Where to start? (Numpty q's.)

[zcacogp]

Chaps,

I appreciate that this may well have been covered on other threads on this forum, in which case then point me in the right direction.

I am 30, and have had a full driving licence since 17. I live in East London, and am about to accept a job in Teddington (SW London). Commuting will be 1hr15-1hr25 each way.

I am therefore thinking about better ways of travelling across town, and contemplating (very tentatively) the idea of a bike. However, I have no idea of how or where to get started, or how much it will cost.

Therefore, fundamentally, is commuting around 25 miles each way each day a good idea to contemplate upon first getting a bike, or would I do better to pass the relevant tests, and build up some experience before using the bike as a practical means of transport?

What test(s) would I have to take, and how long would it take to do the learning? (I have ridden a moped on holiday in Greece many years ago, and it didn't seem at all hard.)

How much do the various tests cost? And which test should I look at going for?

How much will a suitable starter bike cost? (Rough idea.) And how much should I put aside for other kit - helmet, leathers, boots, gloves etc? (Also, it is feasible to wear biking gear over a work-a-day suit?)

How much am I going to be loooking at for insurance on a bike, and will they take into account a long, good driving history?

How much do I need to worry about security (i.e. the bike getting pinched) and how safe is it? (The answer to that last question is probably "As safe as you make it" - I appreciate.)

I would ask if you would recommend it, but I guess that is a stupid question!

Any advice welcomed.


Oli.

[barry sheene]

zcacogp said:

How much am I going to be loooking at for insurance on a bike, and will they take into account a long, good driving history?

I can answer that one, No , definitely not, as far as the insurance co.s are concerned bikes and cars are two seperate worlds.....

Bennetts are usually good for cheap bike insurance...
I use Carole Nash, cos they give free breakdown and green card (but are a tad pricey) and allow more than one bike on the policy.

Other than that, go for it, its good for you , and the environment....


>> Edited by barry sheene on Tuesday 21st June 19:50

[Mikey G]

Not quite London but i went through a similair dilema regarding traffic and costs. I have recently passed my direct access to allow me to ride any bike.
I am 30 also and my previous experiances of motorbikes was larking about in a field on a crosser have a look around the DSA's website to give you an idea of what to do www.dsa.gov.uk/ then get intouch with your local bike training centres and get some prices (£400-500 typical), they will normally sort everything out for you to do Direct access.
In short you will need to do a Theory test and CBT then training on a 500cc bike before going for your practical test after 15hrs training.

Go for it

Mike

[Fats25]

Right - where do we start?!

Firstly do it - you will not regret it.

Find a training centre that does Direct Access. Do the full course and test that will allow you to ride any size bike. Trust me it will be easier to pass on a 500 than a 125!

As an idea 1st years insurance for myself - £300 TPFT - on a brand new Suzuki SV650s, 28 years old, 9 points on licence, just passed test. This years quote - same price for fully comp. Unfortunately no claims is not transferable, but unfairly any past car claims are taken into account.

With regards to 50 mile round trip a day - no problems I jumped straight to doing 90 mile round trip daily. It is a steep learning curve - but you are having fun the whole time. Did I mention - just get out there and do it?

It is up to you what you spend - but take a look at Ride magazine for an idea of prices, and what you get for your money. Sometimes you are paying for the name rather than the quality. Rough Estimate for decent boots, gloves, helmet, and textiles - about £800.

With regards to bikes, that is entirely up to what you want and what you want to do with a bike. In my opinion - you cannot go wrong with a Bandit 600, SV650s, Fazer, Hornet, CBF600 as first bikes. But keep an eye on this site and everyone has a different opinion.

Did I mention - just get out there and do it?

Only downside of biking - it gets in your blood - and you can't think of anything about the next bike you want, or the next track/training day, next little toy. It is addictive!

I have wheelie school booked this Friday - and you have no idea the looks I am getting from those at work that know that a nearly 30 year old sensible IT manager is paying £160 to learn how to wheelie a motorbike!

Me - I can't sleep I am so excited!

[stu 9-5]

Before I give you some options, I'd like more information.


What's the average speed of this commute, is it mainly dense traffic with the odd traffic light grand prix or is it 40/50mph dual cabbageways?

Will you use the bike solely for the commute or will you want it for evening + weekend fun?

Do you need to carry many belongings to/from work?

Will this be an all seasons decision, or just when the sun has got his hat on?

Do you have an idea of your budget?

[zcacogp]

Chaps,

Thanks for the answers. Thanks Mikey for the link to the DAS site. Reading it, am I right in thinking that I can do a CBT then a test on some kind of larger bike, or choose to do a direct access test? If I go straight for the direct access test, what are the chances of me passing it, given that I have no experience of riding a bike in the UK? I am guessing that I would need some practice before I would have a chance of passing such a test?

Barry Sheene - thanks for the comments on insurance.

Fats, anyone would think you are some kind of enthusiast. Oh, you are? Well, that explains it! Thanks for the detail. £300 for insurance doesn't seem too crippling. I don't know anything about bikes, but I am assuming that "Bandit 600, SV650s, Fazer, Hornet, CBF600" are all 600cc bikes which would go quite briskly and keep me amused for a fair while to come. Gets in the blood? I am sure. And this is one area where I will need to be aware - at the moment I am looking at biking as a purely functional, getting-from-A-to-B (ghastly phrase) exercise. However, I fully expect to get hooked, so will hopefully make decisions that allow an expansion of interest!

Stu - some good questions. Average speed? Don't know. I would imagine it is mainly 10-40mph stuff. Not many dual carriageways. Odd traffic light GP? Of course not, ossifer! I know that it is not a journey I would ever contemplate in a car, as it would be pure murder. On a bike tho', with more traffic-dodging ability, it may be feasible. Solely for commute? See my comments above. Currently, yes. But I expect I will get hooked! Carrying belongings? No. A laptop and papers. Nothing more (I expect). (Presumably a laptop and papers will fit in a top box?) All seasons? I'm not sure. I'd like to think so. But is this an unrealistic expectation? I know that alot of bikers ride more in the summer, but if I could make this work all year 'round then so much the better. I guess that avoiding ice and snow would be a good idea tho'. Budget? No idea, really. How much will it cost is a question bourne out of ignorance. Thus far, we have estimates of around £800 for decent boots, gloves, helmet, and textiles, £300 for insurance, £500 for the training, how much for a bike? Do second-hand bikes work in a similar way to second-hand cars (i.e. many savings to be made) or is it a different set-up?

All help very welcome! Thanks again for comments thus far.



Oli.

[stu 9-5]

Ok

Cheapest option;

50cc twist and go, no training required if you passed your car test before Jan 97, ultra cheap insurance, underseat secure storage for laptop, 50mph if you buy the right model, piece of p1ss to filter on thru traffic. Your helmet fits under the seat when you reach your destination. You should keep your feet and hands dry too. Scooter should return 80+mpg.

Slightly dearer option;

CBT Only - Maximum of a 125 bike, twist and go 70mph with faster acceleration, same practicality benefits as above. You will require a 1 day CBT course(@£100)that will last for 2 years, you can also get 125cc geared 'bikes' that come in off road, supermoto, fully faired and naked styles. Adequate for town use but I wouldn't recommend this for more than a 30 mile commute or for FUN. You still can't use motorways either.

Bit dearer option;

Restricted licence - Do Theory Test, CBT and take practical test on a 125, should be achievable in about 3 days of training (@£350) this will allow you to ride any bike on the market provided it doesn't exceed 33bhp or has been restricted either electronically or mechanically to not exceed 33bhp. You can now use motorways. A restricted 600 will still break 100mph. On the 2nd anniversary of you passing your practical test your licence will automatically upgrade to a full power licence.

Dearer still;

Direct access - similar to the above but the test is taken on a 500cc or similar bike, course should last 5 days at least (@£500). On succesful completion of the test you can ride anything on the market regardless of BHP.


Your budget for clothing is realistic, I'd look at >£600 for comp insurance though. To get the cost down look at advanced training, buying a bike over 5 years old, garaging, approved locks, alarms and immobilisers etc.

As for bikes,

600s are always a good starter bike, friendly enough below 8k rpm but wailing banshees after 9k rpm. For commuting I'd look at something less commited than a GSXR/R6/ZX6R and point myself towards a Thundercat/CBR/Triumph TT 600, these bikes can also add the FUN factor come the weekend.

Decent waterproof topboxes can be had for about £150. Avoid putting laptops/wallets in magnetic tankbags, they do funny things to them.

Brand new 600 class bikes can be had for under 3.5k on 0% finance (Suzuki SV or Bandit). Depreciation isn't as severe as cars, in 2 years a clean SV or Bandit will still get 2.5-2.8k easily. What you save on not paying Kengestion Charge would finance the bike.

Servicing and consumables will cost you about £500 a year.

The most mundane yet practical commuter is the Honda Deauville, absolutely free of any charisma but comes with factory fitted luggage, a lovely big screen and a bulletproof engine with shaft drive.


But the market is wide open once you've got your DAS, have a scan around t'internet and see what tickles your fancy, make a shortlist and come back to us.

[Incorrigible]

I haven't got time to answer all your questions specifically

But in brief, do DAS, you'll have no problems and the training is fun

If the training isn't fun, buy a railcard or whatever (I doubt it)

Get an SV650, perfect compromise, new or second hand depending on your cash flow situation

Get out on at least one track day this year

You'll probably sell the SV after a year or 2, or just keep it for commuting. You'll have a much better idea of what you want after that

[Mad Dave]

re DAS I did a 3 day course @ £300 as I had a little bike experience but a friend has just passed first time after a £400 4 day course, including CBT etc. The instructor very kindly loaned him a 125cc bike for the week between CBT and DAS though.

If you have a car license, and therefore an understanding of the road network, signage etc, you should be ok.

Go for it, you won't regret it!

[rosstefa]

I live in London and there is no quicker way round than on a scooter. I have 180cc Gilera runner (2-Stroke). Excelent accelration, will beat most cars to 50 mph and give a sloppy biker a run to 40mph. Will cruise on the dual caridge way at 60-70 no problem. Wheelies dead easy as well.

I went to see the F1 cars up at London, I went on my runner, my mates on a R6 and GSXR 600 and it wasn't till we got further out of town that they caught up. I love the bigger cc bikes but around town there a waste of time.

[ledger]

stu 9-5 said:

Brand new 600 class bikes can be had for under 3.5k on 0% finance (Suzuki SV or Bandit).

really I have been seeing prices of £4,200 at the dealers I have been looking at.

[outrider]

Training, you will need 5 days for CBT and DA and will cost 500-600GBP plus cost of theory and practical tests.

When I passed mine DA last October I went out and bought a new 130bhp BMW K1200RS capable of 150-160mph, insurance cost through Bennets 349GBP fully comp. For some reason beemers are cheaper to insure. BMW do a 650cc but I can't remember what the model is. I would go the whole hog and do the CBT/DA

I use a laptop rucksack when using the bike for work, comfortable to wear and there is sufficient room for sarnies, clothes, paperwork etc. I could fit panniers but they make the bike a bit too wide for filtering through traffic and a topbox would look crap on the beemer. Have fun.

[rsvmilly]

barry sheene said:

I use Carole Nash, cos they give free breakdown and green card (but are a tad pricey) and allow more than one bike on the policy.

Just for a comparative quote, next time you renew give Bike Team a call. They also do multi-bike policies.

[Carrera2]

rosstefa said:

I love the bigger cc bikes but around town there a waste of time.

Disagree.

I ride into Central London regularly and find most scooter riders 'think' they're much quicker than bikes because they have a smaller turning circle. They're only really quicker if they're being ridden by a lunatic (not suggesting you are) and most of them tend to be - presumabley because a lot of the riders only have CBT training.

Generally though they're much slower and quite frustrating as they sit in front at lights holding up the larger bikes. After 10 metres they're slower, end of story.

[stu 9-5]

Ledger said

"where can I get a SV or Bandit for about 3.5k?"

or something like that...


Fowlers - 2 years 0% £1 deposit
George White - 3 years 0% £100 deposit

Both dealers are doing for less than the 4.2k you've been quoted. MCN advert price is about 3600 but then you can haggle. Admittedly, these bikes are 05 pre registered - but what's the problem with that?

[twit]

As all the other say, do a full DAS. When I did mine I had never ever even sat on a bike. 4 days later I had passed everything. Now, I only ever use the bike, I have sold my car and use the bike regardless of weather or where I am going - its much more fun.

As for bike, an SV is a great starter, but go with what you are comfortable with and remember you are in control!!!!

Go for it!

[zcacogp]

twit said:

As all the other say, do a full DAS. When I did mine I had never ever even sat on a bike. 4 days later I had passed everything. Now, I only ever use the bike, I have sold my car and use the bike regardless of weather or where I am going - its much more fun. As for bike, an SV is a great starter, but go with what you are comfortable with and remember you are in control!!!! Go for it!

Thanks. DAS looks like the route of choice here. It's more expensive, but looks more comprehensive.

I'm encouraged by your comments about passing 1st time, even though you had never sat on a bike before.


Oli.

[bga]

zcacogp said:

twit said: As all the other say, do a full DAS. When I did mine I had never ever even sat on a bike. 4 days later I had passed everything. Now, I only ever use the bike, I have sold my car and use the bike regardless of weather or where I am going - its much more fun. As for bike, an SV is a great starter, but go with what you are comfortable with and remember you are in control!!!! Go for it! Thanks. DAS looks like the route of choice here. It's more expensive, but looks more comprehensive. I'm encouraged by your comments about passing 1st time, even though you had never sat on a bike before. Oli.

Go for it!
Booking mine later today. Can't wait!