Any oil experts here?
Discussion
I’ve got a 2006 E90 325i (6 cylinder, 2.5 litre petrol N52) which has just reached 150,000 miles.
I’m happy using 5w-30, which I’m inclined to change twice a year (every 6k miles or so).
I’m aware I should be using oil that meets BMW LL04 spec, but what are the implications of using something else?
Castrol Edge ‘M’ (£38) is marked as ACEA C3, BMW LL04 and a trio of MB specs too. This is the one I should be using.
What would happen if I used this instead?
Castrol Edge ‘LL’, also ACEA C3, a couple of MB, Porsche and a couple of VW specs, but £32 for 4L and not LL-04.
Option 3 is ‘Professional’ and Longlife III, again ACEA C3, good for VW and Porsche but not BMW. Cheaper at £25 for 5L.
The final option is cheapest at just £18.50 for 5L and is BMW LL-04 spec.
Can anyone explain why using any of the alternatives is a terrible idea or is it going to make almost no difference whatsoever?
I’m happy using 5w-30, which I’m inclined to change twice a year (every 6k miles or so).
I’m aware I should be using oil that meets BMW LL04 spec, but what are the implications of using something else?
Castrol Edge ‘M’ (£38) is marked as ACEA C3, BMW LL04 and a trio of MB specs too. This is the one I should be using.
What would happen if I used this instead?
Castrol Edge ‘LL’, also ACEA C3, a couple of MB, Porsche and a couple of VW specs, but £32 for 4L and not LL-04.
Option 3 is ‘Professional’ and Longlife III, again ACEA C3, good for VW and Porsche but not BMW. Cheaper at £25 for 5L.
The final option is cheapest at just £18.50 for 5L and is BMW LL-04 spec.
Can anyone explain why using any of the alternatives is a terrible idea or is it going to make almost no difference whatsoever?
That last one is the right spec. anyway.
I use this....
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ELF-5w-30-Fully-Synthet...
However, at 150k miles I would be using a 5w40 or 10w40.
Does it use any oil between services?
I use this....
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ELF-5w-30-Fully-Synthet...
However, at 150k miles I would be using a 5w40 or 10w40.
Does it use any oil between services?
This stuff is VAG own brand but is also BMW LL04 as well used it for years in my S8, RS6 and son's M140, M135 and RS3 and never had issues
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Quantum-Longlife-3-5W-3...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Quantum-Longlife-3-5W-3...
I have just changed mine for the third time since March. I do it every 7k miles, but it is a diesel and with EGRs, DPFs that can soot up more as the oil ages and timing chains that need lubricating etc. then I would rather keep changing it.
For the sake of £35 may as well.
£35 in oil for every £1000 worth of fuel hardly makes a difference.
Petrols I tend to just do every 12k or so.
For the sake of £35 may as well.
£35 in oil for every £1000 worth of fuel hardly makes a difference.
Petrols I tend to just do every 12k or so.
Pericoloso said:
Is it really necessary to change oil twice a year ?
A quality synthetic should still be in good condition to change annually and 12K.
I change mine 2-3 times a year without failA quality synthetic should still be in good condition to change annually and 12K.
I do low miles, c5k if that and would rather have fresh oil and filters in, that costs me less than half a tank of fuel, for peace of mind rather than running it until I maybe do a year with no change as I'll never get near the 'service mileage' recommended.
Fresh oil in the engine, regularly to me, makes a lot of sense. More so as it's really not expensive to do, more so if you do it DIY too
What overkill, 5 or 6k oil changes on a road car TDI.... Lol.
I do 5 or 6k oil changes and I track my car quite hard..7 or 8 days a year on average... still comes out fairly golden.
Short of doing an oil analysis it seems ok with that ;-)
Ok by all means if you feel better but don't be under any illusions it's better for your car, it's just worse for your wallet and your back
I use a high performance ester based oil, my personal choice is Millers nanodrive cfs+ and recently the nt+, i use 5w40.
Doesn't "meet" BMW LL04 but that doesn't mean it's not any good.........it's because Millers haven't paid the ridiculous cost to go through the
BMW testing....i've used Nanodrive for over 100k miles on a variety of cars, TDI and petrol, all turbocharged, and disassembled a 195k engine that I had run on Nanodrive for 75k, with zero visible wear.
Of course many "normal" oils would also likely have given the same results.
I do 5 or 6k oil changes and I track my car quite hard..7 or 8 days a year on average... still comes out fairly golden.
Short of doing an oil analysis it seems ok with that ;-)
Ok by all means if you feel better but don't be under any illusions it's better for your car, it's just worse for your wallet and your back
I use a high performance ester based oil, my personal choice is Millers nanodrive cfs+ and recently the nt+, i use 5w40.
Doesn't "meet" BMW LL04 but that doesn't mean it's not any good.........it's because Millers haven't paid the ridiculous cost to go through the
BMW testing....i've used Nanodrive for over 100k miles on a variety of cars, TDI and petrol, all turbocharged, and disassembled a 195k engine that I had run on Nanodrive for 75k, with zero visible wear.
Of course many "normal" oils would also likely have given the same results.
naturalaspiration said:
LL04 is relevant for Euro 4+ diesels with a DPF - low SAPS so won't clog it.
If you have no oil consumption then you can stick with the 5w-30, otherwise 5w-40, any LL-01 or 04. I would also recommend adding Ceratec.
Even though 5w40 provides better protection when hot?If you have no oil consumption then you can stick with the 5w-30, otherwise 5w-40, any LL-01 or 04. I would also recommend adding Ceratec.
All of the boys on the track time groups who track 330's, z4 30 etc, and even the m135/m140 group, all use 5w40.
Some interesting feedback and suggestions, for which I’m grateful.
In response, I’d estimate it uses around 1L every 1,000 miles, perhaps not quite that bad.
I’m still not sure what the implications are of using a non-compliant oil, can anyone help answer my original question? Thanks in advance
In response, I’d estimate it uses around 1L every 1,000 miles, perhaps not quite that bad.
I’m still not sure what the implications are of using a non-compliant oil, can anyone help answer my original question? Thanks in advance
xjay1337 said:
I use a high performance ester based oil, my personal choice is Millers nanodrive cfs+ and recently the nt+, i use 5w40.
Doesn't "meet" BMW LL04 but that doesn't mean it's not any good.........it's because Millers haven't paid the ridiculous cost to go through the
But that advice is not great as someone with a DPF, or even an EGR, shouldn't use it as it is not a low ash oil. You will block your DPF up far quicker using that than a LL04 spec. Doesn't "meet" BMW LL04 but that doesn't mean it's not any good.........it's because Millers haven't paid the ridiculous cost to go through the
Not saying you can't use an oil that is not LL04, but using an ACEA A3/B4 oil like that Millers will not do the car any favours if it has a DPF or EGR, if looking at that general spec it needs to be ACEA C1-5, or to meet the ultra clean burn regs, ideal for Euro 5 engines, ACEA E9.
Claude455 said:
Some interesting feedback and suggestions, for which I’m grateful.
In response, I’d estimate it uses around 1L every 1,000 miles, perhaps not quite that bad.
I’m still not sure what the implications are of using a non-compliant oil, can anyone help answer my original question? Thanks in advance
Just use the right oil. In response, I’d estimate it uses around 1L every 1,000 miles, perhaps not quite that bad.
I’m still not sure what the implications are of using a non-compliant oil, can anyone help answer my original question? Thanks in advance
I have linked to 20 litres of the stuff for under £50 delivered.
If you are using 1l every 1000 miles I would move to a 5w40, you may lose 1mpg, but it might help your engine at the mileage it is at.
Alpina recommend 10w60 when their N52 engines reached 150,000km, which is what? 90,000 miles.
Worth a watch, from 11mins especially.....
https://youtu.be/3gRhDKE8vKU?t=652
Edited by gizlaroc on Monday 4th November 19:55
I believe
Bmw now use shell oil, which can be had from opie oil (direct or eBay) for around £30-35 for 5l.
I used it in my n47 and my mums older n47 for several changes. Both cars don’t use a drop at 66k and 80k, so using the 5w30 seems fine.
I tend to do it annually or roughly 9-10k which is usually half the CDS schedule, vein hope it will keep the turbo’s and timing chain in check. Local indie who have quite presence on the f30 forums do a lot of the dreaded timing chain repair/replacements and they said you could do a lot worse than more frequent oil changes. Having said this, quite a few cars they se have missed 2 or even thre services, so potentially 50-60k on the oil they got shipped with! It ain’t pretty when you see the sludge and metal shaving built up, let alone worn bottom ends etc.
Never judge a turbo car on oil colour though, the Americans love the whole dark oil is the devil’s work. Especially a diesel, it will be black in about 100 miles!
The quantum stuff kindly listed above is sworn by in the vw community, and its pretty responsibly priced.
Euro parts own brand triple x is rated for bmw LL04 too, and allegedly produced by shell, not impossible but don’t take my word for it. Even the bottles look similar.
Or if want certainty, spend £10 more and get shell.
I doubt any are that bad tbh, all fully synth.
Bmw now use shell oil, which can be had from opie oil (direct or eBay) for around £30-35 for 5l.
I used it in my n47 and my mums older n47 for several changes. Both cars don’t use a drop at 66k and 80k, so using the 5w30 seems fine.
I tend to do it annually or roughly 9-10k which is usually half the CDS schedule, vein hope it will keep the turbo’s and timing chain in check. Local indie who have quite presence on the f30 forums do a lot of the dreaded timing chain repair/replacements and they said you could do a lot worse than more frequent oil changes. Having said this, quite a few cars they se have missed 2 or even thre services, so potentially 50-60k on the oil they got shipped with! It ain’t pretty when you see the sludge and metal shaving built up, let alone worn bottom ends etc.
Never judge a turbo car on oil colour though, the Americans love the whole dark oil is the devil’s work. Especially a diesel, it will be black in about 100 miles!
The quantum stuff kindly listed above is sworn by in the vw community, and its pretty responsibly priced.
Euro parts own brand triple x is rated for bmw LL04 too, and allegedly produced by shell, not impossible but don’t take my word for it. Even the bottles look similar.
Or if want certainty, spend £10 more and get shell.
I doubt any are that bad tbh, all fully synth.
gizlaroc said:
But that advice is not great as someone with a DPF, or even an EGR, shouldn't use it as it is not a low ash oil. You will block your DPF up far quicker using that than a LL04 spec.
Not saying you can't use an oil that is not LL04, but using an ACEA A3/B4 oil like that Millers will not do the car any favours if it has a DPF or EGR, if looking at that general spec it needs to be ACEA C1-5, or to meet the ultra clean burn regs, ideal for Euro 5 engines, ACEA E9.
Maybe, I had Millers Nanodrive in a DPF equipped Scirocco for 8k and noticed no extra DPF sooting (I monitied live using custom dash software)Not saying you can't use an oil that is not LL04, but using an ACEA A3/B4 oil like that Millers will not do the car any favours if it has a DPF or EGR, if looking at that general spec it needs to be ACEA C1-5, or to meet the ultra clean burn regs, ideal for Euro 5 engines, ACEA E9.
I suspect if you aren't doing just town driving it's not a problem but admittedly I do not know that much about oil and DPF usage.
xjay1337 said:
naturalaspiration said:
LL04 is relevant for Euro 4+ diesels with a DPF - low SAPS so won't clog it.
If you have no oil consumption then you can stick with the 5w-30, otherwise 5w-40, any LL-01 or 04. I would also recommend adding Ceratec.
Even though 5w40 provides better protection when hot?If you have no oil consumption then you can stick with the 5w-30, otherwise 5w-40, any LL-01 or 04. I would also recommend adding Ceratec.
All of the boys on the track time groups who track 330's, z4 30 etc, and even the m135/m140 group, all use 5w40.
Look at "Smith & Allan" lubricants, I have started buying 20L containers of LL04 for £48 delivered!!! Last me for 3 oil changes.
https://www.smithandallan.com/
Change it into used 5L bottle when oil change comes around, job done!
I stopped spending ££££'s on branded oil years ago, no issues in my cars (high mileage N47's) oil changed every 8/10k
https://www.smithandallan.com/
Change it into used 5L bottle when oil change comes around, job done!
I stopped spending ££££'s on branded oil years ago, no issues in my cars (high mileage N47's) oil changed every 8/10k
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