G20 WIndscreen Replacement - non OEM glass

[sharepointalex]

Just had my windscreen replaced on my M340 by Autoglass due to a large scratch (done through Insurance). I assumed as the car as a HUD and cameras it would be OEM glass.

I've just picked the car up and the glass is labeled Pilkington but there is no BMW stamp.

On the drive home it seems as if the HUD is a bit blurry, it's really hard to tell to be honest - as to whether it's just all in my head or it's different than before.

I did have to use the rotation option to rotate it as the HUD was wonky and slanted - this did not happen on the OEM glass before!

Tempted to ring the insurance up and ask for it to be replaced with OEM glass.

Thoughts?

Has anyone else been in a similar position?

I also read something about the BMW new car warranty being invalid if you don't fit OEM glass - is that correct?

Thanks

[drdino]

HUD glass is different to non-HUD glass. The former has the laminated layers at an angle to each other (like this: /I\ ) while the latter has them in parallel ( III ). Failure to replace it with the correct type results in what you describe, fuzzy/blurry artifacts as the image is not aligned correctly to your point of view.

Here's an example of the image with a non-HUD windscreen:

[sharepointalex]

drdino said:

HUD glass is different to non-HUD glass. The former has the the laminated layers at an angle to each other (like this: /I\ ) while the latter has them in parallel ( III ). Failure to replace it with the correct type results in what you describe, fuzzy/blurry artifacts as the image is not aligned correctly to your point of view.

Here's an example of the image with a non-HUD windscreen:

Thanks - I'm sure it's HUD glass. I don't quite have an affect like that. Perhaps to most eyes it would look fine it just seems a little blurry around the edges that's all. And the fact that I had to rotate the HUD seemed odd to me.

[Wills2]

I had an issue with autoglass when they came round with a pattern glass replacement for my M3 it was still under warranty so I insisted on a BMW screen (I had HUD as well) the fitter was a pain in the arse and walked off in a huff but after speaking to the office they sent out another guy with the right glass, call them up and explain.

[g3org3y]

Pilkington is OEM supplier IIRC.

[aponting389]

I’ve had this too on my F90 M5. the glass supplier being adamant that the only difference between OEM and non-OEM being the BMW badge stamped on the glass. However they couldn’t configure the pedestrian safety cameras when they fitted the non-OEM glass so the begrudgingly fitted the BMW stamped windscreen and lo and behold, the cameras were fine. They remained adamant the glass was identical....?

[Qwerty911]

Non OEM glass should be fine. If the new screen is blurry it’s more likely to be the wrong version. There are numerous different versions for some cars, incl BMW; heated, HUB, different cameras, heat reflective etc, all in different combos.

[55palfers]

g3org3y said:

Pilkington is OEM supplier IIRC.

Back in the day it was Triplex

[Glassman]

g3org3y said:

Pilkington is OEM supplier IIRC.

Yes, but the OE version is not usually the same as the non. Often manufactured differently, using different components and even produced in a different country. Pilkington is Chinese-owned (Nippon Sheet Glass) and their acquisitions have made them a global concern.

[Glassman]

sharepointalex said:

Thanks - I'm sure it's HUD glass. I don't quite have an affect like that. Perhaps to most eyes it would look fine it just seems a little blurry around the edges that's all. And the fact that I had to rotate the HUD seemed odd to me.

The difference in screens is that the HUD version has a 'wedge piece' in the interlayer where the image is projected onto. This wedge piece makes all the difference. The OE parts will be precise and manufactured to a blueprint owned by BMW. Anything without the BMW logo will not be the same quality.

If it's not a HUD screen, you will still see the projected data but the image will have a 'ghosting' shadow behind it.

For cars under warranty, if there is an issue with anything attached/connected to the windscreen, you may not be covered as most dealers will kick it out if they see a non-genuine part is in the equation.

[g3org3y]

Glassman said:

g3org3y said:

Pilkington is OEM supplier IIRC.

Yes, but the OE version is not usually the same as the non. Often manufactured differently, using different components and even produced in a different country. Pilkington is Chinese-owned (Nippon Sheet Glass) and their acquisitions have made them a global concern.

That's very interesting. I'd have expected it to be the same item/spec like when you buy a BMW spark plug, it's the same Bosch/NGK etc item but with a BMW stamp. (Saying that, you can buy the same tyres, with or without the BMW star mark. As I understand it, these are specifically vetted for the appropriate rolling radius).

Given your username, I suspect you know what you're talking about.

Glassman said:

sharepointalex said:

Thanks - I'm sure it's HUD glass. I don't quite have an affect like that. Perhaps to most eyes it would look fine it just seems a little blurry around the edges that's all. And the fact that I had to rotate the HUD seemed odd to me.

The difference in screens is that the HUD version has a 'wedge piece' in the interlayer where the image is projected onto. This wedge piece makes all the difference. The OE parts will be precise and manufactured to a blueprint owned by BMW. Anything without the BMW logo will not be the same quality.

If it's not a HUD screen, you will still see the projected data but the image will have a 'ghosting' shadow behind it.

For cars under warranty, if there is an issue with anything attached/connected to the windscreen, you may not be covered as most dealers will kick it out if they see a non-genuine part is in the equation.

So in these situations, how much 'right' does the customer have to the proper BMW stamped glass? Can you insist on it? Should it be supplied from the off or would Autoglass only supply a Pilkington and the customer has to pay the difference for BMW glass?

Edited by g3org3y on Tuesday 20th April 09:49

[Krikkit]

g3org3y said:

So in these situations, how much 'right' does the customer have to the proper BMW stamped glass? Can you insist on it? Should it be supplied from the off or would Autoglass only supply a Pilkington and the customer has to pay the difference for BMW glass?

That depends on the ins and outs of the contracts, if it's an insurance job it might only say "OEM-equivalent" to get around not fitting the exact OEM parts etc.

[Glassman]

g3org3y said:

Glassman said:

g3org3y said:

Pilkington is OEM supplier IIRC.

Yes, but the OE version is not usually the same as the non. Often manufactured differently, using different components and even produced in a different country. Pilkington is Chinese-owned (Nippon Sheet Glass) and their acquisitions have made them a global concern.

That's very interesting. I'd have expected it to be the same item/spec like when you buy a BMW spark plug, it's the same Bosch/NGK etc item but with a BMW stamp. (Saying that, you can buy the same tyres, with or without the BMW star mark. As I understand it, these are specifically vetted for the appropriate rolling radius).

Given your username, I suspect you know what you're talking about.

Glassman said:

sharepointalex said:

Thanks - I'm sure it's HUD glass. I don't quite have an affect like that. Perhaps to most eyes it would look fine it just seems a little blurry around the edges that's all. And the fact that I had to rotate the HUD seemed odd to me.

The difference in screens is that the HUD version has a 'wedge piece' in the interlayer where the image is projected onto. This wedge piece makes all the difference. The OE parts will be precise and manufactured to a blueprint owned by BMW. Anything without the BMW logo will not be the same quality.

If it's not a HUD screen, you will still see the projected data but the image will have a 'ghosting' shadow behind it.

For cars under warranty, if there is an issue with anything attached/connected to the windscreen, you may not be covered as most dealers will kick it out if they see a non-genuine part is in the equation.

So in these situations, how much 'right' does the customer have to the proper BMW stamped glass? Can you insist on it? Should it be supplied from the off or would Autoglass only supply a Pilkington and the customer has to pay the difference for BMW glass?

Edited by g3org3y on Tuesday 20th April 09:49

It's all in the proposal. The insurer (or acting agent/broker) must take reasonable steps to make such points clear to understand. The reality is, they just hand - or forward - you a booklet full of jargon which doesn't always tell you what you need to know. For example, it might say, 'glass covered for breakage' or something similarly worded. The emphasis seems to be to get you nodding in agreement on your way to the checkout stage of the process.

Some more info on this:

http://www.glasstecpaul.com/the-disparity-in-winds...

http://www.glasstecpaul.com/insurance-wont-allow-g...

http://www.glasstecpaul.com/approved-windscreen-co...

It's a really messy process when you start to dissect it; so many flaws, much ambiguity and wide open for abuse.

[Glassman]

g3org3y said:

Glassman said:

g3org3y said:

Pilkington is OEM supplier IIRC.

Yes, but the OE version is not usually the same as the non. Often manufactured differently, using different components and even produced in a different country. Pilkington is Chinese-owned (Nippon Sheet Glass) and their acquisitions have made them a global concern.

That's very interesting. I'd have expected it to be the same item/spec like when you buy a BMW spark plug, it's the same Bosch/NGK etc item but with a BMW stamp. (Saying that, you can buy the same tyres, with or without the BMW star mark. As I understand it, these are specifically vetted for the appropriate rolling radius).

Given your username, I suspect you know what you're talking about.

Put the two products side-by-side and you'll see. Try fitting them and you'll notice one fits much better than the other, generally speaking. That said, some of these 'copy' windscreen are actually quite decent (Guardian for example appear to have upped their game somewhat, and Fuyao - who first appeared as the Happy Shopper equivalent of windscreens - are on a mission to take over the market!).

The manufacturers also are quite coy about revealing the facts when asked. One states that their products 'respond to the same main technical and aesthetic characteristics as the original'. In other words, a fake leather jacket from a street market responds to the 'same' technical and aesthetic characteristics as the original 'Gucci' version it was copied from.

http://www.glasstecpaul.com/windscreen-manufacture...

[g3org3y]

Thanks for the insights Glassman, very interesting.

I must admit, having a windscreen replaced is one of the things I dread as I fear that it'll never be as perfect as factory fit.

[Glassman]

g3org3y said:

Thanks for the insights Glassman, very interesting.

I must admit, having a windscreen replaced is one of the things I dread as I fear that it'll never be as perfect as factory fit.

As well as being on the fitting side of the fence, I also see things from a consumer pov and the general standard of workmanship out there is shocking. Your fears are justified.

You just need a force field around your car and you'll be fine.

[g3org3y]

Glassman said:

As well as being on the fitting side of the fence, I also see things from a consumer pov and the general standard of workmanship out there is shocking. Your fears are justified.

You just need a force field around your car and you'll be fine.

"Make it so"