Rarely Seen Bikes....

[Steve Bass]

So whilst out and about at the weekend, I watched this rarity pull in.

Seen plenty of pics but never one in the flesh. Quite cool in a "Back to the Future" kind of way....

[Biker's Nemesis]

I had a demonstrator out for the day when they first came out, I can't remember much apart from it feeling heavy at low speed.

Someone raced One at the TT didn't they.

[moto_traxport]

Biker's Nemesis said:

I had a demonstrator out for the day when they first came out, I can't remember much apart from it feeling heavy at low speed.

Someone raced One at the TT didn't they.

Steve Linsdell? Think his son Ollie is still racing.

[Steve Bass]

Biker's Nemesis said:

Someone raced One at the TT didn't they.

Can't have been much fun with 100 bhp and half the weight of a parked GS!!

[Biker's Nemesis]

Steve Bass said:

Can't have been much fun with 100 bhp and half the weight of a parked GS!!

Didn't they race it with a YZF 750 motor fitted. (they should have used a BMW GS it would have cleaned up at the TT)

[srob]

I love all things hub centre steered!

Remember the ELF that Ron Haslam raced?

[Steve Bass]

srob said:

I love all things hub centre steered!

Remember the ELF that Ron Haslam raced?

The concept of HCS is superb. Of only they could find a workable solution to the inherent play in the system that comes from the rods and joints in play.
If this could be conquered, it'd make forks a thing of the past...

[podman]

Biker's Nemesis said:

Steve Bass said:

Can't have been much fun with 100 bhp and half the weight of a parked GS!!

it.

Didn't they race it with a YZF 750 motor fitted. (they should have used a BMW GS it would have cleaned up at the TT)

That he did, I saw the bike a few months back at the shop and was lucky enough to see him riding it at TT in the 90s.

Ive only ever seen a road going example a handful of times, I can remember the disappointment that the mighty EXUP motor was restricted and little else.

Ahead of its time maybe eh?

[anonymous-user]

I keep looking fondly at GTS1000s, just for the strangeness factor. Big bloated things, but I'm sure there must be some merit in how they ride!

[hebegb]

As long as it started , I think I could consider trading a small body part.... somebody else's of course, not mine , for one of these ...Quite simply stunning

[trench]

I currently own 6 of them. Nice bikes to ride

[Steve Bass]

hebegb said:

As long as it started , I think I could consider trading a small body part.... somebody else's of course, not mine , for one of these ...Quite simply stunning

Lovely bit of kit.
There's a Bimota Tesi 3D in the dealer across from me, Have to applaud them for making such a thing.

[black-k1]

Nice bikes. I've never had the opportunity to ride one but would dearly love to.

Note that "bloated" as has been suggested. It's only 90lb heavier than the Yamaha FZR1000 of the period and only 70lb heavier than the Suzuki GSXR1100 of the period. It was as light as or lighter than most other sports tourers of the period.

[srob]

Steve Bass said:

srob said:

I love all things hub centre steered!

Remember the ELF that Ron Haslam raced?

The concept of HCS is superb. Of only they could find a workable solution to the inherent play in the system that comes from the rods and joints in play.
If this could be conquered, it'd make forks a thing of the past...

As I understand it, it's the heavy low speed steering that is the biggest killer for hub-centre steering. That and the fact that whilst it's not really that desirable that conventional forks try and launch you over the front, they also tunnel the weight into the front tyre, helping it to not lock or skid.

I designed a two wheel drive, two wheel steering bike years ago when I was younger. I reckon that if you could control/replicate a slide using mechanics, it has to be better than being on the edge of uncontrolled. In effect, steer the rear of the bike around the front once above a certain speed. With hindsight I don't really think the front wheel drive would be worth the weight and aggravation.

It does annoy me that really, what is sold as new now is really a polished turd. Not just the running gear (which I think could be improved) but also the powertrain. But that's another rant for another day

[redback911]

Steve Bass said:

hebegb said:

As long as it started , I think I could consider trading a small body part.... somebody else's of course, not mine , for one of these ...Quite simply stunning

Lovely bit of kit.
There's a Bimota Tesi 3D in the dealer across from me, Have to applaud them for making such a thing.

Wow, looks like IKEA sold a bike, and the person that put it together did not follow the instructions.

[trench]

The best I can do for pics at the moment, they are a bit boxed in. I can't get to the other two.

[trench]

[srob]

trench said:

The best I can do for pics at the moment, they are a bit boxed in. I can't get to the other two.

Cool collection!

Do you use them or have you stockpiled as they're a bit odd?!

I've only ever steered a hub centre steered bike (I was a kid and pushed around the garden on a Ner-a-car) and ended up in the hedge. They fascinate me though!

[Steve Bass]

srob said:

As I understand it, it's the heavy low speed steering that is the biggest killer for hub-centre steering. That and the fact that whilst it's not really that desirable that conventional forks try and launch you over the front, they also tunnel the weight into the front tyre, helping it to not lock or skid.

I designed a two wheel drive, two wheel steering bike years ago when I was younger. I reckon that if you could control/replicate a slide using mechanics, it has to be better than being on the edge of uncontrolled. In effect, steer the rear of the bike around the front once above a certain speed. With hindsight I don't really think the front wheel drive would be worth the weight and aggravation.

It does annoy me that really, what is sold as new now is really a polished turd. Not just the running gear (which I think could be improved) but also the powertrain. But that's another rant for another day

There's some cracking articles out there that describe the various aspects of the systems and their inherent properties and failings.
Yamaha cocked up the Parker design so that the geometry changed in the wrong way in use which caused the heavy steering.

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/2011/09/article/back...

And have a read of Tony Foales write up covering the various systems.

http://www.tonyfoale.com/Articles/Steer/STEER.htm

Truth is that the sliding front fork is a crap solution for a ton of reasons but it's a known quantity, cheap and easy to factor into a bikes design.. And with improvements in materials, issues like stiction and flex are being better controlled.
Shame though, as HCS is really the better solution for a road bike

[trench]

srob said:

Cool collection!

Do you use them or have you stockpiled as they're a bit odd?!

I've only ever steered a hub centre steered bike (I was a kid and pushed around the garden on a Ner-a-car) and ended up in the hedge. They fascinate me though!

I use 1 regularly and 2 every now and again, the other 3 are just stored. It wasn't intentional to collect them it just happens.
I just like things that are a bit different.