GAZ GOLD PROS NODDING DOG
Discussion
?haircutmike said:
Sounds like the damping is too soft.
Click up 4 all round and try. If better, click up 2 all round, test on same road and increase or decrease again if necessary.
You have completly different far better monotubes so very different to these GGP`s .Click up 4 all round and try. If better, click up 2 all round, test on same road and increase or decrease again if necessary.
I thought the nodding front end is caused by being set to hard ..
taylormj4 said:
Why would the car nod anyhow. Shocks are supposed to damp oscillations like this, surely you can't set them so soft that they don't actually damp properly else that would be an MOT fail and downright dangerous to drive ?
Matt
depends on the weight of the car. the dampers will need to be set to the cars weight, and braking transfer characteristics. (and driver preference) If they are set too soft, then there is little damping, and whatever "bump" caused the initial bounce, the bouncing will just continue. remember that the aftermarket units are made to be adjustable for a range of vehicles, and seem to come with a note "to be installed by a qualified mechanic" or similair, Matt
I've spent a few years tuning mine. Although this is mainly personal I have found 23F & 26R from soft to be ideal for fast road use while remianing bearable for the average British pot holed roads.
i suggest yours may be set far too soft - try adjusting them to either extreme, then in the middle and find settings that suit your car by fine tuning.
i suggest yours may be set far too soft - try adjusting them to either extreme, then in the middle and find settings that suit your car by fine tuning.
SILICONEKID340HP said:
Front 150mm ,rear 175mm to the jacking points (corner plates)
Where did you buy them and who gave you the initial settings?..To save me typing heres an explanation from the GTR forum
"In a shock that is single adjustable via shaft needle like the Aragosta, the adjustment has a much larger effect on the rebound of the shock than the compression (about 90/10 ratio) So a 1 click will affect the compression only about 10% of what it affects the rebound. So for simplicity sake think only of rebound when adjusting. Basically stiffer rebound(slower shaft extension) will accomplish several things. If set too stiff the suspension will not extend fast enough after being compressed making it harsh as the wheel "hangs" and the car will chatter and loose grip on rough roads(the braking problem you mention if set too stiff). Likewise too soft and the car will feel "floaty" (The nodding you mention). Basically as a rule go full soft and start adding damping until the chassis starts to feel settled(the nodding goes away), generally you want to find the point where the shock extends as fast as possible to maintain road contact, while still keeping the chassis settled. So there is a window with a given spring rate that will be a sweet spot. You can tune a few clicks either way to adjust balance. Stiffer on the front will cause the front to rise more slowly on acceleration and give better front end bite, softer and the front will rise quickly and tend to understeer. On the rear stiffer rebound will tend to cause understeer under braking as the back end will rise more slowly, less rebound and the car will tend to oversteer more on the brakes."
haircutmike said:
Sounds like the damping is too soft.
Click up 4 all round and try. If better, click up 2 all round, test on same road and increase or decrease again if necessary.
Daz, I think you would do well to listen to haircutmike on this subject.Click up 4 all round and try. If better, click up 2 all round, test on same road and increase or decrease again if necessary.
While it may at first seem counterintuitive to increase the damping to solve your bobbing, it is in fact exactly what you need to do.
On the advice of the manufacturer I went up two clicks on my newly fitted GGPs and it did improve the bobbing issue, currently your dampers are fighting the springs and losing the battle to control their natural state of oscillation.
The stiffer your spring the more damping control you will need, the springs are new & will soften slightly as they settle.
At this point you can start to experiment with reducing the damper settings.
In simple terms the most important factors surrounding damping is it's requirement to be carefully matched to:
1) The unsprung mass (wheels, hubs & brakes)
2) The sprung mass (body, engine, transmission, passengers ect)
3) The spring load rating itself
4) The pneumatic suspension provided by the tyres (significantly altered by tyre pressure, pneumatic volume, sidewall rigidity, profile ect)
In truth there are way more settings on the Gaz Gold Pros than you will ever use, because from what I can tell most of them are completely unsuitable to the spring rating & sprung mass of the car.
The only advantage to having so many settings is the benefit it gives to the Gaz marketing department.
That doesn’t make the GGPs bad units, but you do have to accept the only truly usable adjustment range is no more than three or four clicks either side of twelve clicks from fully soft point.
When the springs are new the dampers definitely need to be set to the higher end of this scale, try fifteen clicks from soft all round, go for a drive, then back the rears off one or two clicks.
As they settle you will find you can start backing the dampers off a fraction more, when the springs have fully settled you will also need to re-set the ride height and rake.
Setting the ride height & rake correctly is critical to stability but will have a minimal effect on the bobbing you describe.
Only after the springs have fully settled will you stand any chance of getting everything to work in harmony.
It's important to remember all suspension systems are ultimately a compromise between road holding & comfort, & comfort is a very subjective thing.
One man's comfortable is another man’s idea of a harsh uncompromising ride.
Finally let’s not forget this is a TVR and the GGPs are built to a certain price point.
If you want a sophisticated magic carpet ride you are driving the wrong car!
OK will start at 15 all round ,Don`t understnd why it is so complicated ,Euro boxes with 25 quid a corner after market absorbers seem to ride better.!
These have been fitted to alot of Chimaera`s so must be a setting close enough.
The reason i lifted the ride height is becuse it was to low and it now rides better and the steering feels better.
Don`t think 150mm 175mm is not to far out .!
These have been fitted to alot of Chimaera`s so must be a setting close enough.
The reason i lifted the ride height is becuse it was to low and it now rides better and the steering feels better.
Don`t think 150mm 175mm is not to far out .!
Does changing the ride height affect the other settings of the wheel alignments or are the two things independant?
I also found out that new shocks and springs take a few hundred miles to bed in and I had a full alignment/geo set-up by Dan Taylor at that point with new drop links and very happy with how it all works.
I also found out that new shocks and springs take a few hundred miles to bed in and I had a full alignment/geo set-up by Dan Taylor at that point with new drop links and very happy with how it all works.
TV8 said:
Does changing the ride height affect the other settings of the wheel alignments or are the two things independant?
I also found out that new shocks and springs take a few hundred miles to bed in and I had a full alignment/geo set-up by Dan Taylor at that point with new drop links and very happy with how it all works.
Your probably right but i need the springs to settle in before the 4 wheel alignment plus i have not got round to changing the rear end to poly bushes .I also found out that new shocks and springs take a few hundred miles to bed in and I had a full alignment/geo set-up by Dan Taylor at that point with new drop links and very happy with how it all works.
The next problem is all these so called specialists have there own ideas ..Mine was setup for track days for some reason so it drives like a pig ..
SILICONEKID340HP said:
OK will start at 15 all round ,Don`t understnd why it is so complicated ,Euro boxes with 25 quid a corner after market absorbers seem to ride better.!
These have been fitted to alot of Chimaera`s so must be a setting close enough.
The reason i lifted the ride height is becuse it was to low and it now rides better and the steering feels better.
Don`t think 150mm 175mm is not to far out .!
I can't recall exactly what the ride height should, and the search is down, but I seem to have 145 front and 155 rear, but the rear should definately be higher by around 10-15mm. It is measured from the triangular supports on the outriggers, ie just behind the front arch and just in front of the rear arch. Your settings seem too high at the back end and the difference between the two ends is too great. These have been fitted to alot of Chimaera`s so must be a setting close enough.
The reason i lifted the ride height is becuse it was to low and it now rides better and the steering feels better.
Don`t think 150mm 175mm is not to far out .!
FFG
Mark. said:
Daz, have you rung an indie and see how many clicks they recommend? I asked Andy what he set mine at when he fitted them thing is I can't remember what he said, but they were spot on.
I don`t have much to do with indies ! try to Keep away from them but once the poly bushes are fitted , covered some miles i need a decent company to do the wheel alignment ..Emailed Steve GUGLIELMI but it put me off when i was told it`s going to cost £350 plus to adjust four bolts ..
Is it possible to have a compromise between road and track or is it one or the other ?
Did that price come from Guglielmi or someone else Daz?
And which 4 bolts do you think he's adjusting?
I, and 2 other Griff owners - both well respected on here - had our geometry settings sorted out by Steve Guglielmi and the price wasn't anything near £340
Mine was less than £150 and it only got a bit more expensive for one of the guys when they had to resort to applying heat to a seized front wishbone adjuster - the one inside the tube towards the back of the wheelarch.
For me, as a devout worshipper of short-arms / long pockets, it was money well spent.
He not only set up the geo, but correctly reset my damper settings (Gaz Nickels) and test drove it twice - once with me in it to show me how well it handled around a local roundabout
And which 4 bolts do you think he's adjusting?
I, and 2 other Griff owners - both well respected on here - had our geometry settings sorted out by Steve Guglielmi and the price wasn't anything near £340
Mine was less than £150 and it only got a bit more expensive for one of the guys when they had to resort to applying heat to a seized front wishbone adjuster - the one inside the tube towards the back of the wheelarch.
For me, as a devout worshipper of short-arms / long pockets, it was money well spent.
He not only set up the geo, but correctly reset my damper settings (Gaz Nickels) and test drove it twice - once with me in it to show me how well it handled around a local roundabout
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