'pleasure' rides and CV-19

[jason61c]

Awkward thread.........

if you just want to go for a ride on a motorbike for no other reason than rest/pleasure etc, is it against current goverment guidelines?

[PTF]

jason61c said:

Awkward thread.........

if you just want to go for a ride on a motorbike for no other reason than rest/pleasure etc, is it against current goverment guidelines?

Nope

Judging by how many people i see cycling, walking, running and horse riding on my regular 20 mile cycle ride (which i've been doing by myself several times per week for years and throughout lockdown), i'd say that riding a bike for pleasure is alright.

BUT don't meet up in groups unless everyone is implementing social distancing. Personally if i could be bothered i'd be heading out on one of my bikes, but TBH i just can't face the hassle of getting all the gear on. I'd rather go cycling i think. Biking for me is primarily about getting to work and back, which obv at the moment isn't happening, and despite riding for 17 yrs i don't really see myself as a "biker".

[zzrman]

jason61c said:

Awkward thread.........

if you just want to go for a ride on a motorbike for no other reason than rest/pleasure etc, is it against current goverment guidelines?

Pay no attention to the "guidance" - it's not the law and frequently contradicts the law.

What the revised regs say is that you can leave the place that you live

"to take exercise—
(i)alone,
(ii)with one or more members of their household, or
(iii)with one member of another household"

So that depends on whether riding your bike constitutes exercise - probably not.

You can also leave the place where you live

"to visit a public open space for the purposes of open-air recreation to promote their physical or mental health or emotional wellbeing—
(i)alone,
(ii)with one or more members of their household, or
(iii)with one member of another household"

So a ride on its own i.e. no stopping for recreation (note it doesn't say exercise), isn't permitted, but the simple answer is that if you are stopped name an open space and say you're going there for recreational purposes to promote your physical and/or mental wellbeing.

[Alex@POD]

zzrman said:

Pay no attention to the "guidance" - it's not the law and frequently contradicts the law.

What the revised regs say is that you can leave the place that you live

"to take exercise—
(i)alone,
(ii)with one or more members of their household, or
(iii)with one member of another household"

So that depends on whether riding your bike constitutes exercise - probably not.

You can also leave the place where you live

"to visit a public open space for the purposes of open-air recreation to promote their physical or mental health or emotional wellbeing—
(i)alone,
(ii)with one or more members of their household, or
(iii)with one member of another household"

So a ride on its own i.e. no stopping for recreation (note it doesn't say exercise), isn't permitted, but the simple answer is that if you are stopped name an open space and say you're going there for recreational purposes to promote your physical and/or mental wellbeing.

I go for a ride because it promotes my emotional well being, i.e. I feel happier when I am out on the bike. I don't stop and meet others though.

[Dog Star]

It's not against the law. The NHS is perfectly fine capacity wise for cv19, so it's not even like the handwringers can get on their high horses about that.

[bogie]

In normal circumstances over 23 million go to A&E each year of which about 20,000 are bikers, about 0.8% of the total A&E workload....im sure they are appreciating the break

I will be going out for a ride tomorrow in the general direction of a large park I may stop at to do a quick lap of for my daily exercise

[pip t]

zzrman said:

Pay no attention to the "guidance" - it's not the law and frequently contradicts the law.

What the revised regs say is that you can leave the place that you live

"to take exercise—
(i)alone,
(ii)with one or more members of their household, or
(iii)with one member of another household"

So that depends on whether riding your bike constitutes exercise - probably not.

You can also leave the place where you live

"to visit a public open space for the purposes of open-air recreation to promote their physical or mental health or emotional wellbeing—
(i)alone,
(ii)with one or more members of their household, or
(iii)with one member of another household"

So a ride on its own i.e. no stopping for recreation (note it doesn't say exercise), isn't permitted, but the simple answer is that if you are stopped name an open space and say you're going there for recreational purposes to promote your physical and/or mental wellbeing.

My general argument would be the road is a public open space, and I’m riding a motorbike for open air recreation. Difficult to ride one indoors.

You always have the fallback of saying you’re riding to an open space to sit in the sun.

That’s if you get stopped at all, which if you’re riding on your own, and not in a manner that would attract attention is highly unlikely anyway.

Just don’t end up in a crowd of other parked up bikers and you should be fine.

Anecdotally, I’ve been out on the bike most days since the rules were relaxed, seen several police cars, and not one has batted an eyelid.

Edited by pip t on Thursday 21st May 22:30

[Wacky Racer]

It's these bikers that congregate close together in places like Devil's Bridge, Hawes, Matlock Bath, Riivington Barn etc, that are the issue. I realise it's tempting, but why can't they wait a little bit longer ffs!?

[zzrman]

pip t said:

My general argument would be the road is a public open space, and I’m riding a motorbike for open air recreation.

My view is that put to the test your argument wouldn't hold water. Your purpose has to be to "visit the public open space" so I think that riding to the end of your drive and joining the public road wouldn't qualify as "visiting".

But the bottom line is that you, if stopped, intend to go to (public open space) to (have a walk, enjoy the fresh air, have a walk, have an ice-cream - anything that constitutes enjoyment outside work for you) and you will be OK

Edited by zzrman on Thursday 21st May 23:11

[pip t]

zzrman said:

My view is that put to the test your argument wouldn't hold water. Your purpose has to be to "visit the public open space" so I think that riding to the end of your drive and joining the public road wouldn't qualify as "visiting".

But the bottom line is that you, if stopped, intend to go to (public open space) to (have a walk, enjoy the fresh air, have a walk, have an ice-cream - anything that constitutes enjoyment outside work for you) and you will be OK

Edited by zzrman on Thursday 21st May 23:11

My bold......and that is nit picky detail! But in terms of law nit picky detail counts I guess - I hadn’t even considered that - very fair point. Just have to make sure I know of a place I could conceivably be headed to!

The likelihood of being stopped if not in a group/ riding like a silly billy is still minimal though.

[anonymous-user]

The law is in most cases not as much about nit picky detail as people may suppose, and zzrman's point is not nit picking. He is giving the words of the Regulation their natural and ordinary meaning, which is the correct approach to interpreting a statute or statutory instrument. He's a lawyer, and so am I, and we agree that it is lawful to go for a ride, for the reasons indicated above. I have not come across any lawyer who posts on here who takes a different view.

I emphasise the point that guidance is not law, and what the PM, Ministers, police chiefs, and media outlets say is not law. The law is in the Regulations. They are available online. They are written in plain English. The rules differ as between the different nations that comprise the UK.

Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 22 May 08:02

[pip t]

Breadvan72 said:

The law is in most cases not as much about nit picky detail as people may suppose, and zzrman's point is not nit picking. He is giving the words of the Regulation their natural and ordinary meaning, which is the correct approach to interpreting a statute or statutory instrument. He's a lawyer, and so am I, and we agree that it is lawful to go for a ride, for the reasons indicated above. I have not come across any lawyer who posts on here who takes a different view.

I emphasise the point that guidance is not law, and what the PM, Ministers, police chiefs, and media outlets say is not law. The law is in the Regulations. They are available online. They are written in plain English. The rules differ as between the different nations that comprise the UK.

Edited by Breadvan72 on Friday 22 May 08:02

Fair enough - I'm not a lawyer (Clearly!) and to me differentiating between 'using' a road or 'visiting' a road is nit-picking, in that the end product (Your presence on the road) is the same. I appreciate though, that in legal terms, it's not nit-picking.

[jason61c]

No riding for me. Not worth any potential risk to others, given the guidelines as they are, looks like its staying in the garage.

[pip t]

jason61c said:

No riding for me. Not worth any potential risk to others, given the guidelines as they are, looks like its staying in the garage.

That is obviously absolutely up to you. I'm interested though in what you're regarding as a potential risk to others?

Assuming that you're getting on your bike at your house, riding round for an hour or so and returning to your house; rather than meeting up with some kind of group ride/ meet.

Not trying to start that argument again, just genuinely interested in what you're seeing as a risk?

[wa16]

my tip would be

get up at 4.30 on the bike for 5.30 - don't drink the night before, note the 24 hr petrol stations then enjoy yourself, not too exuberantly observing built ups etc

then you're coming home just as the masses are going out

worked for me last Sunday saw three bikes by 8.30, saw at least three hundred by 10.30 by which time i was on my way home covering a total of 320 miles have fun

[jason61c]

pip t said:

That is obviously absolutely up to you. I'm interested though in what you're regarding as a potential risk to others?

Assuming that you're getting on your bike at your house, riding round for an hour or so and returning to your house; rather than meeting up with some kind of group ride/ meet.

Not trying to start that argument again, just genuinely interested in what you're seeing as a risk?

erm my mrs is a nurse, so i'll get my ears bashed.

If i had my own woopsie, i'd only make people come closer to me and each other than they'd need to. There's always a tiny risk. do I really need to take it at the moment?

[pip t]

jason61c said:

erm my mrs is a nurse, so i'll get my ears bashed.

Haha, this, clearly, by itself is a very good reason

jason61c said:

If i had my own woopsie, i'd only make people come closer to me and each other than they'd need to. There's always a tiny risk. do I really need to take it at the moment?

Fair enough!

[Biker 1]

Sailing appears to be OK. Relative has a yacht on the south coast. Marina is open & the harbour authorities have apparently OK'd it, so I can't see any difference to motorcycling, in that a spin round the Solent may include anchoring, but no actual destination a such.
Even in the first week of lockdown I went to a shop on my bike; I passed 2 police cars & they didn't bat an eyelid.
As for clogging up the NHS with injured bikers: as others have pointed out, A & E departments are gathering dust! Probably a good time to 'have an off'.......

[Dakkon]

Make your own decisions but bear in mind that Thames Valley and Yorkshire police have both said it is not ok to just go for a ride and travel should only be for essential journeys regardless of transport choice.

[Biker 1]

Dakkon said:

Make your own decisions but bear in mind that Thames Valley and Yorkshire police have both said it is not ok to just go for a ride and travel should only be for essential journeys regardless of transport choice.

I do not believe you would receive a FPN, let alone go to court - perhaps BV72 can explain in plain English. Again.