Farmer Kills Green Lane Biker

[LordHaveMurci]

Willy Nilly said:

You don't seriously think they were lost do you? They were riding without permission on his land. It doesn't matter whether they were walking, walking dogs, riding horses or riding bikes. They were trespassing. The land owner gave chase, the car tipped over onto one of them tough titty.

We have someone who seems to think my employers land is fine to trample over. Her husband has threatened a colleague, she has had a visit from the law and still continues to use our land has her own. Do we have to have the whole farm security fenced?

A little harsh? My neighbours frequently reverse onto my drive or wheel their bins over my lawn, it annoys me but doesn't give me the right to kill them surely?!

[odyssey2200]

Willy Nilly said:

PaulMoor said:

Willy Nilly said:

Only in the UK can people trespass and the land owner end up in court.

Because killing someone doing no harm to you is ok... one of the people in my block of flats keeps leaving their bicycle in my parking space (which I own). Should I be aloud to run him over too?

I hate to break it to you, but the land these people were riding on is rather key to the land owners business. Would they ride across the pitch at Wembley? How about around your garden?

You are a T@t

You think that makes it guy?

[Efbe]

VinceFox said:

3doorPete said:

VinceFox said:

Disgusting. Absolutely disgusting.

Sorry chaps, but this is a proper piss boiler for me. That poor bloke died under a fking land rover, how close was the driver following him for that to happen ffs? He wasnt a burglar, mugger or anything like that. He was a bloke out for a ride, albeit in the wrong place.

Very fking brave.

+1 - Burglars, gyppos are free rein in my book and trespassing is not good, but to mow down 2 bikers in anger over very little... He admits 'wanting to frighten them' to the police and said at the scene that 'you were on my land' after you've critically injured someone is just a joke.

That's manslaughter all day long if the facts are as reported.

Agreed. Youd have to be a very special brand of wker to do that.

This is such a mental situation.

I have been in a similar situations, out green-laning in unfamiliar territory just using OS maps. It can be bloody hard finding the correct route, and not straying off the wrong way as green lanes often end up as smaller paths than the private farm roads right next to them!
I have met farmers and land owners before, if I have been unsure of where I was I have always stopped to ask them for help, but the idea that someone would try and run you down is unimaginable. what a complete prick.

[Willy Nilly]

VinceFox said:

Willy Nilly said:

srob said:

Willy Nilly said:

Only in the UK can people trespass and the land owner end up in court.

What?

They said they got lost. Should you be allowed to kill people that get lost and end up on your land?

How about the postman, is he fair game too?

You don't seriously think they were lost do you? They were riding without permission on his land. It doesn't matter whether they were walking, walking dogs, riding horses or riding bikes. They were trespassing. The land owner gave chase, the car tipped over onto one of them tough titty.

We have someone who seems to think my employers land is fine to trample over. Her husband has threatened a colleague, she has had a visit from the law and still continues to use our land has her own. Do we have to have the whole farm security fenced?

Yeah, youre right. fking run her over, thatll teach them.

and what would you suggest? She was walking in our crop while my colleague was spraying, he rightly gave her a bking for being in in the crop and being no where near the foot path. her husnad then drivers through the standing crop, then follows my colleague back to the yard and both him and his son threaten the sprayer driver. So then, how would you deal with people like this? Have a nice cordial word with them.

[Willy Nilly]

LordHaveMurci said:

Willy Nilly said:

You don't seriously think they were lost do you? They were riding without permission on his land. It doesn't matter whether they were walking, walking dogs, riding horses or riding bikes. They were trespassing. The land owner gave chase, the car tipped over onto one of them tough titty.

We have someone who seems to think my employers land is fine to trample over. Her husband has threatened a colleague, she has had a visit from the law and still continues to use our land has her own. Do we have to have the whole farm security fenced?

A little harsh? My neighbours frequently reverse onto my drive or wheel their bins over my lawn, it annoys me but doesn't give me the right to kill them surely?!

Not the same as cutting up land with bikes. They are little more than vandals.

[LordHaveMurci]

Willy Nilly said:

Not the same as cutting up land with bikes. They are little more than vandals.

Glad I'm not a farmer, not a decision I'd like to make. What next, stringing cheese wire across the tracks they use?

[odyssey2200]

article said:

They had gone across the stubble field owned by Mr Wolfe to try to find another route, but found it blocked and so the men went back, the court heard.

No Crops involved or damaged.

On the other hand maybe we can all start taking pot shots at ramblers now.

[VinceFox]

Willy Nilly said:

VinceFox said:

Willy Nilly said:

srob said:

Willy Nilly said:

Only in the UK can people trespass and the land owner end up in court.

What?

They said they got lost. Should you be allowed to kill people that get lost and end up on your land?

How about the postman, is he fair game too?

You don't seriously think they were lost do you? They were riding without permission on his land. It doesn't matter whether they were walking, walking dogs, riding horses or riding bikes. They were trespassing. The land owner gave chase, the car tipped over onto one of them tough titty.

We have someone who seems to think my employers land is fine to trample over. Her husband has threatened a colleague, she has had a visit from the law and still continues to use our land has her own. Do we have to have the whole farm security fenced?

Yeah, youre right. fking run her over, thatll teach them.

and what would you suggest? She was walking in our crop while my colleague was spraying, he rightly gave her a bking for being in in the crop and being no where near the foot path. her husnad then drivers through the standing crop, then follows my colleague back to the yard and both him and his son threaten the sprayer driver. So then, how would you deal with people like this? Have a nice cordial word with them.

How i deal with someone being agressive towards me would depend on a great deal of variables. If it came to physical confrontation so be it.


One thing i can pretty much instantly rule out is following someone on a bike dangerously closely over lose surfaced ground in a very large vehicle. Ive seen bikers killed, ive stood at their funerals, ive watched churches full of grown men and families in disbelief and grief over the sharp reminder of how delicate all life is and that those in cars under any circumstance should always be mindful that a rider can be killed in the blink of an eye and nothing on earth can undo it.

We're not going to agree on this one mate, so with the greatest of respect you're entitled to your opinion.

[black-k1]

Willy Nilly said:

PaulMoor said:

Willy Nilly said:

Only in the UK can people trespass and the land owner end up in court.

Because killing someone doing no harm to you is ok... one of the people in my block of flats keeps leaving their bicycle in my parking space (which I own). Should I be aloud to run him over too?

I hate to break it to you, but the land these people were riding on is rather key to the land owners business. Would they ride across the pitch at Wembley? How about around your garden?

I think there is a big difference between siding across a stubble field and riding across a garden/Wembly with regards to the amount of damage done. Had the farmer got a crop in the field that he was about to harvest then I could understand his problem but stubble ...?

Either way, no one wins in a case like this. It's a tragedy for all involved.

[Chicken Chaser]

How do we know that they werent the scrotes that illegally ride on land which they shouldnt be? I'm all for people using lanes etc but I've seen guys who I would imagine live in caravans, in camo jackets thrashing up and around the walkways in the North York Moors on big trailies. Not having all the facts, it doesn't look good for the farmer. Just because they were on a motorbike, doesnt mean they were bikers. I'm not condoning the farmers behaviour (absolutely not as he was still very much in the wrong) but its not just black & white. It never is.

[J B L]

Sorry WN but still... OK, you are probably right on the fact that they weren't lost. It's quite difficult not to notice you are on a ploughed field. However, October in Hampshire might be ploughed but not sowed, provided they were riding on the field and not the headland anyway.

Secondly, an old bloke in a Land Rover managed to catch up with trail bikes, enough not to be able to stop in time! Doesn't sound like they were pushing and digging ruts. A stern word would have put most people right. I know quite a lot of farmers and farm managers and they usually have their own, honest way with words.

They may have been lost or not, it might be that this group was just one of many to cross his land. The article leaves far too much facts out that will ever be known only by the bikers and the farmer, but eventually harming/killing is never going to be the answer. Too many lives ruined there.

[Allyc85]

Willy Nilly said:

srob said:

Willy Nilly said:

Only in the UK can people trespass and the land owner end up in court.

What?

They said they got lost. Should you be allowed to kill people that get lost and end up on your land?

How about the postman, is he fair game too?

You don't seriously think they were lost do you? They were riding without permission on his land. It doesn't matter whether they were walking, walking dogs, riding horses or riding bikes. They were trespassing. The land owner gave chase, the car tipped over onto one of them tough titty.

We have someone who seems to think my employers land is fine to trample over. Her husband has threatened a colleague, she has had a visit from the law and still continues to use our land has her own. Do we have to have the whole farm security fenced?

So its ok to kill someone then? what a c unt you are!

[PaulMoor]

Willy Nilly said:

I hate to break it to you, but the land these people were riding on is rather key to the land owners business. Would they ride across the pitch at Wembley? How about around your garden?

If they were ridding across my garden? Trashing the place? (If I had a garden) I would write down there number plate and call the police, not Chase them down and run them over. I wouldn't try and run them over if the were doing doughnuts in my livingroom. The farmer was in the wrong, your wrong. No matter what they were doing he should not have done that, no matter how rude they may have been or how far off the road.

Edited by PaulMoor on Saturday 25th February 22:02

[New POD]

PaulMoor said:

Willy Nilly said:

Only in the UK can people trespass and the land owner end up in court.

Because killing someone doing no harm to you is ok... one of the people in my block of flats keeps leaving their bicycle in my parking space (which I own). Should I be allowed to run him over too?

Am I allowed to correct your duff spelling without being shot ? For crying out aloud !!!

[Condi]

Difficult one, and not half as clear cut as some posters on here seem to think.....

They said they were lost, but were they? I've stopped trails bikes before who said they were lost but I know they've been over the fields before, and wer'nt going in any specific direction. Also if a biker is on your land (remember this isnt public land, but private property, same as your back garden) and is injured then who is responsible? Partly the farmer. Fields often contain unknown hazards, pot holes, stones, fenceposts etc which can throw bikers off, and having seen some bikers tear across paddocks I wouldnt fancy doing those speeds, despite knowing the field and being a competent rider myself. Its pretty obvious the difference between lanes, tracks and stubble fields, so to say they were lost seems a bit thin. If they were down a track and said they were lost then fair enough, but by the sounds of things they were riding around the field and then fled down a track when the farmer went to have words... In what world do you think you're allowed to ride straight across someone elses property because your lost??!

Also they probably wern't the first set of bikers over his land to provoke that sort of reaction; its possible that the farmer had trouble with groups previously and - rightly or wrongly - assumed that these were the same guys.

Finally I highly doubt the farmer intended to injure or kill anyone - it was an accident. If the bikers wern't there in the first place then there wouldnt have been a problem.

[UnderTheRadar]

Agreed. It's a sad outcome but I'm not buying the "lost" theory and it seems to have been an accident.

[Pothole]

Chicken Chaser said:

How do we know that they werent the scrotes that illegally ride on land which they shouldnt be? I'm all for people using lanes etc but I've seen guys who I would imagine live in caravans, in camo jackets thrashing up and around the walkways in the North York Moors on big trailies. Not having all the facts, it doesn't look good for the farmer. Just because they were on a motorbike, doesnt mean they were bikers. I'm not condoning the farmers behaviour (absolutely not as he was still very much in the wrong) but its not just black & white. It never is.

ALL OF YOU ARGUING SHORTSIGHTED MORONS READ THE ABOVE. NONE OF YOU KNOW ALL THE FACTS, YOU JUST KNOW WHAT THE (OFTEN STUPIDLY SENSATIONALIST) BBC HAS PRINTED. UNTIL ALL THE FACTS ARE IN AND THE COURT HAS RULED, THERE IS BLAME ON BOTH SIDES.

[heebeegeetee]

Condi said:

it was an accident.

Er, well it clearly wasn't. The farmer was chasing people at speed in his 4x4, close enough to crash into them. It doesn't take much foresight to be able to see the potential for that to not go well.

[shambolic]

What about the two tts stoating about in the woods the other week with camouflage gear and an air rifle, while we were shooting foxes (uncles a gamekeeper). Would it have been our fault if one of them had been hit after a bullet passed through a fox and continued for half a mile? You always take a shot as safely as possible into a hill etc but bullets can travel far.
They shouldn't have been on the land at all , much less in camo gear with an air rifle.

[vonhosen]

Pothole said:

ALL OF YOU ARGUING SHORTSIGHTED MORONS READ THE ABOVE. NONE OF YOU KNOW ALL THE FACTS, YOU JUST KNOW WHAT THE (OFTEN STUPIDLY SENSATIONALIST) BBC HAS PRINTED. UNTIL ALL THE FACTS ARE IN AND THE COURT HAS RULED, THERE IS BLAME ON BOTH SIDES.

This court is looking at whether the accused is guilty in relation to the law, not who carries blame to what degree.