Discussion
Ok , i realise this has been done a milion times before and i have used the search .
Recently sold my E46 M3 due partly to fuel costs , loss of interest and it being sat in the garage most of the time depreciating.
I am now struggling to find anything paticularly interesting to buy that ticks all the box's main ones being minimal depreciation , future classic insurance and not financialy crippling to run (bmw's are not all they are made out to be ).
have often been drawn to the Chimaera due to the looks and of course the sound and it now looks as if i may be able to pick one up for a reasonable price .
It would not be my only form of transport as wife has car and i have a couple of bikes for fun and commuting.
The all important queastion is , what mpg can i realistically expect ??
Any other advice welcome .
Thanks
Steve
Recently sold my E46 M3 due partly to fuel costs , loss of interest and it being sat in the garage most of the time depreciating.
I am now struggling to find anything paticularly interesting to buy that ticks all the box's main ones being minimal depreciation , future classic insurance and not financialy crippling to run (bmw's are not all they are made out to be ).
have often been drawn to the Chimaera due to the looks and of course the sound and it now looks as if i may be able to pick one up for a reasonable price .
It would not be my only form of transport as wife has car and i have a couple of bikes for fun and commuting.
The all important queastion is , what mpg can i realistically expect ??
Any other advice welcome .
Thanks
Steve
if its fuel costs you are bothered about bare in mind a chim runs best on 98 ron+ (although some say on here that theirs runs fine on normal unleaded) but an m3 can run on normal super which is cheaper and i bet an m3 would get more mpg too i use mine every day, i dont drive all that far and i blow 50 quid a week on fuel, i use tesco 99ron so im restricted on fuel a bit
A Chimaera will run perfectly happily on 95 with the timing set correctly (28 degrees of advance at 2500 - 3000 rpm)
I used to exclusively run mine on V-Power or Tesco's 99, but one day I needed fuel and none was available so I put 95 in.
No performance loss, no pinking, but still unsure as the onset of pinking is often inaudible I took advise from Rob Robertson at V8 Developments.
Rob has probably built hundreds of Rover V8 engines and simply said.
"It's fine to run it on 95, at the end of the day it's a reasonably low compression engine"
In life I have found it's often better to take the advise of people that have significantly more experience than me.
So I continue to run my Chimaera on 95, and it continues to perform well with absolutely no detrimental effects.
MPG is 27 mpg on a motorway run.
Then it gets complicated by the mix of A/B road, how much fun you have, how many cold starts, how much town driving (which kills the economy) ect ect.
Lets say an average of 24mpg with a fair amount of motorway in the mix.
I used to exclusively run mine on V-Power or Tesco's 99, but one day I needed fuel and none was available so I put 95 in.
No performance loss, no pinking, but still unsure as the onset of pinking is often inaudible I took advise from Rob Robertson at V8 Developments.
Rob has probably built hundreds of Rover V8 engines and simply said.
"It's fine to run it on 95, at the end of the day it's a reasonably low compression engine"
In life I have found it's often better to take the advise of people that have significantly more experience than me.
So I continue to run my Chimaera on 95, and it continues to perform well with absolutely no detrimental effects.
MPG is 27 mpg on a motorway run.
Then it gets complicated by the mix of A/B road, how much fun you have, how many cold starts, how much town driving (which kills the economy) ect ect.
Lets say an average of 24mpg with a fair amount of motorway in the mix.
i just dont think an old fashioned 4-5l rover v8 will be as efficient as a sophisticated 3.2 (i think?) bmw straight 6 engine driven reasonably which in all fairness we all do mostly on average, cant M3's get well over 30mpg? not sure any v8 tvr would get that no matter how careful you drive it, im pretty sure mine dont lol, i also find mine seems to more mpg on A roads rather than a motorway cos speeds are averagely closer to the optimum efficiency of 56.6mph, where as on a motorway speeds are averagely a lot higher, so therefore burning more, that what i put it down to any way
im not suggesting they wont run on 95, im sure they can, i dont claim to be an expert about this but all the mags ive read and programmes ive seen on tv say that perfomance engines respond much better to higher grade fuel, perfomance wise and mpg, not so much small engined cars but larger more highly tuned engines do, i know mine runes like a bag of poo if i use 97 ron and my mates did too, so i stick to tesco 99 cos its cheaper than v power and i bet you,d loose 10 or so horsepower on 95 ron too if you were to rolling road it any way, all inm saying is, if you got rid of your m3 on economy grounds then im sure you'd be worse off with a big old fashioned v8
Andy chimaera said:
i just dont think an old fashioned 4-5l rover v8 will be as efficient as a sophisticated 3.2 (i think?) bmw straight 6 engine driven reasonably which in all fairness we all do mostly on average, cant M3's get well over 30mpg? not sure any v8 tvr would get that no matter how careful you drive it, im pretty sure mine dont lol, i also find mine seems to more mpg on A roads rather than a motorway cos speeds are averagely closer to the optimum efficiency of 56.6mph, where as on a motorway speeds are averagely a lot higher, so therefore burning more, that what i put it down to any way
Some good points here from Andy chimaera.If you are looking at a 4.5 Chim and wanting it to deliver better economy than a 3.2 litre six cylinder BM, you are going to be disappointed.
Consider the Chimaera facts:
- More than a litre more engine capacity
- Two more cylinders = two more mouths to feed
- A 40 year old cylinder head design
- An old school mechanical distributor
- A fuel delivery & metering system designed by Lucas almost 20 years ago
- An ignition system (mechanical distributor) that dates back to the 1930's
If you think all that will add up to better economy than your old BMW you are deluded.
HOWEVER THERE IS WAY MORE TO IT THAN FUEL ECONOMY SURELY?
The Chimaera is mostly a collection of cheap parts from other mass produced cars.
If you buy a good one and maintain it properly there is no reason why (overall) it will not work out to be a very economical car to run.
If you have any soul and love traditional sports cars with old school character the Chimaera will be a massive step up from your BM.
Just make sure you read everything on here and listen to advise from others that have been running one of these fantastic cars for a while.
In my opinion it's much better to view a TVR Chimaera along side a typical classic car (all be it a quick one), if you look at it like this a Chimaera is an amazing bargain & you will be less frustrated by it's little foibles.
In summary, it's all about the way you look at it.
If you are honest with yourself, go into the whole TVR thing with your eyes wide open & do some research on here you will end up addicted like the rest of us.
Edited by Chimpafrolic on Sunday 10th July 16:47
Andy chimaera said:
im not suggesting they wont run on 95, im sure they can, i dont claim to be an expert about this but all the mags ive read and programmes ive seen on tv say that perfomance engines respond much better to higher grade fuel, perfomance wise and mpg, not so much small engined cars but larger more highly tuned engines do, i know mine runes like a bag of poo if i use 97 ron and my mates did too, so i stick to tesco 99 cos its cheaper than v power and i bet you,d loose 10 or so horsepower on 95 ron too if you were to rolling road it any way, all inm saying is, if you got rid of your m3 on economy grounds then im sure you'd be worse off with a big old fashioned v8
Andy, absolutely no question a car should produce more power on a higher octane fuel.But only if you have a half modern ignition system with a piezo-crystal knock sensor, or you push the advance right to the danger point.
If you showed a Chimaera/Land Rover Lucas distributor to my Grand Dad, he would feel right at home.
With everything standard and set up as it should be, 95 is not an issue.
I'd have thought the E46 to be more than capable of 30+ on a run, whereas that's about the maximum for a Chim on a run but with less weight than the E46 you'll find the average is quite close.
You sound like you just need to know (as I did) weather it's really thirsty like an old American v8 say or if it's actually not too bad. Due to it's light weight they're not too bad on average.
Traffic does hit MPG hard or rather, because you're not moving, you're not getting the benefits of the relatively low weight of the car, so all you're left with is the RV8 sitting there drinking fuel! Hope that makes sense!
You sound like you just need to know (as I did) weather it's really thirsty like an old American v8 say or if it's actually not too bad. Due to it's light weight they're not too bad on average.
Traffic does hit MPG hard or rather, because you're not moving, you're not getting the benefits of the relatively low weight of the car, so all you're left with is the RV8 sitting there drinking fuel! Hope that makes sense!
Chimpafrolic said:
Andy chimaera said:
i just dont think an old fashioned 4-5l rover v8 will be as efficient as a sophisticated 3.2 (i think?) bmw straight 6 engine driven reasonably which in all fairness we all do mostly on average, cant M3's get well over 30mpg? not sure any v8 tvr would get that no matter how careful you drive it, im pretty sure mine dont lol, i also find mine seems to more mpg on A roads rather than a motorway cos speeds are averagely closer to the optimum efficiency of 56.6mph, where as on a motorway speeds are averagely a lot higher, so therefore burning more, that what i put it down to any way
Some good points here from Andy chimaera.If you are looking at a 4.5 Chim and wanting it to deliver better economy than a 3.2 litre six cylinder BM, you are going to be disappointed.
Consider the Chimaera facts:
- More than a litre more engine capacity
- Two more cylinders = two more mouths to feed
- A 40 year old cylinder head design
- An old school mechanical distributor
- A fuel delivery & metering system designed by Lucas almost 20 years ago
- An ignition system (mechanical distributor) that dates back to the 1930's
If you think all that will add up to better economy than your old BMW you are deluded.
HOWEVER THERE IS WAY MORE TO IT THAN FUEL ECONOMY SURELY?
The Chimaera is mostly a collection of cheap parts from other mass produced cars.
If you buy a good one and maintain it properly there is no reason why (overall) it will not work out to be a very economical car to run.
If you have any soul and love traditional sports cars with old school character the Chimaera will be a massive step up from your BM.
Just make sure you read everything on here and listen to advise from others that have been running one of these fantastic cars for a while.
In my opinion it's much better to view a TVR Chimaera along side a typical classic car (all be it a quick one), if you look at it like this a Chimaera is an amazing bargain & you will be less frustrated by it's little foibles.
In summary, it's all about the way you look at it.
If you are honest with yourself, go into the whole TVR thing with your eyes wide open & do some research on here you will end up addicted like the rest of us.
Edited by Chimpafrolic on Sunday 10th July 16:47
To put in perspective i ride an MV Agusta and for a bike it has terrible fuel consumption but the performance and the sense of riding something extra special makes it all worthwhile .
Have in the past owned a couple of air cooled 911's and would love another but good ones for the money i have available are so rare , i have also never owned a V8 and love the individuality of the TVR interior and sound ,i am also probably getting to old for getting in and out of an Elise and my wife just wouldn't entertain it .
Regarding the costs i would expect the TVR to cost less to insure ,tax and service than something like a Boxster and also for a budget of around 8-9 k ish would expect it not to lose to much more money which will compensate for the MPG . Really i dont mind paying for the enjoyment of driving the car but not for just having it sat in the garage , does this make sense ?
I only do 3-4 K miles in a car per year mostly when its to cold and icy to use a bike (bmw not the MV)and when with my daughter , yes i realise that the Chim is not the perfect winter car but i just can't bring myself to buy a diesel hatchback .
Welcome any feedback , don't often keep cars more than a couple of years but this may change as the process of buying seems to take to much time these days .
I have alot of itch's i need to scratch and the TVR is one of them .
Andy chimaera said:
i just dont think an old fashioned 4-5l rover v8 will be as efficient as a sophisticated 3.2 (i think?) bmw straight 6 engine driven reasonably which in all fairness we all do mostly on average, cant M3's get well over 30mpg? not sure any v8 tvr would get that no matter how careful you drive it, im pretty sure mine dont lol, i also find mine seems to more mpg on A roads rather than a motorway cos speeds are averagely closer to the optimum efficiency of 56.6mph, where as on a motorway speeds are averagely a lot higher, so therefore burning more, that what i put it down to any way
yes but the M3 is no where near as quick..I raced two 3.3 M3`s and they did not stand a chance .Videos to follow
Edited by SILICONEKID340HP on Sunday 10th July 18:02
steve1968 said:
Yes of course there is more to it than fuel economy and part of the reason behind selling the M3 was the fuel cost against what i was getting back in sense of ocassion etc
To put in perspective i ride an MV Agusta and for a bike it has terrible fuel consumption but the performance and the sense of riding something extra special makes it all worthwhile .
Have in the past owned a couple of air cooled 911's and would love another but good ones for the money i have available are so rare , i have also never owned a V8 and love the individuality of the TVR interior and sound ,i am also probably getting to old for getting in and out of an Elise and my wife just wouldn't entertain it .
Regarding the costs i would expect the TVR to cost less to insure ,tax and service than something like a Boxster and also for a budget of around 8-9 k ish would expect it not to lose to much more money which will compensate for the MPG . Really i dont mind paying for the enjoyment of driving the car but not for just having it sat in the garage , does this make sense ?
I only do 3-4 K miles in a car per year mostly when its to cold and icy to use a bike (bmw not the MV)and when with my daughter , yes i realise that the Chim is not the perfect winter car but i just can't bring myself to buy a diesel hatchback .
Welcome any feedback , don't often keep cars more than a couple of years but this may change as the process of buying seems to take to much time these days .
I have alot of itch's i need to scratch and the TVR is one of them .
I have read everything you have said above and it is obvious, even to the irreversibly blind............To put in perspective i ride an MV Agusta and for a bike it has terrible fuel consumption but the performance and the sense of riding something extra special makes it all worthwhile .
Have in the past owned a couple of air cooled 911's and would love another but good ones for the money i have available are so rare , i have also never owned a V8 and love the individuality of the TVR interior and sound ,i am also probably getting to old for getting in and out of an Elise and my wife just wouldn't entertain it .
Regarding the costs i would expect the TVR to cost less to insure ,tax and service than something like a Boxster and also for a budget of around 8-9 k ish would expect it not to lose to much more money which will compensate for the MPG . Really i dont mind paying for the enjoyment of driving the car but not for just having it sat in the garage , does this make sense ?
I only do 3-4 K miles in a car per year mostly when its to cold and icy to use a bike (bmw not the MV)and when with my daughter , yes i realise that the Chim is not the perfect winter car but i just can't bring myself to buy a diesel hatchback .
Welcome any feedback , don't often keep cars more than a couple of years but this may change as the process of buying seems to take to much time these days .
I have alot of itch's i need to scratch and the TVR is one of them .
You will absolutely love a Chimaera.
Clearly you have excellent automotive taste and a passion for the very essence of what a real car should be.
I would try one or two at a dealer, they all drive differently.
The design is fundamentally excellent, the execution was often what let the design down.
But the problems are nearly allways little things, and have often been solved by past owners at their expense.
That's why higher mileage shouldn't scare you off, these cars started their post delivery quality checks the day they went to their first owner, the development work was also taken on by the first & subsequent owners.
Read a bit more here & buy the best one you can find privately at the best price you can negotiate.
It's a bit like buying a house, if you buy a fixer it will always cost you more than one that someone else has spent a fortune sorting out.
Try and find one with the outriggers done, new adjustable dampers & perhaps a new cam.
Talk to the vendor and ask yourself "is this a genuine & honest guy"
If you do all that then I bet you will absolutely love your new Chimaera.
Good luck and keep in touch on here, ask as many sensible questions as you see fit and people will help you.
Dave.
steve1968 said:
Commute to work is only 10 miles dual carriage way and 3 miles of B roads , will a 4L give me 24 mpg ? Thats all i got out of the M3.
It shouldn't be far off. The Chim does seem to gulp fuel in stop/start town driving but is pretty decent once on the move. As others have said, it's an old school design so it wont have all the fine fuel adjustments that your M3 has to help it. Why it does well at A-road and moderate motorway speeds is a combination of light weight and a very lazy unstressed engine...not because it is in any way 'clever' with the fuel. The aero dynamics are shocking though, so if your pushing the 'normal' outside lane speeds it will probably start to gulp again.
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