Downsizing, will I hate it???

[OCD-Dan]

Afternoon BB massive

So per the title, I am thinking about down sizing to something like a 390 Adventure R, CRF300 Rally, MT 450 etc etc..... As I'd like to dip my toes in the offroad world, but cant justify 2 bikes right now.

So going from say 120BHP ( currently have Gen 3 MT09) to something with circa 30-50BHP, how did you find it if you have done something similar.

I have thought maybe T7, of 790/890 Adventure and a like, but I think that's probably too much for my first dip into the greenlane/trail riding world.

What ever I change to will need decent road manners, as I will be riding to the trails/lanes, circa 40-60 mins depending on possible direction.

Thoughts please. TIA

[nordboy]

I've ridden big bikes for many years, including work bikes regularly ridden at speed .

I currently own a 58bhp Honda x-adv 750 with auto/ DCT gearbox. It does take some time to acclimatise to less power but I honestly get on absolutely fine 98% of the time. Open road overtakes at speed do take some planning but I've just slowed down, which tbh, isn't a bad thing.

i don't ride off road mind you, and an off roader will be probably more challenging on road than my scooter.

I don't really miss the big bikes, been there and done it, it was time for something different.

Ultimately only you'll know what you want from biking and what bike will suit you?

[mrdelazouch]

OCD-Dan said:

Afternoon BB massive

So per the title, I am thinking about down sizing to something like a 390 Adventure R, CRF300 Rally, MT 450 etc etc..... As I'd like to dip my toes in the offroad world, but cant justify 2 bikes right now.

So going from say 120BHP ( currently have Gen 3 MT09) to something with circa 30-50BHP, how did you find it if you have done something similar.

I have thought maybe T7, of 790/890 Adventure and a like, but I think that's probably too much for my first dip into the greenlane/trail riding world.

What ever I change to will need decent road manners, as I will be riding to the trails/lanes, circa 40-60 mins depending on possible direction.

Thoughts please. TIA

Good downsizing options. I would think that if you are going to spend a considerable amount of time getting to and from trails your best option would probably be CFMoto 450MT or Kove 450 Rally. However I wouldn't dismiss 790/890 or T7 as they would be great for both on and off road and you could also add Kove 800X rally to the mix.

[s p a c e m a n]

A mate has an mt10 and a 450 supermoto and I have an fz1 and a 450 green laning bike. Both of the 450s are way more fun at everything other than 50mph dual carriageway.

I wouldn't commute on one, I wouldn't do massive distances on one, but I would choose my ktm over most other things if all I am doing is banging around the lanes. Power isn't everything.

[Biker9090]

I have an old CBF500 thgat I've kept for years largely because it's so much fun on smaller roads.

Just rememeber that

- Most will be physically smaller. This can get uncomfortable depending on your size/height

- Most will lack things like cruise control, IMU etc that you may have gotten used to on the bigger bike

- Suspension will be considerably more budget and weakly sprung

[AlunJ]

I went from a Gen 3 MT-09 to a Guerrilla 450. On the backroads it’s great fun, it’s a bit vibey on the motorway in comparison but copes okay. The problem comes when you want to overtake, what would be a quick squirt of the throttle on the MT-09 takes a lot more planning and space, waiting for a big enough gap.

[A500leroy]

I can recommend the KTM 390 Adventure having owned one for a year, it's plenty lively enough and only sold as my Fireblade project came up for sale and like you only really room for one bike, I'd have another KTM without hesitation.

[Bob_Defly]

I wouldn't worry about it. I recently rode my CRF450RL on a decently long road and trail ride, and yes it's a bit tiresome on the longer road sections. But I find off-roading so relaxing that I didn't really bother overtaking that much. I just enjoyed the scenery.

If you want to be better on the trails stick with <450cc. If you want more road comfort and oomph, go with 500-600cc. The CRF300L Rally is a great bike, and given KTM's woes, I'd probably choose the Honda over one. YMMV.

Generally with more power comes more weight when picking it up. So you have to decide which one you want to prioritise.

[H40405J]

OCD-Dan said:

Afternoon BB massive

So per the title, I am thinking about down sizing to something like a 390 Adventure R, CRF300 Rally, MT 450 etc etc..... As I'd like to dip my toes in the offroad world, but cant justify 2 bikes right now.

So going from say 120BHP ( currently have Gen 3 MT09) to something with circa 30-50BHP, how did you find it if you have done something similar.

I have thought maybe T7, of 790/890 Adventure and a like, but I think that's probably too much for my first dip into the greenlane/trail riding world.

What ever I change to will need decent road manners, as I will be riding to the trails/lanes, circa 40-60 mins depending on possible direction.

Thoughts please. TIA

I posted similar a couple of days ago on the 450GS thread.

You need to think very carefully about what sort of off-road you’re doing. If it’s relatively open gravel tracks in the dry, like the Ridgeway, or the easier bits of Salisbury Plain, any of the bikes you suggested will be fine. Tenere, 7/890, Kove 800X (not the Rally), 800/1000MTX, Tuareg also be perfectly good options that won’t feel like a step down from your current bike.

If you’re aspiring to be riding a slate-y green lane in Wales in February, then you need to either go light and cheap (used CRF300, Voge 300 Rally) and not care about how you treat it, or go light and expensive and buy an enduro bike.

One of the other posts above mentioned the Kove 450 Rally. I’m not saying don’t go for it, but I’d caution against it. It would be a horrible only bike. I took one out for a couple of hours (road only), and it’s very much a road legal rally bike. Tall, stiff, uncompromising. A brilliant bike in the right hands and on the right trails, but not in any way a road bike or beginner trail bike.

[OCD-Dan]

Cheers for all the replies so far.

Not too worried about the overtaking tbh, as like some have said I am happy to sit and potter along, kind of the reason looking to change. I find myself most days cruising at 50-60 on the MT09, and riding small little lanes caked in moss and gravel. So the MT is not really ideal for my riding style any more and very much overkill.

My worry was really sitting at 50 plus on an A road for 40 mins on single.

I think weight over power is probably the right way to go, as when I do eventually decide what I want out of a bike, I will be looking to mostly ride in the Yorkshire Dales, with zero off road experience.

So I think picking the bike up several times, is going to be more important than how quick I can get too the lanes and across them, if that makes sense. Although I dont think I will be looking to do full single track stuff, in my mind I'm thinking gravel tracks, muddy lanes. But not knowing what lanes/trails are like in the Yorkshire Dales this is all guess work, until possibly joining the TRF.

Anyone done any touring on a dual purpose over a few days (including camping) and if so how do you get on with carrying luggage?

Sorry for all the questions

Edited by OCD-Dan on Thursday 29th October 15:31

[ModZ1R]

smaller and lighter.

Green laning in the winter - you will fall off so you want something you can pick up easily.

If you're doing a mixture then maybe 450-690 but otherwise <450 probably the way to go.

[Linksmas]

I have a Himi 450, bike before that was Vstrom and in my twenties it was sportsbikes.

Its great, have toured europe on it, plan to go to Switzerland next summer. It is plenty fast enough for A and B roads, I do also get it muddy. The only time I wish I had more power is on the motorway.

But do I miss the power? No. Do I want more power? I think so. I will try the Himi 750 when my dealer has a demo bike available.

[Ghs]

OCD-Dan said:

Afternoon BB massive

So per the title, I am thinking about down sizing to something like a 390 Adventure R, CRF300 Rally, MT 450 etc etc..... As I'd like to dip my toes in the offroad world, but cant justify 2 bikes right now.

So going from say 120BHP ( currently have Gen 3 MT09) to something with circa 30-50BHP, how did you find it if you have done something similar.

I have thought maybe T7, of 790/890 Adventure and a like, but I think that's probably too much for my first dip into the greenlane/trail riding world.

What ever I change to will need decent road manners, as I will be riding to the trails/lanes, circa 40-60 mins depending on possible direction.

Thoughts please. TIA

I went down to this & it was Slow , never mind overtaking , slip roads were a nightmare , looking across to the carriageway realising your not going to outrun a lorry doing 56 mph was pitiful, i just became more & more frustrated by the day , don’t miss it at all .
So I’d hate to think what a 20/30 hp bike is like on the road , maybe off road it’s fine but a hour on normal roads , no thanks , you’ll just be a mobile road block for Lorrie’s etc , dangerous
I’d buy a trailer / van & take it to the lanes in that , feel free to ignore me as I do seem to be in a minority when it comes to not thinking 50/60 hp is not enough power for road use
Nb I watched a video of a Voge 300 , the lad trying it had the same opinion as me on road but at £3,995 thought it was a bargain if you just used it for off road .

[scsracing]

As someone who has a CRF300 Rally and a T7. Buy the CRF if its all within 40-60 mins.

People have travelled the world with them, so you can do long distance but as a beginner green laner who still wants to ride on the road its perfect. Even a CRF300L. Yes it needs some upgraded suspension and the plastics can be fragile, its also not got much grunt, but buy a 2nd hand one with the suspension already sorted and the gearing tweaked and the lack of grunt won't be an issue for a beginner. You can pick them up for around 3-3.5k, they'll do silly MPG, and are cheap to fix/insure/tax.

If you were just doing green lanes only, I'd say go more enduro as you can just abuse the bikes with little to no damage.

I've got the T7 for longer euro trips, mainly sticking to ACT routes and some TET, but I got it to cover more distance, in more comfort and quicker to see more things!

I admit next year i'll probably go for a DRZ400, trading in the CRF. But mainly as I just want to change it up a bit.

Buy the bike you don't mind trashing.

[Alex9]

It depends what you like as a rider...

I've had an Africa Twin for years and recently got a CRF300 to go alongside it, as something easier to handle off-road. The 300 is awesome fun on smaller roads, and even on bigger roads I can push it enough that I don't want more. The engine isn't standard but we're still barely at 30hp I think.

However if I do the same roads on the Twin, it's just better for me, I barely have to change gear, just twist the throttle and I'm already at the next bend... If I had only 1 bike I think it would have to be the bigger one.

That said, I haven't ridden a 450, maybe they're the sweet spot!

[mrdelazouch]

H40405J said:

Kove 800X (not the Rally)

For more offroad orientated use I would definitely prefer lighter 800X Rally. It weights about 15kg less when comparing to the standard version, so much easier to pick when you drop it.

[TwigtheWonderkid]

The reality is that for 95% of the time, an average 250cc bike will do exactly what your using your 1000cc sports bike to do.

[Esquire]

Interesting thread.

I am the author of the GS 450 thread and from what I'm reading here maybe the KTM 390 would be a better option to the GS .

I enjoyed my time on the 450 GS at the Off Road Skills Center so had only really looked further into those.

Anyhow, watching this thread with interest

[OCD-Dan]

Cheers everyone for the extra replies, I think I'm going to pop down to the local dealers over the weekend and have a nosey at a few of the small capacity options. As I have CF Moto, Voge, KTM and Honda relatively close by.

Still tempted by middle weight though, as my riding could still end up being 70/30 road biased, so need to also consider that.

Maybe the solution is bigger house, bigger garage more bikes

[mrdelazouch]

Bike World just dropped a video you might be interested in, group test of KLE650, 450GS and 450MT

https://youtu.be/4k4b1GuP_8k?si=KpL7FEPdk9Sb7cgf