Discussion
Any suggestions as to what would make an E36 handle like a bowling ball?
I’ve picked up a 318is, and there doesn’t seem to be any movement in any of the ball joints or bushes, but the handling, especially in the wet, is awful. It self steers and tramlines all over the place, and wants to take its own direction when you accelerate.
It doesn’t track straight, but I don’t want to waste money doing geo if it then needs new bits.
I was thinking of replacing all four dampers - do you think this will fix it?
I’ve picked up a 318is, and there doesn’t seem to be any movement in any of the ball joints or bushes, but the handling, especially in the wet, is awful. It self steers and tramlines all over the place, and wants to take its own direction when you accelerate.
It doesn’t track straight, but I don’t want to waste money doing geo if it then needs new bits.
I was thinking of replacing all four dampers - do you think this will fix it?
Top shock mounting points are a weak point on E36s. I noticed quite a difference when I beefed the mounts up on my old car; this was a car that had just had new shocks, springs fitted and all the tired bushes replaced. I used Rogue mounts on mine but E46 convertible mounts with Z3 reinforcement plates appear to be a popular solution.
Thread about it here https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=51...
Thread about it here https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=51...
I doubt it's dampers. They would give a floaty, crashy ride more than anything else. If they are visibly leaking and just really old and crusty then they're due for replacement anyway.
I would be looking at the rear trailing arm bushes but again, really worn ones give a knock as the trailing arm itself clouts the body.
I've had more than one knackered steering rack give these symptoms. The car feels like it's on ice and really unpredictable. There's no play in the rack but the car just feels horrible to drive. It's due to the valves sticking in the hydro unit and giving too much assistance to one side all the time. Luckily it's a cheap fix - an E46 purple tag rack is 50 quid, they never go wrong and can be fitted in around an hour on a ramp.
If you're really flush, a Z3 rack (100 quid plus) is even better.
I would be looking at the rear trailing arm bushes but again, really worn ones give a knock as the trailing arm itself clouts the body.
I've had more than one knackered steering rack give these symptoms. The car feels like it's on ice and really unpredictable. There's no play in the rack but the car just feels horrible to drive. It's due to the valves sticking in the hydro unit and giving too much assistance to one side all the time. Luckily it's a cheap fix - an E46 purple tag rack is 50 quid, they never go wrong and can be fitted in around an hour on a ramp.
If you're really flush, a Z3 rack (100 quid plus) is even better.
Thanks for the advice, folks!
I put it in for MOT and it was advised on RTABs on both sides, so I’m going to replace them, get it tracked, and a pair of new front boots.
It’s a standard car with sport suspension and 16” style 30s. I don’t want to lower it so I would rather avoid tjeB12 kit. I want it to drive like it did when it was new!
I’ll see how I get on!
I put it in for MOT and it was advised on RTABs on both sides, so I’m going to replace them, get it tracked, and a pair of new front boots.
It’s a standard car with sport suspension and 16” style 30s. I don’t want to lower it so I would rather avoid tjeB12 kit. I want it to drive like it did when it was new!
I’ll see how I get on!
Touring442 said:
I doubt it's dampers. They would give a floaty, crashy ride more than anything else. If they are visibly leaking and just really old and crusty then they're due for replacement anyway.
I would be looking at the rear trailing arm bushes but again, really worn ones give a knock as the trailing arm itself clouts the body.
I've had more than one knackered steering rack give these symptoms. The car feels like it's on ice and really unpredictable. There's no play in the rack but the car just feels horrible to drive. It's due to the valves sticking in the hydro unit and giving too much assistance to one side all the time. Luckily it's a cheap fix - an E46 purple tag rack is 50 quid, they never go wrong and can be fitted in around an hour on a ramp.
If you're really flush, a Z3 rack (100 quid plus) is even better.
I think I will do this mod, it also needs the PAS cooler pipe replacing as it is wholly made of rust.I would be looking at the rear trailing arm bushes but again, really worn ones give a knock as the trailing arm itself clouts the body.
I've had more than one knackered steering rack give these symptoms. The car feels like it's on ice and really unpredictable. There's no play in the rack but the car just feels horrible to drive. It's due to the valves sticking in the hydro unit and giving too much assistance to one side all the time. Luckily it's a cheap fix - an E46 purple tag rack is 50 quid, they never go wrong and can be fitted in around an hour on a ramp.
If you're really flush, a Z3 rack (100 quid plus) is even better.
Ok so I’ve done a few things and the car is better, but what to try next.
RTABs have been replaced, so the car no longer feels like the rear wants to add its own steering inputs.
The steering column bearings have been rebuilt which has improved steering linearity and got rid of the horrid scraping sound.
The tracking has been done, and all the joints and bushes have been examined and given the green light.
There’s some misting on a front damper, and the front tyres are due for replacement, but I’ve not addressed either. I took the car out for a shakedown last night and it is still not much of a handler - it takes a lot of concentration to keep the car under control, especially on poor surfaces. Motorway lane 1 ruts make it tramline violently. The car bump tests okay at the front, so I thought I might do tyres now, then dampers in a few months.
Opinions welcome!
RTABs have been replaced, so the car no longer feels like the rear wants to add its own steering inputs.
The steering column bearings have been rebuilt which has improved steering linearity and got rid of the horrid scraping sound.
The tracking has been done, and all the joints and bushes have been examined and given the green light.
There’s some misting on a front damper, and the front tyres are due for replacement, but I’ve not addressed either. I took the car out for a shakedown last night and it is still not much of a handler - it takes a lot of concentration to keep the car under control, especially on poor surfaces. Motorway lane 1 ruts make it tramline violently. The car bump tests okay at the front, so I thought I might do tyres now, then dampers in a few months.
Opinions welcome!
Only had an E36 compact, and my E46, but the latter is sensitive to tyres for tramlining. Miss matched or low tread can have a significant effect.
As said, dampers is more feeling like a jelly over bumps thann tramlining, but I put a set of Bilstien B4's and Eibachs on the E34 as a reasonably cost effective, but also not unbranded arse, oem-ish sort of setup and am perfectly happy with them.
Daniel
As said, dampers is more feeling like a jelly over bumps thann tramlining, but I put a set of Bilstien B4's and Eibachs on the E34 as a reasonably cost effective, but also not unbranded arse, oem-ish sort of setup and am perfectly happy with them.
Daniel
The next step will be to replace the suspension Bilstein B12 kit around £700. is a good option without looking lowered. Also replace front lower control arm bushing.(poly will give much more direct feel to front end) then full alignment.
As for tyres i have these in 16 inch Hankook Ventus Prime 3 K125 best tyres ive had on the car in the 23 years ive owned it
As for tyres i have these in 16 inch Hankook Ventus Prime 3 K125 best tyres ive had on the car in the 23 years ive owned it
Edited by Ciff on Tuesday 1st September 14:49
Edited by Ciff on Tuesday 1st September 14:56
Edited by Ciff on Tuesday 1st September 14:57
Edited by Ciff on Tuesday 1st September 14:59
I presume the assumption is that a 'new' E36 has reasonable handling? If that is the case then there should be no need for polybushing anything.
Obviously expecting a 25yo car to handle like it did when it was new is still a reasonable ask especially as a lot of the parts available now can be of mixed quality. Hence there may be some scope for 'aftermarket' parts. However I would tend to focus on good quality 'oem spec' parts rather than improvements if I could. My intention with the E46 was to fit OEM dampers, however I couldn't find any for the sport and advise was to deviate.
Equally it is also worth considering that even when factory fresh, the handling of an E36 was nothing like that of a modern car. It won't handle like a hot hatch on low profile tyres ever, which is part of the appeal to many, but you could spent ten grand on new components trying and still fail there.
Daniel
Obviously expecting a 25yo car to handle like it did when it was new is still a reasonable ask especially as a lot of the parts available now can be of mixed quality. Hence there may be some scope for 'aftermarket' parts. However I would tend to focus on good quality 'oem spec' parts rather than improvements if I could. My intention with the E46 was to fit OEM dampers, however I couldn't find any for the sport and advise was to deviate.
Equally it is also worth considering that even when factory fresh, the handling of an E36 was nothing like that of a modern car. It won't handle like a hot hatch on low profile tyres ever, which is part of the appeal to many, but you could spent ten grand on new components trying and still fail there.
Daniel
dhutch said:
I presume the assumption is that a 'new' E36 has reasonable handling? If that is the case then there should be no need for polybushing anything.
Obviously expecting a 25yo car to handle like it did when it was new is still a reasonable ask especially as a lot of the parts available now can be of mixed quality. Hence there may be some scope for 'aftermarket' parts. However I would tend to focus on good quality 'oem spec' parts rather than improvements if I could. My intention with the E46 was to fit OEM dampers, however I couldn't find any for the sport and advise was to deviate.
Equally it is also worth considering that even when factory fresh, the handling of an E36 was nothing like that of a modern car. It won't handle like a hot hatch on low profile tyres ever, which is part of the appeal to many, but you could spent ten grand on new components trying and still fail there.
Daniel
All good points.Obviously expecting a 25yo car to handle like it did when it was new is still a reasonable ask especially as a lot of the parts available now can be of mixed quality. Hence there may be some scope for 'aftermarket' parts. However I would tend to focus on good quality 'oem spec' parts rather than improvements if I could. My intention with the E46 was to fit OEM dampers, however I couldn't find any for the sport and advise was to deviate.
Equally it is also worth considering that even when factory fresh, the handling of an E36 was nothing like that of a modern car. It won't handle like a hot hatch on low profile tyres ever, which is part of the appeal to many, but you could spent ten grand on new components trying and still fail there.
Daniel
I had a couple of E36s when they were newer and they drove very well indeed. I want my 318is to drive like it did when it was new(ish).
I can get Bilstein b4 dampers for it; which might be a good idea as a way to achieve this.
I probably won’t poly bush anything as I don’t need to turn it into a really focused handler, although I do accept that the b12 coilover kit would be a good option it’s probably a step too far - was really don’t want to lower the car.
fozzymandeus said:
There’s some misting on a front damper
Opinions welcome!
So a damper has pissed some/all its oil out. They don't work too well after that.....Opinions welcome!
If one had gone (likely) then it'll handle like a three legged bar stool.
If they are original, they are likely knackered even if not leaking. The number of struts I've replaced that, when removed are utterly shagged - the damper rod just drops into the body with no resistance.
100,000 miles and dampers are generally finished.
Gassing Station | BMW General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff