Discussion
Easy, even avoiding motorways, although I'd not recomment that option. That's assuming your intended destination is not south of Naples! That would take a bit longer.
The Old Gits will be going to Italy, to the Dolomites to be precise, next year and many of us plan to get there in 2 days and back in 2 days. Each way that'll be one solid day of motorways and one day of nice roads. Thats going to give us 6 nights in Italy and lotsof pizza!
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The Old Gits will be going to Italy, to the Dolomites to be precise, next year and many of us plan to get there in 2 days and back in 2 days. Each way that'll be one solid day of motorways and one day of nice roads. Thats going to give us 6 nights in Italy and lotsof pizza!
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
What time of year are you planinng to go? Some of the higher Alpine passes aren't open until mid-June.
Coming from the UK I would perhaps suggest riding to Dijon on the motorway and then taking a mixure of major/minor roads through the French/Swiss Jura and the Alps.
As an Italian destination, the Asti region between Turin and Casale Monferrato is gorgeous (Mrs B and I stayed there last year on our way to Bologna/Ferrara), then you could wind your way back through Switzerland/southern Germany/Ardennes.
There are dozens of alternatives with great roads to match.
What kind of places do you like visiting... scenery, museums, castles, vineyards, historic cities?
Coming from the UK I would perhaps suggest riding to Dijon on the motorway and then taking a mixure of major/minor roads through the French/Swiss Jura and the Alps.
As an Italian destination, the Asti region between Turin and Casale Monferrato is gorgeous (Mrs B and I stayed there last year on our way to Bologna/Ferrara), then you could wind your way back through Switzerland/southern Germany/Ardennes.
There are dozens of alternatives with great roads to match.
What kind of places do you like visiting... scenery, museums, castles, vineyards, historic cities?
Michael_B said:
What time of year are you planinng to go? Some of the higher Alpine passes aren't open until mid-June.
Coming from the UK I would perhaps suggest riding to Dijon on the motorway and then taking a mixure of major/minor roads through the French/Swiss Jura and the Alps.
As an Italian destination, the Asti region between Turin and Casale Monferrato is gorgeous (Mrs B and I stayed there last year on our way to Bologna/Ferrara), then you could wind your way back through Switzerland/southern Germany/Ardennes.
There are dozens of alternatives with great roads to match.
What kind of places do you like visiting... scenery, museums, castles, vineyards, historic cities?
Time wise I am thinking possibly September time. Visit wise, scenery, museums, castles etc all tick boxes for me. Myself and my fiancee have just come back from Rome and loved it there but so glad we weren't there during the summer as it was so busy. She has spent a great deal of time in Italy and it is somewhere that we would like to retire to. We are aiming to do Florence (not on the bike) early next year so I feel that anywhere North of that would be good. Coming from the UK I would perhaps suggest riding to Dijon on the motorway and then taking a mixure of major/minor roads through the French/Swiss Jura and the Alps.
As an Italian destination, the Asti region between Turin and Casale Monferrato is gorgeous (Mrs B and I stayed there last year on our way to Bologna/Ferrara), then you could wind your way back through Switzerland/southern Germany/Ardennes.
There are dozens of alternatives with great roads to match.
What kind of places do you like visiting... scenery, museums, castles, vineyards, historic cities?
Considering a similar trip next September. Coming from Scotland, my plan was to get off the ferry in Amsterdam and pushing as far down Germany as I could, hopefully near Stuttgart. Aiming for the Stelvio then work my way east along the top of Italy then sprint back to Amsterdam. Top of Italy is all lovely.
I rode to the Guzzi factory in September (Mandello del Lario, on Lake Como) via the Route des Grandes Alpes in France (between Lac Leman - or Geneva - and the Mediterranean) along the coast to Genoa and up to Como via Milan.
I went through the tunnel on the Sunday morning and went on mostly motorway to Troyes via the old French GP circuit at Reims-Gueux (and nipped into Reims itself to refuel bike and body and have a look at the Cathedral.) Troyes has a beautiful medieval old town.
Monday was Troyes to Dijon on motorway, stopped for lunch then headed to Thonon Les Bains on the shore of Lake Geneva (Lac Leman) the traditional start of the RGA.
Tuesday was Cols:
Col de la Colombière
Col des Aravis
Col des Saisies
Col du Méraillet
Cormet de Roselend
To Bourg Saint Maurice
Wednesday was also Cols:
Col de l'Iseran
Col du Télégraphe
Col du Galibier
Col d'Izoard
Col de Vars
Col de le Bonnette
and overnight in Barcellonette
Thursday, for a change, was more Cols:
Col de la Couillole
Col St Martin
(Col de Turini)
Col de l'Orme
Col de l'Ablé
Col de Braus
Arriving in Menton (30 minutes East of Monaco) in 28C heat
Friday was motorway to Milan as I had a date at the Duomo and had to check into a hotel, shower and change...here you could meander over some much more fun and interesting roads into Italy or spend a day in the hills above Monaco before moving on. It's also worth breaking the Route des Grandes Alpes into 4 chunks to take better advantage of the views, photo opps and lunch stops.
ETA: I used a few Ibis Budget hotels on the way and most had free, secure underground parking.
I went through the tunnel on the Sunday morning and went on mostly motorway to Troyes via the old French GP circuit at Reims-Gueux (and nipped into Reims itself to refuel bike and body and have a look at the Cathedral.) Troyes has a beautiful medieval old town.
Monday was Troyes to Dijon on motorway, stopped for lunch then headed to Thonon Les Bains on the shore of Lake Geneva (Lac Leman) the traditional start of the RGA.
Tuesday was Cols:
Col de la Colombière
Col des Aravis
Col des Saisies
Col du Méraillet
Cormet de Roselend
To Bourg Saint Maurice
Wednesday was also Cols:
Col de l'Iseran
Col du Télégraphe
Col du Galibier
Col d'Izoard
Col de Vars
Col de le Bonnette
and overnight in Barcellonette
Thursday, for a change, was more Cols:
Col de la Couillole
Col St Martin
(Col de Turini)
Col de l'Orme
Col de l'Ablé
Col de Braus
Arriving in Menton (30 minutes East of Monaco) in 28C heat
Friday was motorway to Milan as I had a date at the Duomo and had to check into a hotel, shower and change...here you could meander over some much more fun and interesting roads into Italy or spend a day in the hills above Monaco before moving on. It's also worth breaking the Route des Grandes Alpes into 4 chunks to take better advantage of the views, photo opps and lunch stops.
ETA: I used a few Ibis Budget hotels on the way and most had free, secure underground parking.
Edited by CHLEMCBC on Sunday 16th November 23:45
Time4another said:
Considering a similar trip next September. Coming from Scotland, my plan was to get off the ferry in Amsterdam and pushing as far down Germany as I could, hopefully near Stuttgart. Aiming for the Stelvio then work my way east along the top of Italy then sprint back to Amsterdam. Top of Italy is all lovely.
This is a fair point - OP, where in the UK are you starting from?. I'm also in Scotland and I'd probably ferry Newcastle to Amsterdam, then smash over to Dusseldorf and pick up the Urlaubs Express motor-rail train. That drops you off at Villach in Austria which basically puts you right into the Dolomites. There's some fabulous riding in the Apennines - Futa Pass / Ratticosa Pass between Florence and Bologna is a cracker, as is just about any road in the Apennines.
I've done a few Euro trips on a bike through Italy.
I guess it depends on where you are travelling from/to on a ferry etc.
I've gone over from Hull/Newcastle overnight into Holland, basically blatted through Holland into Germany and Into Swizterland and stayed near Davos in one day, it was a long day to be fair, day two Stelvio pass and down to Maranello, day three Maranello to Rimini.
Another trip started in the same way, over to Assen for MotoGP, into Germany stayed in Stuttgart and visited the Porsche Museum, down into Switzerland stayed in Andermatt and rode around a lot of passes etc and towards Pisa and into Florence. Picked up Mugello for the MotoGP and then headed back through Como and into Chamonix for a day or two, then from Chamonix was a boring blast up through France to the champagne region, eurostar back to the UK and home.
I could add lots of details but it gives an idea, the 2nd trip was over 2 weeks, the first was around a week.
I guess it depends on where you are travelling from/to on a ferry etc.
I've gone over from Hull/Newcastle overnight into Holland, basically blatted through Holland into Germany and Into Swizterland and stayed near Davos in one day, it was a long day to be fair, day two Stelvio pass and down to Maranello, day three Maranello to Rimini.
Another trip started in the same way, over to Assen for MotoGP, into Germany stayed in Stuttgart and visited the Porsche Museum, down into Switzerland stayed in Andermatt and rode around a lot of passes etc and towards Pisa and into Florence. Picked up Mugello for the MotoGP and then headed back through Como and into Chamonix for a day or two, then from Chamonix was a boring blast up through France to the champagne region, eurostar back to the UK and home.
I could add lots of details but it gives an idea, the 2nd trip was over 2 weeks, the first was around a week.
I made the trip down to Italy this June although I didn't take the bike. I had the wife and dog in tow so we took the car.
I took the autobahn down through Germany as we’d stopped in Bruges for a night and entered into Italy through the Splügen Pass – would definitely recommend taking this route depending on what time of year you’re going.
I’d definitely recommend budgeting to take the autostrade (toll roads) rather than the superstrade (free roads) if you have any big chunks of driving to do while in Italy. The roads on the superstrade aren’t kept very well and we ran into some major pot holes and at some points couldn’t go above 50 due to the state of it. Also, if you need fuel or to stop for some scran, the autostrade has services where the superstrade you would have to pull off into to some town or city.
We got as far south as the Amalfi coast and drove the coastal road from Sorrento to Salerno. In all honesty, it wasn’t that great of a road to drive because it was so busy.
If you want to ride some really nice roads I’d stay relatively to the north. I found I had the most fun driving around Tuscany which is a massive place but we’d based ourselves in Pienza and found whichever way we drove out, the roads were great and winding and the scenery was always blowing my mind. Plenty of places to pull over at view points too to admire the Italian countryside.
I’d always make a special mention to visit San Pellegrino (where the water is from) in Bergamo. It’s an absolute hidden gem and the locals we’re amused to find foreign tourists there. Once you get past the massive bottling facility on the way in, you’re welcomed into a beautiful valley with turquoise water running through that’s coloured just like the water bottles. The shops and restaurants aren’t overpriced and there’s plenty of shade from the tree lined high street if you’re there in the peak of summer.
As you’ve already said Italy is great and it would be somewhere nice to retire, wherever you go you’ll have a great time and meet some great people.
I took the autobahn down through Germany as we’d stopped in Bruges for a night and entered into Italy through the Splügen Pass – would definitely recommend taking this route depending on what time of year you’re going.
I’d definitely recommend budgeting to take the autostrade (toll roads) rather than the superstrade (free roads) if you have any big chunks of driving to do while in Italy. The roads on the superstrade aren’t kept very well and we ran into some major pot holes and at some points couldn’t go above 50 due to the state of it. Also, if you need fuel or to stop for some scran, the autostrade has services where the superstrade you would have to pull off into to some town or city.
We got as far south as the Amalfi coast and drove the coastal road from Sorrento to Salerno. In all honesty, it wasn’t that great of a road to drive because it was so busy.
If you want to ride some really nice roads I’d stay relatively to the north. I found I had the most fun driving around Tuscany which is a massive place but we’d based ourselves in Pienza and found whichever way we drove out, the roads were great and winding and the scenery was always blowing my mind. Plenty of places to pull over at view points too to admire the Italian countryside.
I’d always make a special mention to visit San Pellegrino (where the water is from) in Bergamo. It’s an absolute hidden gem and the locals we’re amused to find foreign tourists there. Once you get past the massive bottling facility on the way in, you’re welcomed into a beautiful valley with turquoise water running through that’s coloured just like the water bottles. The shops and restaurants aren’t overpriced and there’s plenty of shade from the tree lined high street if you’re there in the peak of summer.
As you’ve already said Italy is great and it would be somewhere nice to retire, wherever you go you’ll have a great time and meet some great people.
CHLEMCBC said:
I rode to the Guzzi factory in September (Mandello del Lario, on Lake Como) via the Route des Grandes Alpes in France (between Lac Leman - or Geneva - and the Mediterranean) along the coast to Genoa and up to Como via Milan.
I went through the tunnel on the Sunday morning and went on mostly motorway to Troyes via the old French GP circuit at Reims-Gueux (and nipped into Reims itself to refuel bike and body and have a look at the Cathedral.) Troyes has a beautiful medieval old town.
Monday was Troyes to Dijon on motorway, stopped for lunch then headed to Thonon Les Bains on the shore of Lake Geneva (Lac Leman) the traditional start of the RGA.
Tuesday was Cols:
Col de la Colombière
Col des Aravis
Col des Saisies
Col du Méraillet
Cormet de Roselend
To Bourg Saint Maurice
Wednesday was also Cols:
Col de l'Iseran
Col du Télégraphe
Col du Galibier
Col d'Izoard
Col de Vars
Col de le Bonnette
and overnight in Barcellonette
Thursday, for a change, was more Cols:
Col de la Couillole
Col St Martin
(Col de Turini)
Col de l'Orme
Col de l'Ablé
Col de Braus
Arriving in Menton (30 minutes East of Monaco) in 28C heat
Friday was motorway to Milan as I had a date at the Duomo and had to check into a hotel, shower and change...here you could meander over some much more fun and interesting roads into Italy or spend a day in the hills above Monaco before moving on. It's also worth breaking the Route des Grandes Alpes into 4 chunks to take better advantage of the views, photo opps and lunch stops.
ETA: I used a few Ibis Budget hotels on the way and most had free, secure underground parking.
That looks like a great route! I went through the tunnel on the Sunday morning and went on mostly motorway to Troyes via the old French GP circuit at Reims-Gueux (and nipped into Reims itself to refuel bike and body and have a look at the Cathedral.) Troyes has a beautiful medieval old town.
Monday was Troyes to Dijon on motorway, stopped for lunch then headed to Thonon Les Bains on the shore of Lake Geneva (Lac Leman) the traditional start of the RGA.
Tuesday was Cols:
Col de la Colombière
Col des Aravis
Col des Saisies
Col du Méraillet
Cormet de Roselend
To Bourg Saint Maurice
Wednesday was also Cols:
Col de l'Iseran
Col du Télégraphe
Col du Galibier
Col d'Izoard
Col de Vars
Col de le Bonnette
and overnight in Barcellonette
Thursday, for a change, was more Cols:
Col de la Couillole
Col St Martin
(Col de Turini)
Col de l'Orme
Col de l'Ablé
Col de Braus
Arriving in Menton (30 minutes East of Monaco) in 28C heat
Friday was motorway to Milan as I had a date at the Duomo and had to check into a hotel, shower and change...here you could meander over some much more fun and interesting roads into Italy or spend a day in the hills above Monaco before moving on. It's also worth breaking the Route des Grandes Alpes into 4 chunks to take better advantage of the views, photo opps and lunch stops.
ETA: I used a few Ibis Budget hotels on the way and most had free, secure underground parking.
Definitely some wonderful roads.I think it perhaps depends on how much time you want to spend in Italy itself as part of a ten day trip. (i) aim for Basel, cross Switzerland via Gotthard/Splügen into Lombardy, have 6-7 days riding around Italy, (Veneto, Trentino-Alto Adige, Emilia-Romagna and Tuscany) then do a marathon ride back; or (ii) ride towards Lake Geneva then take the Route des Grandes Alpes (or the Route Napoléon for that matter), and cross into Italy further south. The second option (if not racing up and down the cols) would leave you less time in Italy itself, but more than enough to visit Piedmont, Lombardy, Liguria and northern Tuscany, once on the other side of the Alps.
Or you could do a combination of the two
Last year we decided to ride along Lake Geneva, east into Valais and put the motorbike on the train through the Simplon tunnel. It was mid-September but was 1°C at the summit of the Simplon (or Gd St Bernard) passes and a forecast of snow showers. It was 10°C in Brig on the north side and 22°C in Domodossola on the south side.
Then it was a leisurely ride down to our overnight stop here in the Monferrato vineyards : https://maps.app.goo.gl/7QMete5LbMEhVZgn9
The next day was a ride through the Oltrepò Pavese, a gorgeous region of rolling hills and small villages, (known as the "Tuscany of northern Italy"), a spot of lunch in Borgonovo Val Tidone and then hit the motorways towards Bologna/Ferrara for four nights there.
We stayed in a similar agriturismo place on the way back, this time further west not far from Asti: https://maps.app.goo.gl/gh4McXKKnAPBk63L8
By then the weather had improved so we rode the next day back over the Simplon pass, summit temperature was 12°C, then back home in time for tea in the early evening.
I go to Milan frequently for work but mostly by train, and our son has family in Tuscany; his wife is from Florence, they were married in the Palazzo Vecchio, and we all spent Christmas with his in-laws there last year. In terms of culture, food, wine, architecture, music and art, there are few places which compare to Italy. Not sure I could actually live there though
Buon viaggio!
Or you could do a combination of the two
Last year we decided to ride along Lake Geneva, east into Valais and put the motorbike on the train through the Simplon tunnel. It was mid-September but was 1°C at the summit of the Simplon (or Gd St Bernard) passes and a forecast of snow showers. It was 10°C in Brig on the north side and 22°C in Domodossola on the south side.
Then it was a leisurely ride down to our overnight stop here in the Monferrato vineyards : https://maps.app.goo.gl/7QMete5LbMEhVZgn9
The next day was a ride through the Oltrepò Pavese, a gorgeous region of rolling hills and small villages, (known as the "Tuscany of northern Italy"), a spot of lunch in Borgonovo Val Tidone and then hit the motorways towards Bologna/Ferrara for four nights there.
We stayed in a similar agriturismo place on the way back, this time further west not far from Asti: https://maps.app.goo.gl/gh4McXKKnAPBk63L8
By then the weather had improved so we rode the next day back over the Simplon pass, summit temperature was 12°C, then back home in time for tea in the early evening.
I go to Milan frequently for work but mostly by train, and our son has family in Tuscany; his wife is from Florence, they were married in the Palazzo Vecchio, and we all spent Christmas with his in-laws there last year. In terms of culture, food, wine, architecture, music and art, there are few places which compare to Italy. Not sure I could actually live there though
Buon viaggio!
mont blanc tunnel is closed when i went this October
if you go via Lyon France you need to use Tunnel routier du Fréjus
obv you don’t have to but if you need a quick trip to get there
make sure sat w
k has the right route in it as it adds two hours plus to the journey if you end up at MB-
otherwise, i found it biking nirvana - in terms of filtering, speeding just getting around utter bliss
autostrada is supposed to be expensive but i have had no charges yet on my toll tag so i am wondering if they bother there is a gap in the barrier most just ride though
filling with petrol is odd it’s cheaper to go to the self-pumps than attendant – took a bit of getting used to picking the right one
otherwise have fun
if you go via Lyon France you need to use Tunnel routier du Fréjus
obv you don’t have to but if you need a quick trip to get there
make sure sat w
k has the right route in it as it adds two hours plus to the journey if you end up at MB- otherwise, i found it biking nirvana - in terms of filtering, speeding just getting around utter bliss
autostrada is supposed to be expensive but i have had no charges yet on my toll tag so i am wondering if they bother there is a gap in the barrier most just ride though
filling with petrol is odd it’s cheaper to go to the self-pumps than attendant – took a bit of getting used to picking the right one
otherwise have fun
I drove (not rode) from Zeebrugge to just north of Milan in 12 hours including wee breaks. So certainly doable, but it makes sense to chop it into at least 2 days and enjoy yourself.
Depending on where you are it's worth considering an overnight ferry on a longer crossing.
Hull/Rotterdam, Harwich/Hook of Holland. Means you can get a nights kip and some breakfast then hit the European roads a bit fresher at about 8am. Different if you live round the corner from Dover, of course.
Earlier this year I rode from the Hook of Holland to the Ardennes, was 4-5 easy hours. Broken up by stopping off for coffee/sightseeing/lunch/emergency helmet buying.
Depending on where you are it's worth considering an overnight ferry on a longer crossing.
Hull/Rotterdam, Harwich/Hook of Holland. Means you can get a nights kip and some breakfast then hit the European roads a bit fresher at about 8am. Different if you live round the corner from Dover, of course.
Earlier this year I rode from the Hook of Holland to the Ardennes, was 4-5 easy hours. Broken up by stopping off for coffee/sightseeing/lunch/emergency helmet buying.
robinh73 said:
Yet more superb advice, thank you.
What sat navs are people using? Are Garmin worth the spend or are Carpurode etc up to the job?
When I did Germany from Scotland in the spring, I bought a Garmin. That way I didn't risk my phone getting ruined by vibrations or the weather or just plain falling off. What sat navs are people using? Are Garmin worth the spend or are Carpurode etc up to the job?
When the Garmin charging socket packed up I ended up having to buy a big power bank and using my phone anyway. The benefit of a Garmin is being able to export routes from the likes of Kurviger to better plan a fun ride. Google Maps likes to default to the more boring roads.
What bike have you got to see if you have the room for a Carpuride etc?
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