Best racer ever?
Discussion
Let's hear your suggestions then. If they were all on exactly the same machinery, you would be your best ever & why?
[dons flameproof suit]
For my money it would have to be Rossi. Consistently succesful at the highest level of the sport on many different bikes. I believe Doohan & Schwantz were quite handy too?
[dons flameproof suit]
For my money it would have to be Rossi. Consistently succesful at the highest level of the sport on many different bikes. I believe Doohan & Schwantz were quite handy too?
Probably Rossi. Purely because as well as being a rider with a lot of finesse and style, in my opinion his personality and winning ways promoted the sport like no other.
I'm still a Stoner fan, though. Watching Rossi is like watching ballet, watching Stoner is like watching someone demolish a caravan with a sledgehammer. Both effective but both very different
I'm still a Stoner fan, though. Watching Rossi is like watching ballet, watching Stoner is like watching someone demolish a caravan with a sledgehammer. Both effective but both very different
I'd have to give my vote to Rossi if for no other reason than watching what he did in the seriously wet at Donnington. That was amazing. But I think Doohan would give him a run. My starting grid would go something like
Rossi Doohan Schwantz
Rainey Sheene Hailwood
Read Stoner Fogarty (if only to see how he went in good company)
Rossi Doohan Schwantz
Rainey Sheene Hailwood
Read Stoner Fogarty (if only to see how he went in good company)
Macman said:
Fogarty (if only to see how he went in good company)
I've read his book & from what I remember he couldn't get a decent bike so got huffy & went home (more to it than that but that's the gist I believe), which always struck me as not the kind of thing a racer would do. In his defence, I think I would have been exactly the same, but I thought a genuine sportsman would want to PROVE beyond doubt that they could do it, & if that means starting on a lower rung bike-wise then so be it. Or is it just me?
black-k1 said:
For me it has to be Mike Hailwood. 9 motorcycle World Championships between 1961 and 1967, then in '78, felt bored so came back and won the TT!
Not taking anything away from him, combined with the fact that was before my time, would it not be fair to say it was a little easier to win back then i.e. little bit more of a gentlemen vs professional riders-type deal. I know you can only beat the competition at the time so I guess that nullifies my earlier point!
Centurion07 said:
black-k1 said:
For me it has to be Mike Hailwood. 9 motorcycle World Championships between 1961 and 1967, then in '78, felt bored so came back and won the TT!
Not taking anything away from him, combined with the fact that was before my time, would it not be fair to say it was a little easier to win back then i.e. little bit more of a gentlemen vs professional riders-type deal. I know you can only beat the competition at the time so I guess that nullifies my earlier point!
Was it easier back then? I don’t know if you can answer that as, while machines were slower/less powerful, they also had crap tyres, crap brakes, crap suspension etc. I also think (though I can’t say for sure) that the likelihood of a racer suffering serious or fatal injuries were higher then than they are now, so does that not make it harder?
As you say you can only beat the competition at the time and that's what "Mike the Bike" did, consistently.
PS Mike was before my time too! (Just)
Rossi - 1st vote - Was also at Donington in the wet when he stretched out a 3 sec gap after taking the lead and made it look so easy. Went to Mugello last year, and in the face of the Ducati 07 onslaught produced such a sublime demonstration of greatness it made the trip one in a life time, we were on Rossi hill.
Steve Hislop - I was there when he broke the MotoGP lap record on a production based Ducati at Donington, not once, but 6 times that weekend. I was also there to shed a tear at Oulton Park when Stuart Easton rode White Charger round in the rain, a very sad day to be a race fan. My favourite signed picture on the wall at home is Hissy on white charger at the TT.
I remember being at Knicker Brook when Hissy took Reynolds going up Clay Hill, on the inside a full chat, there's probably only a handful of people on the world who could have pulled that move off withouth upsetting Reynolds or his race line, and he was one of them.
Foggy - On his day untouchable, King of Assen.
Doohan - Dominated.
Hailwood - To come back after all those years and win at the Island . .
Yer Maun - 26 TT wins, and a more genuine racer harder to find anywhere.
Agree that Rossi has done more to develop the profile of our sport. He has engaged fans from 60yr women to children who previously may have been interested, but are now real fans attending meetings. Just look at the attendance at the GP's before he worked his way to the top level.
There are so many it is always going to be a very diificult debate.
Hissy is quite a personal one for me having watched him race so much for so many years . . .
One thing that got me racing the amount I do was the sight of Trevor Nation and Steve Spray, on the JPS Norton's coming down Revett's making the assembled Japanese machinery look like they'd missed top gear, I was hooked Game over for 16 weekends a year and a chunk of money 
Steve Hislop - I was there when he broke the MotoGP lap record on a production based Ducati at Donington, not once, but 6 times that weekend. I was also there to shed a tear at Oulton Park when Stuart Easton rode White Charger round in the rain, a very sad day to be a race fan. My favourite signed picture on the wall at home is Hissy on white charger at the TT.
I remember being at Knicker Brook when Hissy took Reynolds going up Clay Hill, on the inside a full chat, there's probably only a handful of people on the world who could have pulled that move off withouth upsetting Reynolds or his race line, and he was one of them.
Foggy - On his day untouchable, King of Assen.
Doohan - Dominated.
Hailwood - To come back after all those years and win at the Island . .
Yer Maun - 26 TT wins, and a more genuine racer harder to find anywhere.
Agree that Rossi has done more to develop the profile of our sport. He has engaged fans from 60yr women to children who previously may have been interested, but are now real fans attending meetings. Just look at the attendance at the GP's before he worked his way to the top level.
There are so many it is always going to be a very diificult debate.
Hissy is quite a personal one for me having watched him race so much for so many years . . .
One thing that got me racing the amount I do was the sight of Trevor Nation and Steve Spray, on the JPS Norton's coming down Revett's making the assembled Japanese machinery look like they'd missed top gear, I was hooked
Game over for 16 weekends a year and a chunk of money Not going to include todays era as traction control has taken over....
So for me Wayne Rainey, Revin Kevin and Rossi.
At the TT I like the fact Fogarty smashed the lap record on a OWO1 for years, until litre bikes where on the scene, however don't respect Fogarty's opinion of people.
British Super Bikes Chris Walker year 2000 with Hodgson was superb.
World Super Bikes Bayliss.
So for me Wayne Rainey, Revin Kevin and Rossi.
At the TT I like the fact Fogarty smashed the lap record on a OWO1 for years, until litre bikes where on the scene, however don't respect Fogarty's opinion of people.
British Super Bikes Chris Walker year 2000 with Hodgson was superb.
World Super Bikes Bayliss.
Giacomo Agostini was the most succesful racer ever. No question.
http://www.crash.net/motorsport/motogp/racer_bio/2...
Just reading through this has made me stop and think....
Is someone trying to emulate this man??
http://www.crash.net/motorsport/motogp/racer_bio/2...
Just reading through this has made me stop and think....
Is someone trying to emulate this man??
Edited by veetwin on Tuesday 19th February 12:21
This is the impossible question!
There's so many contributing factors from so many era's. If you go right back you'll find the fella's who were racing at 100mph+ on the Island (not average!), in the 30's on what were basically good dirt roads in places!
Certainly don't think you can say that things were easier back in the Hailwood/Ago days. You've got to remember that in those days the road races (TT's) were a part of the GP series, so there wasn't the 'specialist' road riders like you get today. Also, a Manx Norton could be tuned far easier by a privateer team to be seriously competitve than an NSR/RCV211 (or whatever we're upto!).
Had it not been so dangerous back then I think there'd be a lot more names being mentioned that didn't make it...
For my money though, it'd be a split decision between Hailwood and Rossi. But that's just my opinion!
There's so many contributing factors from so many era's. If you go right back you'll find the fella's who were racing at 100mph+ on the Island (not average!), in the 30's on what were basically good dirt roads in places!
Certainly don't think you can say that things were easier back in the Hailwood/Ago days. You've got to remember that in those days the road races (TT's) were a part of the GP series, so there wasn't the 'specialist' road riders like you get today. Also, a Manx Norton could be tuned far easier by a privateer team to be seriously competitve than an NSR/RCV211 (or whatever we're upto!).
Had it not been so dangerous back then I think there'd be a lot more names being mentioned that didn't make it...
For my money though, it'd be a split decision between Hailwood and Rossi. But that's just my opinion!
Johno said:
Steve Hislop - I was there when he broke the MotoGP lap record on a production based Ducati at Donington, not once, but 6 times that weekend. I was also there to shed a tear at Oulton Park when Stuart Easton rode White Charger round in the rain, a very sad day to be a race fan. My favourite signed picture on the wall at home is Hissy on white charger at the TT.
I remember being at Knicker Brook when Hissy took Reynolds going up Clay Hill, on the inside a full chat, there's probably only a handful of people on the world who could have pulled that move off withouth upsetting Reynolds or his race line, and he was one of them.
Hissy is quite a personal one for me having watched him race so much for so many years . . .
I'll second that. Courtesy of a friend in the Monstermob team I got to see and meet Hissy a number of times and was struck by what a nice, down to earth lad he was. Hissy's biggest problem was Hissy. If he got his proper race face on he was unbeatable but he had to sort his head out to do it. A very poignant poem was handed to mourners at his graveside after the Service, which now sits in a huge framed photo of him in my local. A fantastic racer who was a great loss to the sport.I remember being at Knicker Brook when Hissy took Reynolds going up Clay Hill, on the inside a full chat, there's probably only a handful of people on the world who could have pulled that move off withouth upsetting Reynolds or his race line, and he was one of them.
Hissy is quite a personal one for me having watched him race so much for so many years . . .
Agostini, Duke or Hailwood.
No one has mentioned John Surtees yet - 7 World Championships in 4 years on 350 and 500cc bikes, 49 Grand Prix with 38 wins and 45 podium finishes, that's only 4 races that he didn't finish 1st, 2nd or 3rd. And he won the Isle of Man Senior TT 3 years in a row. Then in 1960 at the age of 26 he moved to Formula One and 4 years later was Formula One World Champion. No one had ever done that double before or since.
And long overdue a Knighthood.
No one has mentioned John Surtees yet - 7 World Championships in 4 years on 350 and 500cc bikes, 49 Grand Prix with 38 wins and 45 podium finishes, that's only 4 races that he didn't finish 1st, 2nd or 3rd. And he won the Isle of Man Senior TT 3 years in a row. Then in 1960 at the age of 26 he moved to Formula One and 4 years later was Formula One World Champion. No one had ever done that double before or since.
And long overdue a Knighthood.
My twopennarth would be someone like Surtees or Hailwood or even Phil Read. Only because on a typical race weekend, either would be out on:
1] 250 cc four or twin or a six
2] 350cc four or twin or perhaps six cylinder
3] 500cc single or four cylinder
4] Some guys mixed two stroke and four stroke on a race day or even single and multi cylinders depending on class. Discs on some drums on others and horror of horrors right and left hand gear shifts to cope with too !
Some of the current crop of riders could cope with this, like Edwards or Rossi or perhaps West but the modern electronics dependants like Stoner or Hayden would be lost
Allan
1] 250 cc four or twin or a six
2] 350cc four or twin or perhaps six cylinder
3] 500cc single or four cylinder
4] Some guys mixed two stroke and four stroke on a race day or even single and multi cylinders depending on class. Discs on some drums on others and horror of horrors right and left hand gear shifts to cope with too !
Some of the current crop of riders could cope with this, like Edwards or Rossi or perhaps West but the modern electronics dependants like Stoner or Hayden would be lost
Allan
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