Learning to ride confidently?
Discussion
So, I did the CBT around a month ago, and jumped on my 125. A couple of rides in, I started to feel confident and felt that I could do this. Then I fell off after going through an S bend and realising I didn't seem to be turning! In a moment of panic I pulled the front brake and the inevitable happened.
I've probably ridden about 4 or 5 times since and after the fall I haven't felt quite the same. The confidence is gone and I'm so cautious when I come to corners that I slow down to ridiculously low speeds sometimes. I have this overriding fear that if I go at any kind of pace I'm going to end up coming off and getting hurt. I have been practicing and trying to ingrain it into my brain to look at where I want to go and not at what's in front of me. For the most part, barring the odd distraction, this seems to be going well.
Really I'm wondering whether I need some actual tuition or whether I just need to keep riding and letting my confidence grow naturally? I suppose I'm worried that I don't have the correct technique and may not gain it without instruction. Other riders just look so bloody assured compared to me and it frustrates me. I actually passed my theory the other day and would like to start looking into the DAS but I don't feel able to move up to a bigger bike anytime soon...
I've probably ridden about 4 or 5 times since and after the fall I haven't felt quite the same. The confidence is gone and I'm so cautious when I come to corners that I slow down to ridiculously low speeds sometimes. I have this overriding fear that if I go at any kind of pace I'm going to end up coming off and getting hurt. I have been practicing and trying to ingrain it into my brain to look at where I want to go and not at what's in front of me. For the most part, barring the odd distraction, this seems to be going well.
Really I'm wondering whether I need some actual tuition or whether I just need to keep riding and letting my confidence grow naturally? I suppose I'm worried that I don't have the correct technique and may not gain it without instruction. Other riders just look so bloody assured compared to me and it frustrates me. I actually passed my theory the other day and would like to start looking into the DAS but I don't feel able to move up to a bigger bike anytime soon...
Practice on some quiet straights to get used to straight line speed. Remember that one of the main advantages of being on a bike is the speed - so use it where you can - to avoid other road users and potential danger!
...Also, practising slow-speed clutch control would be helpful. Finally, power out of corners - don't let your speed get low, try to train yourself to instinctively use the bike's speed to make sure you carry momentum!
...Also, practising slow-speed clutch control would be helpful. Finally, power out of corners - don't let your speed get low, try to train yourself to instinctively use the bike's speed to make sure you carry momentum!
There are certainly courses that will help you build up your confidence in controlling the bike, and that will help you with your road riding. But simply riding as much as possible will also help.
To be honest, I've been riding for 15 years now, and I still occasionally freak out on steep downhill left hand blind bends!
To be honest, I've been riding for 15 years now, and I still occasionally freak out on steep downhill left hand blind bends!
A friend had been lacking confidence to go through corners at almost any speed.
He booked himself on a cornering course of some type at Bedford Autodrome. I believe it's a basic course that has simple maneuvering in a safe environment.
It might be worth searching for similar.
Alternatively, see if you can book some lessons.
Two key things though- relax, and look where you want to go.
He booked himself on a cornering course of some type at Bedford Autodrome. I believe it's a basic course that has simple maneuvering in a safe environment.
It might be worth searching for similar.
Alternatively, see if you can book some lessons.
Two key things though- relax, and look where you want to go.
I think the first thing here is to accept that you're still at the base of what can be a very steep learning curve, and be aware that at first motorcyles reward the over-confident, the lack of tentative inputs actually keeps the machine working well, but only to a point. After that being over-confident is very dangerous indeed.
Personally, I was same as you, I didn't not pick things up quickly and got frustrated by it. I'm not riding god but I am a reasonable road rider these days, what got me there was practice, and being honest enough with myself to have good self-awareness.
Go for long rides on quiet roads you know well. If you know what you're doing wrong, you just need to practice doing it right.
When you can't work out what the issue is, ask. Have an experienced and mature rider come out with you, or pay someone. There's books too, you tube videos, and a wealth of information out there.
Courses and trackdays etc. are great too, but you'd be better doing what you can with the basics first to get the most from them.
Personally, I was same as you, I didn't not pick things up quickly and got frustrated by it. I'm not riding god but I am a reasonable road rider these days, what got me there was practice, and being honest enough with myself to have good self-awareness.
Go for long rides on quiet roads you know well. If you know what you're doing wrong, you just need to practice doing it right.
When you can't work out what the issue is, ask. Have an experienced and mature rider come out with you, or pay someone. There's books too, you tube videos, and a wealth of information out there.
Courses and trackdays etc. are great too, but you'd be better doing what you can with the basics first to get the most from them.
Just ride as much as you can slowly building up over the same stretch of road. Have a search for the trail breaking method where you brake into the corner but dont release all the pressure until past the apex or you can see the corner opening. This way the front is still loaded and if you do need extra slowing the bike is more ready.
Edited by Power Junkie on Wednesday 18th September 15:52
Prof Prolapse said:
I think the first thing here is to accept that you're still at the base of what can be a very steep learning curve, and be aware that at first motorcyles reward the over-confident, the lack of tentative inputs actually keeps the machine working well, but only to a point. After that being over-confident is very dangerous indeed.
Personally, I was same as you, I didn't not pick things up quickly and got frustrated by it. I'm not riding god but I am a reasonable road rider these days, what got me there was practice, and being honest enough with myself to have good self-awareness.
Go for long rides on quiet roads you know well. If you know what you're doing wrong, you just need to practice doing it right.
When you can't work out what the issue is, ask. Have an experienced and mature rider come out with you, or pay someone. There's books too, you tube videos, and a wealth of information out there.
Courses and trackdays etc. are great too, but you'd be better doing what you can with the basics first to get the most from them.
This is great advice.Personally, I was same as you, I didn't not pick things up quickly and got frustrated by it. I'm not riding god but I am a reasonable road rider these days, what got me there was practice, and being honest enough with myself to have good self-awareness.
Go for long rides on quiet roads you know well. If you know what you're doing wrong, you just need to practice doing it right.
When you can't work out what the issue is, ask. Have an experienced and mature rider come out with you, or pay someone. There's books too, you tube videos, and a wealth of information out there.
Courses and trackdays etc. are great too, but you'd be better doing what you can with the basics first to get the most from them.
I would also add that my riding is very much subject to boosts and dips in confidence - a good ride where I do things properly makes me feel better, and it's self-reinforcing. Having a bad ride knocks me back quite a long way - not relaxing, or making stupid mistakes etc all put me down.
Some bike handling training can really help you get it right from the start and accelerate your learning. I didnt have any 35 years ago and learnt by trial and error too. made all the common mistakes, fell off a few times off road and on road.
depending where you are located try Tom and i2i
https://www.i2imca.com/About.asp
they are good value for money courses and will really help, i got something out of all of them even after riding for years.
You could also join a local RoSPA group, which offer cheap/free post test training. As with any of these groups, if you gel with the instructors it makes all the difference, im sure some regions are better than others.
depending where you are located try Tom and i2i
https://www.i2imca.com/About.asp
they are good value for money courses and will really help, i got something out of all of them even after riding for years.
You could also join a local RoSPA group, which offer cheap/free post test training. As with any of these groups, if you gel with the instructors it makes all the difference, im sure some regions are better than others.
stew-STR160 said:
relax, and look where you want to go.
A million times this. You say you felt the bike wasn't turning, I reckon the bike was probably heading towards whatever you were looking at - oncoming traffic, the opposite kerb, whatever. The bike will go where you're looking but sometimes you have to make a conscious decision to look where you want to go.Scobblelotcher said:
Watching a twist of the wrist (YouTube) is worthwhile for general guidance/theory on bikes and how to handle them effectively and then practice at low speeds until you get some of the technique.
Agree, the Twist of the Wrist videos (and books) are a bit cheesy, and the books are full of strange Scientology derived guff (NEVER read past a word you don't understand, etc), but there's a lot of good advice in them I found.Thanks all, I will definitely look into the YouTube stuff and the handling tuition. I think that's exactly what I need, to be honest.
The incident where the bike wasn't turning, I'm almost certain it was because of where I looked when approaching the turn. I had a second one the next ride where I was passing a parked HGV on the local industrial estate and a car appeared from a junction just behind it. This was right before a bend and threw me, big time. I had a slight moment of panic and again, ended up with it feeling as though the bike didn't want to turn. I'm proud to say, however, that although I didn't make the turn, what I did do was straighten up and go up onto the pavement and then the grass verge and bring the bike to stop, rather than take a dive onto the road. I think that that first fall did me a lot of good in that respect, as it's burned into my brain now not to do what I did that day.
The incident where the bike wasn't turning, I'm almost certain it was because of where I looked when approaching the turn. I had a second one the next ride where I was passing a parked HGV on the local industrial estate and a car appeared from a junction just behind it. This was right before a bend and threw me, big time. I had a slight moment of panic and again, ended up with it feeling as though the bike didn't want to turn. I'm proud to say, however, that although I didn't make the turn, what I did do was straighten up and go up onto the pavement and then the grass verge and bring the bike to stop, rather than take a dive onto the road. I think that that first fall did me a lot of good in that respect, as it's burned into my brain now not to do what I did that day.
You need to understand how a bike turns. I have no idea why they don’t appear to teach it in the test and some think it’s a ‘dark art’.
It’s called counter-steering and would have got you round the bend if you had known about it and used it.
I’ve been riding for thirty-six years and managed to get around for the first ten years or so without knowing anything about counter-steering but once I was introduced to it my cornering improved drastically. You can ride without understanding it because you’re doing it unconsciously (by looking where you want to go) but if you’re approaching a bend too fast then without the positive push on the inside bar you probably won’t get round.
Once it becomes ingrained in your riding you will see a dramatic improvement.
It’s called counter-steering and would have got you round the bend if you had known about it and used it.
I’ve been riding for thirty-six years and managed to get around for the first ten years or so without knowing anything about counter-steering but once I was introduced to it my cornering improved drastically. You can ride without understanding it because you’re doing it unconsciously (by looking where you want to go) but if you’re approaching a bend too fast then without the positive push on the inside bar you probably won’t get round.
Once it becomes ingrained in your riding you will see a dramatic improvement.
Where are you based OP? Maybe someone from here can join you for a ride and some practice 
In short: look where you want to go - its this simple really!
Its very easy to panic and look at the object you are heading into.. if you stare at it, you will go there!!
Its called target fixation, and its a cause for many accidents.
When approaching a bend, all your breaking, positioning and planning should be done before the bend. This way you can deal with the bend nice and steady.. Slow in, fast out!
You need to have a positive throttle around the bend, because if you are coasting or your throttle is shut, the bike will not be stable around the bend.
As suggested, there is loads of videos on Youtube to help.
Consider doing BikeSafe course with the Police force. But note some forces do not allow riders on a CBT to attend.
Metropolitan Police allows L plates, not sure about where you live.
Or as suggested, book some extra tuition with your local bike school.
Relax and have fun
In short: look where you want to go - its this simple really!
Its very easy to panic and look at the object you are heading into.. if you stare at it, you will go there!!
Its called target fixation, and its a cause for many accidents.
When approaching a bend, all your breaking, positioning and planning should be done before the bend. This way you can deal with the bend nice and steady.. Slow in, fast out!
You need to have a positive throttle around the bend, because if you are coasting or your throttle is shut, the bike will not be stable around the bend.
As suggested, there is loads of videos on Youtube to help.
Consider doing BikeSafe course with the Police force. But note some forces do not allow riders on a CBT to attend.
Metropolitan Police allows L plates, not sure about where you live.
Or as suggested, book some extra tuition with your local bike school.
Relax and have fun
TroubledSoul said:
The incident where the bike wasn't turning, I'm almost certain it was because of where I looked when approaching the turn.
It's possible from the description, that your initial fall was started because you were on an iffy line. When you arrive at a bend a little quicker then you planned, you tend to take a shallow early turn in (I think in our heads its to try and keep the bike a bit more upright for longer to allow you to brake deeper). Trouble is in doing that you put yourself on a line that makes the corner more challenging and your going to have to turn harder and later while getting closer to the outside of the road / lane - where you start the target fixation of looking at what you think you might hit. If it was in the second part of the S-bend, its possible you were too wide out of the first part and put yourself out of position and on a horrible line for the second part. You can of course put yourself in trouble by turning to too late as well and never get to the inside of the corner.
So much comes back to positioning and seeing your line through the corner early enough, and is an example of where sometimes you have to slow down to go faster as getting the corner entry right is so important (that's for everything from the dynamics of the bike to your visibility through and out of the corner). We all make mistakes and end up off line at times. It takes a conscious effort and decision (for me anyway) to move my attention back to where I need to be, force the bike to turn and trust it to do so. Its certainly worth trying to really understand where it started to go wrong, learn what the right approach is, and keep practicing.
Hungrymc said:
We all make mistakes and end up off line at times. It takes a conscious effort and decision (for me anyway) to move my attention back to where I need to be, force the bike to turn and trust it to do so. Its certainly worth trying to really understand where it started to go wrong, learn what the right approach is, and keep practicing.
Me too - it takes a very specific mindset not to go with daft instincts for cornering when you make a mess of it (in my experience anyway).Power Junkie said:
Just ride as much as you can slowly building up over the same stretch of road.
That's good for practicing specific techniques, especially if you have a circular route. But the real skill you need to develop is handling corners you don't know. Using the same road too often there is a tendency to ride according to what you remember rather than what you can or can't see so your ability to read the road can get rusty. There are plenty of riders that are very smooth and that little bit too confident on their favourite roads, then poodle along nervously on the rare occasions they go on a unfamiliar road.
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