Would high mileage on a 530d put you off?
Discussion
Hi all
Thought I would source a biased opinion
I like the look of the 530d at the moment. Seems you can pick one up through a dealer for about £8k (going to PX against it). Obviously at that price you are looking at mileage between 115k and 140k. I know that for most diesel engines this is about broken in but what about other hidden costs associated with quite a big car at high mileage? Anyone have any experience?
Many thanks
Neil
Thought I would source a biased opinion
I like the look of the 530d at the moment. Seems you can pick one up through a dealer for about £8k (going to PX against it). Obviously at that price you are looking at mileage between 115k and 140k. I know that for most diesel engines this is about broken in but what about other hidden costs associated with quite a big car at high mileage? Anyone have any experience?
Many thanks
Neil
Don't worry too much about mileage, but condition and history are everything.
Try not to be too fussy about colour and spec, you want as broad a choice as possible.
I would advise looking at a few. At this mileage the difference between good, bad, and average can be quite big. You will only appreciate a good one when you have seen a few, and have a feel for what to expect.
Ideally you want one where the most recent owner bought when it was still expensive, as these tend to be the people who can afford to maintain them properly.
Try not to be too fussy about colour and spec, you want as broad a choice as possible.
I would advise looking at a few. At this mileage the difference between good, bad, and average can be quite big. You will only appreciate a good one when you have seen a few, and have a feel for what to expect.
Ideally you want one where the most recent owner bought when it was still expensive, as these tend to be the people who can afford to maintain them properly.
Others will be more familiar with this model than me, but I seem to recall that the single turbocharger on these can be the weak link rather than the engine itself and that they tend to suffer carbon deposits if used for short trips and are generally more reliable if motorway use.
I know some guys in my office who got through a few turbos when these first came out
I know some guys in my office who got through a few turbos when these first came out
Patrick Bateman said:
I really don't understand comments like 'the engine is just broken in' when the car is at well over 100,000 miles.
It was just a glib comment about diesels, sorry you took offence to it, it wasn't my intention to cause such a reaction. I took a n/a Pug 309 from 90k to 210k and my gaffer took his 405 from new to 380k back in the 90s. Other things went wrong and fell off, granted, but the engines never needed attention. Same with a 306 dTurbo I took from 60k to 130k, serviced regurlarly the engine never missed a beat and I still see it about after having sold it 6 years or so ago.kentmotorcompany said:
Don't worry too much about mileage, but condition and history are everything.
Thanks, so a good inspection is definitely in order then, thanks. Do you know if someone has a buyers checklist anywhere?thegreatdogwood said:
Others will be more familiar with this model than me, but I seem to recall that the single turbocharger on these can be the weak link rather than the engine itself and that they tend to suffer carbon deposits if used for short trips and are generally more reliable if motorway use.
Most of my driving is A roads and Motorway, so that should fit in well, thanks. A chap at work seems to be blowing turbos on his 07 Golf for fun at about £700 a time through an indy, seems more common these days. My friend has just bought one with 109000 miles on, and if you were not told you certainly wouldnt know by looking at it or even to drive it.
Its an ex pistonheads car (bought in Malton) and has a Superchip remap, really smooth.
He bought as a px with no warranty, and has had no problems in 4000 miles in the last 7 weeks.
I wouldnt waste money on a warranty that probably would cover anything anyway.
The whole point of buying a high miler is because its cheap, just watch out for people asking too much.
Its an ex pistonheads car (bought in Malton) and has a Superchip remap, really smooth.
He bought as a px with no warranty, and has had no problems in 4000 miles in the last 7 weeks.
I wouldnt waste money on a warranty that probably would cover anything anyway.
The whole point of buying a high miler is because its cheap, just watch out for people asking too much.
nottyash said:
My friend has just bought one with 109000 miles on, and if you were not told you certainly wouldnt know by looking at it or even to drive it.
Thats the thing - they wear the miles so well. Even with 180k on it now my E39 is completely pristine.But BMW's like to throw enormous bills at you regardless of mileage - it isnt that high mileage makes them unreliable, just that you cant protect yourself with a warranty.
Fox- said:
Thats the thing - they wear the miles so well. Even with 180k on it now my E39 is completely pristine.
But BMW's like to throw enormous bills at you regardless of mileage - it isnt that high mileage makes them unreliable, just that you cant protect yourself with a warranty.
I had a bad experience with Warranty holdings who basically underwrite most warranty companys, so wouldnt bother. Remember usual consumables are not covered such as brakes, clutches, anything that they can get away with calling fair wear and tear they will, and you wont get a penny back from your expensive warranty. But BMW's like to throw enormous bills at you regardless of mileage - it isnt that high mileage makes them unreliable, just that you cant protect yourself with a warranty.
My advice is put a bit of money aside, and if you cant afford the bills, its not the car for you.
i think the opposite is true. The 530d's can be very expensive to fix when they go wrong (which they invariably do). i eneded up buying at 10 years old and specifically looked for a higher mileage one as chances are the things that go with age would have been sorted. as a result it'd had a turbo and all associated, a few injectors, Cat, Clutch and flywheel,MAF, and a few other things to boot. Granted i then had the usual suspension things to but i missed out on most of the big bills. the Turbo etc came to 1700 quid on its own.
Hiya
I'm always one for buying on condition when it comes to 'higher mileage' cars. Get any potential purchase checked out as best as you can, use a pre purchase inspection service and if all works out well, the car should be good for you. All my BMW's have been what some wouldn't even consider to purchase as evidenced by member Fox above saying. I had each purchase inspected beforehand (only two as i tend to hold onto my cars) and I had no nasty surprises at all. The misconception of '100K miles' means a car is knackered in reality is long gone, provided the car has been looked after correctly and well. I bought my Ex Police 2003 E39 touring at 150K miles just after it's 3rd birthday for between £8000-11000 cheaper than similar 3 year old cars that were in worse condition. I've had the car now since Apr 2006, and my only 'big' ticket item was the common issue of the failed gearbox, the rest of the car has been fantastic ever since, with just a £100 belt change and a very recent £150 fuel pump change. All else has been normal servicing items.
I'm now on around 210 K miles and it drives fantastically, a few small niggles I need to sort but nothing approaching 'expensive'
I'd consider a privately owned and used high miler no problem at all, I'd research the common issues, and see if they affect the car or have already been remidied or recently changed/upgraded etc. There's lots of cars out there, so doing the research can really save you money.
Cheers, Dennis!
I'm always one for buying on condition when it comes to 'higher mileage' cars. Get any potential purchase checked out as best as you can, use a pre purchase inspection service and if all works out well, the car should be good for you. All my BMW's have been what some wouldn't even consider to purchase as evidenced by member Fox above saying. I had each purchase inspected beforehand (only two as i tend to hold onto my cars) and I had no nasty surprises at all. The misconception of '100K miles' means a car is knackered in reality is long gone, provided the car has been looked after correctly and well. I bought my Ex Police 2003 E39 touring at 150K miles just after it's 3rd birthday for between £8000-11000 cheaper than similar 3 year old cars that were in worse condition. I've had the car now since Apr 2006, and my only 'big' ticket item was the common issue of the failed gearbox, the rest of the car has been fantastic ever since, with just a £100 belt change and a very recent £150 fuel pump change. All else has been normal servicing items.
I'm now on around 210 K miles and it drives fantastically, a few small niggles I need to sort but nothing approaching 'expensive'
I'd consider a privately owned and used high miler no problem at all, I'd research the common issues, and see if they affect the car or have already been remidied or recently changed/upgraded etc. There's lots of cars out there, so doing the research can really save you money.
Cheers, Dennis!
To be fair though Dennis you have an E39 - a less complicated beast than an E60. I also didnt have any issue taking on a high mileage E39. Although only 4 years old when I bought it my 530i had 140k miles.
I wouldnt, however, do the same with a modern version - the risk is just too great. You need to have a cast iron warranty behind you.
I wouldnt, however, do the same with a modern version - the risk is just too great. You need to have a cast iron warranty behind you.
DennisCooper said:
Hiya
Fox - I think I have an idea, but I just wanted to ask you in the interests of comparing, what the difference is with a newer car and your feeling that it simply 'must' have a warranty behind it when buying second hand and potentially higher miles?
Complexity and cost, mostly. I decided it was worth the gamble with my 530i because it had a reasonably (Compared to the newer stuff, not compared to a Fiesta) simple N/A petrol engine, it had no idrive, etc etc. There is no complex direct injection to go wrong, there are no turbochargers, there is no iDrive to cause problems. And even despite this it's still cost me quite a lot in repairs.Fox - I think I have an idea, but I just wanted to ask you in the interests of comparing, what the difference is with a newer car and your feeling that it simply 'must' have a warranty behind it when buying second hand and potentially higher miles?
When you start looking at the costs of things like diesel particulate filters, commonrail injectors, turbochargers, iDrive systems, etc etc, it's eye watering stuff - it just seems such a waste to spend thousands replacing stuff like that on an older car.
My E39 was a brilliant buy and I've loved every minute of it and do not regret buying a high mileage example. It is immaculate and nobody would ever guess its mileage unless I told them. But despite this I'm simply put off any newer gen car with more miles than I can reasonably keep a cast iron BMW warranty going on. It's a real shame.
Even the modern petrols are a no-go no, with direct injection, high pressure fuel pumps, etc etc, most of which has to be coded to the car making life difficult at many indys, the sky really is the limit.
And i'd rather plough the cash into the warranted lower mileage car so somebody else can pay the bills.
I honestly wonder where the sub £10k BMW market is going. Who is going to want to buy a £7k car that could quite easily drop a £3k bill on you? Just whats the point?
Even looking at the cost of keeping mine running - the additional cost of owning a much newer one is far less than you'd think once you realise you can fix the unexpected costs at circa £400 a year with the BMW Warranty product.
We've got an E60 now as well in the household - everything is coded to the car. It's ridiculous. You can't even fit a CD changer without getting the car recoded. On the E39 you simply plug it in. On the E60 you end up paying hundreds of quid to get the car recoded - I'm sure some of you know an indy that can do it but down here the main dealer seemed the only option, only one indy thought he could do it and he refused to say how much it would cost until it was in the workshop. All to fit a CD changer..
If thats the faff involved with a CD changer I don't want to know the faff involved with a new injector. There are rumours that even a BATTERY is coded to the vehicle on the LCI models.
Fox- said:
Complexity and cost, mostly...<snip>
Very interesting insight, thanks, exactly the sort of opinion I was looking for. While the running costs on a machine like this doesn't bother me (I ran an E36 M3 for just over a year, that was quite eye watering) the thought of something going wrong and costing me 1,2,3k is a bit worrying. Maybe I'll look elsewhere, it's just that I really like the x30d and the thought of luxury barging into work every day! I have been considering alternatives, such as perhaps a Merc or Audi but I do like the BMWs.BriC175 said:
I read it as more of a tongue in cheek comment, making reference to the fact that the engines are known to go to much higher mileage.
Indeed, that's all it was, perhaps I should start mastering the use of smileys so I don't upset any more people! I must admit I am not very good at understanding forum responses, I find it difficult to get used to peoples responses when they are not really answering the original query. Perhaps I should start looking at sanitising my posts in the future and take my personality out of the posts!Hi
Fox - yes, exactly what I've been thinking as well. I think to re-phrase what I said in my initial post, I think from the BMW perspective, the E39, E46,E53,E38 range of cars will be the last of the ones that can be kept going for a reasonable outlay.
I've said what you've just mentioned for quite some time now, whilst when new and under warranty, all these computerised systems are great - and I love my gadgets believe me! - when these cars get old and not necessarily mileage related, the various control modules cost a bomb to replace. In a very loose comparison, I'd say out of every motorist on the road, only perhaps 10 or 15% max are enthusiasts who in turn, know where to get discount parts, perhaps cheaper coding rates and all that. Those who are simply 'motorists' will be in for a sharp shock when that idrive controller fails £2000 from BMW ! or the next computerised system goes kaput.
Those E60's that'd ordinarily have been £8995 one day will be worth £5000 the next when the idrive fails for instance, and even then, people like us would make a fuss and offer £4500.
So yes, these latest BMW's will be VERY interesting to watch when in 4+ years time the 2005 cars will be 10 years old and out of warranty etc. A spanner in the works of our thinking would be if BMW reduce the price of the £2K part to £600! - so, could there be a fundamental shift by BMW, in lowering greatly their replacement parts prices to ensure their products will actually be useable after warranty has elapsed and over say 10 years old?! in 20 years time, will we see 'old' E60's and E9x still running very nicely ?! or is now a good time to start to collect written off E60's and E9x's and strip them for parts?!
Of course, the above also applies to many other manufacturers too!
Cheers, Dennis!
Cheers, Dennis!
Fox - yes, exactly what I've been thinking as well. I think to re-phrase what I said in my initial post, I think from the BMW perspective, the E39, E46,E53,E38 range of cars will be the last of the ones that can be kept going for a reasonable outlay.
I've said what you've just mentioned for quite some time now, whilst when new and under warranty, all these computerised systems are great - and I love my gadgets believe me! - when these cars get old and not necessarily mileage related, the various control modules cost a bomb to replace. In a very loose comparison, I'd say out of every motorist on the road, only perhaps 10 or 15% max are enthusiasts who in turn, know where to get discount parts, perhaps cheaper coding rates and all that. Those who are simply 'motorists' will be in for a sharp shock when that idrive controller fails £2000 from BMW ! or the next computerised system goes kaput.
Those E60's that'd ordinarily have been £8995 one day will be worth £5000 the next when the idrive fails for instance, and even then, people like us would make a fuss and offer £4500.
So yes, these latest BMW's will be VERY interesting to watch when in 4+ years time the 2005 cars will be 10 years old and out of warranty etc. A spanner in the works of our thinking would be if BMW reduce the price of the £2K part to £600! - so, could there be a fundamental shift by BMW, in lowering greatly their replacement parts prices to ensure their products will actually be useable after warranty has elapsed and over say 10 years old?! in 20 years time, will we see 'old' E60's and E9x still running very nicely ?! or is now a good time to start to collect written off E60's and E9x's and strip them for parts?!
Of course, the above also applies to many other manufacturers too!
Cheers, Dennis!
Cheers, Dennis!
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