injectors are made of chocolate. Latest are better and dealer shouldreplace all plugs, injectors, and coilpacks under AUC warranty.
Oil usage depends how much, they sometimes like a drop though mine uses very little.
U do understand warranty will only cover defective items- why would they replace all six injectors coils and plugs ? If it has a misfire then it will throw an engine light and the op hasn’t mentioned this. The engine might have an issue but even dealers cant blindly Chuck parts at it for no justified reason.N53 early injectors are made of chocolate. Latest are better and dealer shouldreplace all plugs, injectors, and coilpacks under AUC warranty.
Oil usage depends how much, they sometimes like a drop though mine uses very little.
Regarding the engine light, my N53 330i was terrible for the first month I had it, but the engine light came on exactly twice, both times after leaving it shuddering away (like a washing machine with a brick in it) for a couple of minutes, then repeatedly revving it to the spot at about 1500rpm when it would always misfire. Nasty idle and misfires during driving appeared not to be enough to induce it. And once I'd figured out how to make the engine light happen, I took it to Sytner in Sheffield, and they did whatever they do to diagnose this stuff and immediately recommended the replacement of all 6 injectors.
But then, I didn't have a warranty, so their incentives were a bit different in my case...
(In the end, the dealer I bought mine from paid for the new injectors, plus coil packs, spark plugs, NOx sensor and fuel sensor. That was 1 year ago, and I've been happy with it since. So fingers crossed OP's story may have an OK ending too.)
Rejection now is futile.
This was 8 months ago and the OP is still using it!
Even if he gets to reject it, he WILL be charged up to 45p per mile for usage enjoyed so far.
That could get expensive quickly.
It's your car and you own it.
You may get somewhere with ongoing faults that can be proved were there at point of sale, but new problems are likely to be dismissed unless warranty will contribute in part or in full.
This was 8 months ago and the OP is still using it!
Even if he gets to reject it, he WILL be charged up to 45p per mile for usage enjoyed so far.
That could get expensive quickly.
It's your car and you own it.
You may get somewhere with ongoing faults that can be proved were there at point of sale, but new problems are likely to be dismissed unless warranty will contribute in part or in full.
AUC cars come with minimum one year comprehensive warranty. Faults don't need to he present at the time of sale. It's the equivalent of the mondial comprehensive warranty people on here bang on about so everything should he covered.
The challenge OP has is, seemingly, the same issue I've had with sytner which is that they are fking useless at working on anything other than bogo 2.0d machines.
OP needs to take it elsewhere.
The challenge OP has is, seemingly, the same issue I've had with sytner which is that they are f
king useless at working on anything other than bogo 2.0d machines.OP needs to take it elsewhere.
I had the similar rough running on my old N53 330i. Took ages to solve. Turns out that the injector reporting a fault is usually fine and is compensating for another duff one in the same bank. It’ll be injector 2 or 3 if injector 1 is giving a code.
I had it fixed and it ran as it should, then I swapped it for an N52 equipped car which was much nicer.
I had it fixed and it ran as it should, then I swapped it for an N52 equipped car which was much nicer.
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