335D....Shoud I?
Discussion
Yes, I've seen a few of those on eBay. Anything with Bazza alloys or tinted windows I won't touch either.
Most of the 335's I've seen have been the MSport variety. I'll have a look on Autotrader as I've only been using eBay so far.
Is it true that you should avoid the non LCi models? Because they don't seem to be in this price bracket....
Most of the 335's I've seen have been the MSport variety. I'll have a look on Autotrader as I've only been using eBay so far.
Is it true that you should avoid the non LCi models? Because they don't seem to be in this price bracket....
LCI is basically the September 2008 update that nassibyl improved the iDrive and brought some other tweaks. If the car doesn't have the iDrive it wouldn't be such a problem to have a pre LCI, but just bear in mind that they are now older cars so will need to have been maintained well. My 2009 335i needed quite a lot of money over the three years I had it and a lot of that could apply to the 335d too.
MikeM6 said:
LCI is basically the September 2008 update that nassibyl improved the iDrive and brought some other tweaks. If the car doesn't have the iDrive it wouldn't be such a problem to have a pre LCI, but just bear in mind that they are now older cars so will need to have been maintained well. My 2009 335i needed quite a lot of money over the three years I had it and a lot of that could apply to the 335d too.
LCI update on the F30 was in 2016 model year. Major suspension tweaks. See herehttps://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Pica-Pica said:
MikeM6 said:
LCI is basically the September 2008 update that nassibyl improved the iDrive and brought some other tweaks. If the car doesn't have the iDrive it wouldn't be such a problem to have a pre LCI, but just bear in mind that they are now older cars so will need to have been maintained well. My 2009 335i needed quite a lot of money over the three years I had it and a lot of that could apply to the 335d too.
LCI update on the F30 was in 2016 model year. Major suspension tweaks. See herehttps://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
MikeM6 said:
Pica-Pica said:
MikeM6 said:
LCI is basically the September 2008 update that nassibyl improved the iDrive and brought some other tweaks. If the car doesn't have the iDrive it wouldn't be such a problem to have a pre LCI, but just bear in mind that they are now older cars so will need to have been maintained well. My 2009 335i needed quite a lot of money over the three years I had it and a lot of that could apply to the 335d too.
LCI update on the F30 was in 2016 model year. Major suspension tweaks. See herehttps://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
BFleming said:
Go for it. They're all automatic, a lot at that price are the SE's, so don't feel that special. A lot are (IMO) tarted up with rep wheels, lowering kits and tints - the type I'd avoid, but each to their own. Find one, have a drive, and see what you think!
A lot of SE models have the M-Sport suspension, so they drive just like the M-Sport models. Had two in the past.The E90/1/2/3 335ds are great. Very reliable M57 engine. The autobox gives the occasional problem. Standard sport suspension has a very hard ride and gives adequate rather than good body control, worse than a well looked after E46. Mpg is ok.
Brakes are good. I haven’t driven a non sport 335d.
Brakes are good. I haven’t driven a non sport 335d.
Do it, I love mine. It took me ages to find the spec/low miles that I wanted but they're such a complete daily car. Big boot, toys, comfy, still look modern and proper Q Car pace with a map. Mine's a late '12 LCI so I paid almost as much as a ropey F31 but I preferred the E91 and the M57 is a lot more reliable than the N57 in the F Series 330/335ds.
They're very sensitive to bad tyres too btw, I run PS4s but I've driven some that felt borderline dangerous on cheaper rubber. M57 engines are solid, just check the water temps since they have two thermostats and failing stats can lead to DPF issues/no regen etc. Glow plug modules tend to let go also, leaving you with a smoky/lumpy cold start that could look worse than the £60 fix that it is.
Mine:
They're very sensitive to bad tyres too btw, I run PS4s but I've driven some that felt borderline dangerous on cheaper rubber. M57 engines are solid, just check the water temps since they have two thermostats and failing stats can lead to DPF issues/no regen etc. Glow plug modules tend to let go also, leaving you with a smoky/lumpy cold start that could look worse than the £60 fix that it is.
Mine:
Thanks Helix, I'll have a Google and see what turns up. Will a healthy box change up gear with a light foot to give an economical return if the mood takes me? Or do they hang on to gears? Sorry, not driven an auto for over 15 years.
That is a lovely car Chris. Bit out of my price range.
I was wondering about an estate version, but I've been so used to the easy parking of a VW Golf, I'm not sure I could live with such a big car. The practicality is a big temptation though.
That is a lovely car Chris. Bit out of my price range.
I was wondering about an estate version, but I've been so used to the easy parking of a VW Golf, I'm not sure I could live with such a big car. The practicality is a big temptation though.
Estate is no bigger bumper to bumper.
Gearbox should not hold onto gears, should also change with no flaring (slight rev rise as it does) However, the ZF6 is pretty damned tough, and a complete fluid change and resetting the adaptions will get it feeling like new.
Worse case is some new solenoids, but reality is most change them when not needed. It obviously sorts issues because reset the adaptations after solenoid change, but the adaption reset would have been enough.
You don't really need to change the sump/filter either, but every one does.
£70 of ATF55 and a reset has sorted every single ZF6 I have ever worked on, even on Discos with 170k miles on the original oil.
The M57 is pretty tough too.
I always remove any swirflaps, new thermostat put on a new EGR and change oil every 8-10k, plus add in some Archoil 6300 and they run like new.
The thermostats, main and egr, are VERY important.
If they are bot getting to 78ºc the car will not regen the dpf, and if they are shot it won't get to the needed 94ºc while it regens it will not complete.
While it does this the car is using loads of fuel, feels gruff and is down on power, feels proper sluggish. Oh, and then you get Blocked DPF warnings and garages, and even main dealers, telling you that a new DPF is needed, it is b
ks, new thermostat sorts it 99% of the time and within an hour of fitting it.
Glow plugs need to be working as well, or at least 4 of them, but the glow plug controller fails on these as they get older, so if the glow plug light doesn't go out read the codes, I would just put on a new controller for £60-70 and scan again if the light doesn't go out, probably 1 or 2 plugs gone at most.
Having said all that, the 330i is better.
I swapped my 335d for a 335i when I had one back in 2006, but being realistic, I think I would feel safer running a 10 year old 100k mile 330d or 335d cost wise.
Budget for 4 matching, proper tyres, not run flats, they completely ruin the E90/91/92.
And when you get to 330/335d you do want matching front and rear tyres, or make damed sure they are very closely matched tread wise, they can become a twitchy mess with different treads front and rear.
Suspenion on these can be shagged, top mounts go quickly, pain to fit. front lower control arms also go a lot along with drop links. If still on run flats you can bet the suspension needs sorting.
Meyle do a complete front axle control arm set or around £250, well worth considering with new dampers and top mounts. It really does make a hell of a difference.
I reckon most of the E90/91 cars will need £1000-1500 spending on them to get them feeling how they can feel now. Personally I would rather buy one at £5k and spend £1000 on it.
The E91 is a great car, nice steering feel and a pleasure to drive, but they are 9-15 years old and most owners have either had them so long they haven't noticed them deteriorate over time, or they have never felt what a brand new one feels like. And when they are new and off the dreaded run flats they are superb.
Bit too much rebound on the dampers, but get a decent tyre on it and that is hidden really well. Put Bilsteins on, or Koni FSD for a bit more comfort, and the car is had to beat imho.
Still prefer the 330i though.
Gearbox should not hold onto gears, should also change with no flaring (slight rev rise as it does) However, the ZF6 is pretty damned tough, and a complete fluid change and resetting the adaptions will get it feeling like new.
Worse case is some new solenoids, but reality is most change them when not needed. It obviously sorts issues because reset the adaptations after solenoid change, but the adaption reset would have been enough.
You don't really need to change the sump/filter either, but every one does.
£70 of ATF55 and a reset has sorted every single ZF6 I have ever worked on, even on Discos with 170k miles on the original oil.
The M57 is pretty tough too.
I always remove any swirflaps, new thermostat put on a new EGR and change oil every 8-10k, plus add in some Archoil 6300 and they run like new.
The thermostats, main and egr, are VERY important.
If they are bot getting to 78ºc the car will not regen the dpf, and if they are shot it won't get to the needed 94ºc while it regens it will not complete.
While it does this the car is using loads of fuel, feels gruff and is down on power, feels proper sluggish. Oh, and then you get Blocked DPF warnings and garages, and even main dealers, telling you that a new DPF is needed, it is b
ks, new thermostat sorts it 99% of the time and within an hour of fitting it. Glow plugs need to be working as well, or at least 4 of them, but the glow plug controller fails on these as they get older, so if the glow plug light doesn't go out read the codes, I would just put on a new controller for £60-70 and scan again if the light doesn't go out, probably 1 or 2 plugs gone at most.
Having said all that, the 330i is better.
I swapped my 335d for a 335i when I had one back in 2006, but being realistic, I think I would feel safer running a 10 year old 100k mile 330d or 335d cost wise.
Budget for 4 matching, proper tyres, not run flats, they completely ruin the E90/91/92.
And when you get to 330/335d you do want matching front and rear tyres, or make damed sure they are very closely matched tread wise, they can become a twitchy mess with different treads front and rear.
Suspenion on these can be shagged, top mounts go quickly, pain to fit. front lower control arms also go a lot along with drop links. If still on run flats you can bet the suspension needs sorting.
Meyle do a complete front axle control arm set or around £250, well worth considering with new dampers and top mounts. It really does make a hell of a difference.
I reckon most of the E90/91 cars will need £1000-1500 spending on them to get them feeling how they can feel now. Personally I would rather buy one at £5k and spend £1000 on it.
The E91 is a great car, nice steering feel and a pleasure to drive, but they are 9-15 years old and most owners have either had them so long they haven't noticed them deteriorate over time, or they have never felt what a brand new one feels like. And when they are new and off the dreaded run flats they are superb.
Bit too much rebound on the dampers, but get a decent tyre on it and that is hidden really well. Put Bilsteins on, or Koni FSD for a bit more comfort, and the car is had to beat imho.
Still prefer the 330i though.
Guy, thank you for the detailed reply. I'm surprised and happy to hear the touring is the same size as the saloon. I'll be casting my net wider.
After a quick look on ebay there's only 1 within my budget. A 2009 140k tourer SE, one owner and FSH.
With regard to the rest of your post - the thermostat thing is good to know, thanks. Happy to hear about the box not being too much of a worry. I'm handy with the spanners and have rebuilt a 4.5 Rover V8 from scratch. So doing the necessary to make a 335d the way it should be won't daunt me.
I will reply to your post in full as I need to turn in, early AM start tomorrow.
Regards
Cad
After a quick look on ebay there's only 1 within my budget. A 2009 140k tourer SE, one owner and FSH.
With regard to the rest of your post - the thermostat thing is good to know, thanks. Happy to hear about the box not being too much of a worry. I'm handy with the spanners and have rebuilt a 4.5 Rover V8 from scratch. So doing the necessary to make a 335d the way it should be won't daunt me.
I will reply to your post in full as I need to turn in, early AM start tomorrow.
Regards
Cad
Ironically I was in a similar boat to you a few months ago, although my budget did allow me to go to a somewhat higher price if I wanted, having driven more than a few cars and done my digging, I ended up going down a somewhat alternate route.
The E90 330 and 335d's I tried simply didn't feel special inside and the ride/handling whilst ok, seemed to mostly depend on whether it was on runflats or not.
I then thought, why not go back to an E46 and spend some money ensuring it was pukka, but given that I wanted more like 335d pace and a remap was therefore going to be essential, it had to be the 6 speed manual, as the E46 autobox makes it notoriously thirsty and also is a bit like chocolate by all accounts and will get destroyed with a remap added.
I went round looking at lots of different options and had almost given up on finding something I liked, when I by pure chance stumbled across an "expensive £5k in Aug 2019)" low miles 330CD with the 6 speed manul on an 05 plate.
Given that ideally I wanted an estate, I um'd and err'd and went and drove it, full history 69k miles on the clock, all things like swirl flaps, lower wishbone bushes etc all sorted out.
I have to say I loved it, the interior was so much nicer the E90's I'd seen, the drive was so much more analogue and tactile, plus although Msport spec, the ride was fine and the handling was good.
So I bought it and for 3 months, it didn't do many miles as we still had our old car till then.
It's been checked over by BMS surrey, who reckon it's the nicest one they've seen in more than a few years and today it's having the Alpine replacement head unit fitted to give me up to date sat nav, blue tooth etc. A few weeks ago I decided (with some trepidation) to buy it a Racechip tuning box after umming and erring about a remap vs a box. Ultimately I chose the box to give me variety of options on pace vs economy and also as the box (due to lower max torque) is less likely to cause clutch and DMF issues
I fricking love this car now, I look forward to driving it (even on the M25), the box makes a night and day difference to throttle response, MPG and power, most of the time I drive around in sport mode doing circa 42-44mpg, but when I want to go, it goes like stink.
But basically I looked at it from the perspective, of.
Option 1 - 335d, will struggle to find a spec/car I'm happy with and it's either going to be cheap and therefore a bit of a "hope I got a good one" or I would have to pay much more and I'd still have a car that I don't love the look of and where I'd probably have to do things like drop the run flats and maybe get some suspension work done to get the ride/handling balance I want.
Option 2 - Go for a mint E46, spend a little money on it and have a car that's older, but looks special, that drives special, goes nearly as well and has pretty much hit the bottom of the depreciation curve if I look after it.
I went E46 and so far do not regret it even slightly.
The E90 330 and 335d's I tried simply didn't feel special inside and the ride/handling whilst ok, seemed to mostly depend on whether it was on runflats or not.
I then thought, why not go back to an E46 and spend some money ensuring it was pukka, but given that I wanted more like 335d pace and a remap was therefore going to be essential, it had to be the 6 speed manual, as the E46 autobox makes it notoriously thirsty and also is a bit like chocolate by all accounts and will get destroyed with a remap added.
I went round looking at lots of different options and had almost given up on finding something I liked, when I by pure chance stumbled across an "expensive £5k in Aug 2019)" low miles 330CD with the 6 speed manul on an 05 plate.
Given that ideally I wanted an estate, I um'd and err'd and went and drove it, full history 69k miles on the clock, all things like swirl flaps, lower wishbone bushes etc all sorted out.
I have to say I loved it, the interior was so much nicer the E90's I'd seen, the drive was so much more analogue and tactile, plus although Msport spec, the ride was fine and the handling was good.
So I bought it and for 3 months, it didn't do many miles as we still had our old car till then.
It's been checked over by BMS surrey, who reckon it's the nicest one they've seen in more than a few years and today it's having the Alpine replacement head unit fitted to give me up to date sat nav, blue tooth etc. A few weeks ago I decided (with some trepidation) to buy it a Racechip tuning box after umming and erring about a remap vs a box. Ultimately I chose the box to give me variety of options on pace vs economy and also as the box (due to lower max torque) is less likely to cause clutch and DMF issues
I fricking love this car now, I look forward to driving it (even on the M25), the box makes a night and day difference to throttle response, MPG and power, most of the time I drive around in sport mode doing circa 42-44mpg, but when I want to go, it goes like stink.
But basically I looked at it from the perspective, of.
Option 1 - 335d, will struggle to find a spec/car I'm happy with and it's either going to be cheap and therefore a bit of a "hope I got a good one" or I would have to pay much more and I'd still have a car that I don't love the look of and where I'd probably have to do things like drop the run flats and maybe get some suspension work done to get the ride/handling balance I want.
Option 2 - Go for a mint E46, spend a little money on it and have a car that's older, but looks special, that drives special, goes nearly as well and has pretty much hit the bottom of the depreciation curve if I look after it.
I went E46 and so far do not regret it even slightly.
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