When is a warranty not a warranty?
Discussion
When you buy a battery from Halfords!
Came back from a week away for work and the car was flat and wouldn't start on Sunday - overnight charge on the Accumate and she kicked into life first thing Monday morning.
This morning she was as flat as a fart again so dug out the receipt for my Halfords "3 Year Warranty" battery that I fitted lat August, squirted in a couple of hours charge to get her going and headed off down to Halfords.
The fella I spoke with there dug out his tester and declared the battery "Unserviceable". He hoiked it into the shop and was about to swap it over when someone asked him whether he'd checked the battery test sheet.
According to the battery test sheet if a battery tests as "Unserviceable" then the salesman is to inform the customer (so says the sheet) that "the battery has been damaged by being over or under charged, this damage is not covered under warranty and you should have your charging circuits checked by an auto electrician before replacing the battery".
(I also saw a note on there that said "Carefully check the battery terminals for signs of scoring or other damage, if present this indicates abuse and the battery is not warranted".)
Anyway - they then refused to swap the battery over so I had to buy a new one.
I didnt have a multimeter handy however pulling up the software for my ECU shows a logged value of 13-14v with the engine running so I'm wondering if I have any kind of recourse - after all the battery that has been "removed" is only 10 months old!
[sigh]
Phil
Came back from a week away for work and the car was flat and wouldn't start on Sunday - overnight charge on the Accumate and she kicked into life first thing Monday morning.
This morning she was as flat as a fart again so dug out the receipt for my Halfords "3 Year Warranty" battery that I fitted lat August, squirted in a couple of hours charge to get her going and headed off down to Halfords.
The fella I spoke with there dug out his tester and declared the battery "Unserviceable". He hoiked it into the shop and was about to swap it over when someone asked him whether he'd checked the battery test sheet.
According to the battery test sheet if a battery tests as "Unserviceable" then the salesman is to inform the customer (so says the sheet) that "the battery has been damaged by being over or under charged, this damage is not covered under warranty and you should have your charging circuits checked by an auto electrician before replacing the battery".
(I also saw a note on there that said "Carefully check the battery terminals for signs of scoring or other damage, if present this indicates abuse and the battery is not warranted".)
Anyway - they then refused to swap the battery over so I had to buy a new one.
I didnt have a multimeter handy however pulling up the software for my ECU shows a logged value of 13-14v with the engine running so I'm wondering if I have any kind of recourse - after all the battery that has been "removed" is only 10 months old!
[sigh]
Phil
Warranty is always a problem. It warrants against manufacturing faults. Things like batteries are susceptible to misuse (allowed to fully drain, overcharge etc)
I'm not saying I agree with the retailer on this particular occasion, but they also need to protect themselves against chancers.
(and for every honest punter, there's plenty that are dodgy)
I'm not saying I agree with the retailer on this particular occasion, but they also need to protect themselves against chancers.
(and for every honest punter, there's plenty that are dodgy)
Phil, things like this really F*** me off, spookily enough i was sitting in my local mcdonalds this weekend next to a halfords and some chap bought a battery back to be tested and you could just see his fustration!!, firstly charge the duff battery and put it back on the car, disconnect a terminal, just incase the car is taking a drain somewhere, leave it for a day or two even for a week or two if you can, connect it back up and if it is flat the battery is a dud, go back to halfords and just say this battery is not fit for the purpose it was sold to me as, speak to the manager and say you will take it further if you dont get your money back or at least a credit note to spend in the shop
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
Warranty is always a problem. It warrants against manufacturing faults. Things like batteries are susceptible to misuse (allowed to fully drain, overcharge etc)
I'm not saying I agree with the retailer on this particular occasion, but they also need to protect themselves against chancers.
(and for every honest punter, there's plenty that are dodgy)
Thing is, how many people on here haven't at some point come back to their car and found it flat?I'm not saying I agree with the retailer on this particular occasion, but they also need to protect themselves against chancers.
(and for every honest punter, there's plenty that are dodgy)
Mine at least had the immobiliser still active...
I'm more annoyed because one of the next jobs on my "list" was to replace the big standard battery that's now in the boot with one or two small units and tuck them out of the way but now I've had to buy a new battery at short notice then I don't really have the same incentive.
Phil
Edited by Bassfiend on Tuesday 3rd July 21:35
Bassfiend said:
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
Warranty is always a problem. It warrants against manufacturing faults. Things like batteries are susceptible to misuse (allowed to fully drain, overcharge etc)
I'm not saying I agree with the retailer on this particular occasion, but they also need to protect themselves against chancers.
(and for every honest punter, there's plenty that are dodgy)
Thing is, how many people on here haven't at some point come back to their car and found it flat?I'm not saying I agree with the retailer on this particular occasion, but they also need to protect themselves against chancers.
(and for every honest punter, there's plenty that are dodgy)
Mine at least had the immobiliser still active...
Phil
SILICONEKID340HP said:
A bettery should take more abuse than that !
If it was me i would throw it through there window
The last place i would buy a battery from is Halfords ..
Now then Daz - you know just how I like to disagree with you so please don't make me agree with you for a change... If it was me i would throw it through there window
The last place i would buy a battery from is Halfords ..
Phil
v8 racing said:
Phil, things like this really F*** me off, spookily enough i was sitting in my local mcdonalds this weekend next to a halfords and some chap bought a battery back to be tested and you could just see his fustration!!, firstly charge the duff battery and put it back on the car, disconnect a terminal, just incase the car is taking a drain somewhere, leave it for a day or two even for a week or two if you can, connect it back up and if it is flat the battery is a dud, go back to halfords and just say this battery is not fit for the purpose it was sold to me as, speak to the manager and say you will take it further if you dont get your money back or at least a credit note to spend in the shop
Thanks - I'll give it a try...Phil
The item sold to you, in this case a battery, has to be "fit for purpose"and after only 10 months it clearly wasnt. If they come back at you again saying that it has been overcharged or under charged, show and explain to them the intelligent brain of your wonderful "accumate" battery conditioner, and ask them again to explain in detail, how its possible to over or under charge a battery with an accumate conditioner. Threaten them with trading standards, and explain to the manager, that you require a full refund for the battery you have just bought, as the original duff battery, should be replaced free of charge. If that fails then f
ck it, just throw the knackered battery thru there window.
ck it, just throw the knackered battery thru there window.
TJC46 said:
The item sold to you, in this case a battery, has to be "fit for purpose"and after only 10 months it clearly wasnt. If they come back at you again saying that it has been overcharged or under charged, show and explain to them the intelligent brain of your wonderful "accumate" battery conditioner, and ask them again to explain in detail, how its possible to over or under charge a battery with an accumate conditioner. Threaten them with trading standards, and explain to the manager, that you require a full refund for the battery you have just bought, as the original duff battery, should be replaced free of charge. If that fails then fck it, just throw the knackered battery thru there window.
^This, the only way he can prove it as been overcharged is if the case is badly swollen and that will be obvious ck it, just throw the knackered battery thru there window.
jobsworth tt 
I cannot see anywhere if you have established that the car is charging ok and not discharging in any way?
But - if it is the battery at fault and their defence to this stupidity is that the battery was over charged or undercharged ask them to prove it. Overcharging buckles the plates and undercharging damages them, the battery needs to be taken apart to prove either.
They can swap it and it costs them nothing they will just back it, you should have had a ruck with the manager, they always take the easy way out.
Why don't people shop at a decent motor factors instead of Halfwits, they are rubbish at everything they do and know nothing about cars.
But - if it is the battery at fault and their defence to this stupidity is that the battery was over charged or undercharged ask them to prove it. Overcharging buckles the plates and undercharging damages them, the battery needs to be taken apart to prove either.
They can swap it and it costs them nothing they will just back it, you should have had a ruck with the manager, they always take the easy way out.
Why don't people shop at a decent motor factors instead of Halfwits, they are rubbish at everything they do and know nothing about cars.
I purchased a Bosch battery at Halfords with the 5 yr warranty. 18mths into its life it wasnt retaining its charge. When my car went in for a service i asked the indie to drop round and get a new one and handed them the receipt. They swapped it over no hassle. May depend on which branch you go to.
Ribol said:
I cannot see anywhere if you have established that the car is charging ok and not discharging in any way?
But - if it is the battery at fault and their defence to this stupidity is that the battery was over charged or undercharged ask them to prove it. Overcharging buckles the plates and undercharging damages them, the battery needs to be taken apart to prove either.
They can swap it and it costs them nothing they will just back it, you should have had a ruck with the manager, they always take the easy way out.
Why don't people shop at a decent motor factors instead of Halfwits, they are rubbish at everything they do and know nothing about cars.
Unfortunately our local CAF closes early so Halfwits are the only place I can get to after work...But - if it is the battery at fault and their defence to this stupidity is that the battery was over charged or undercharged ask them to prove it. Overcharging buckles the plates and undercharging damages them, the battery needs to be taken apart to prove either.
They can swap it and it costs them nothing they will just back it, you should have had a ruck with the manager, they always take the easy way out.
Why don't people shop at a decent motor factors instead of Halfwits, they are rubbish at everything they do and know nothing about cars.
The car definitely discharges when stood but it would do as it has the alarm on and no trickle charger and when running the ECU logs that I took from the car tonight show 13-14 volts as the vehicle voltage...
Phil
Bassfiend said:
The car definitely discharges when stood but it would do as it has the alarm on and no trickle charger and when running the ECU logs that I took from the car tonight show 13-14 volts as the vehicle voltage...
It won't be sitting there reading at 13-14 volts without the engine running unless it has been overcharging.As for the alarm discharge theory, I could leave mine for a month and it would start no problem.
Ribol said:
t won't be sitting there reading at 13-14 volts without the engine running unless it has been overcharging.
It's sat at 13-14 volts when the engine is running (according to the ECU) - I dug out my voltmeter this morning to have a measure at the battery terminals when I set off for work...Ribol said:
As for the alarm discharge theory, I could leave mine for a month and it would start no problem.
A month?!?!? Jesus - I'm lucky if I can get a week (might be longer than that since having the ECU replaced)and from what I can gather that's not too unusual either. Before I had the alarm replaced it would be down to the point it wouldn't turn over the engine if left from Friday night to Monday morning. (There's a battery isolator switch that I use for extended periods of non-use.) 
Phil
A voltmeter is only good for a guide as to whether the car is charging or not but it is pretty pointless for testing if a battery is any good.
The only effective way of testing a battery is by FULLY charging it and then doing a "drop" test on it. A normal cheapy DIY home charger will not FULLY charge a battery overnight. A completely flat battery will sometimes not charge at all to start with with a cheapy charger. Very rarely will a faulty battery pass a drop test, none will past two drop tests. If the battery is not sealed then a hydrometer will tell you plenty about the condition of a battery. It is always easier to test a battery that isn't sealed.
When you take a battery back to a supplier you have to give them the opportunity to check for themselves if it is faulty or not, that takes 1 day. Anyone who tells you they can check a flat battery is talking boll ox - feel free to quote me to your Halfwit manager.
Halfwits have not even made half an effort to check your battery - get your money back (you owe me 15%)!!
(PS my mate regularily leaves his Chim for well over a month and it always starts first time, both his and my car have the later larger 100A alternator on them)
The only effective way of testing a battery is by FULLY charging it and then doing a "drop" test on it. A normal cheapy DIY home charger will not FULLY charge a battery overnight. A completely flat battery will sometimes not charge at all to start with with a cheapy charger. Very rarely will a faulty battery pass a drop test, none will past two drop tests. If the battery is not sealed then a hydrometer will tell you plenty about the condition of a battery. It is always easier to test a battery that isn't sealed.
When you take a battery back to a supplier you have to give them the opportunity to check for themselves if it is faulty or not, that takes 1 day. Anyone who tells you they can check a flat battery is talking boll ox - feel free to quote me to your Halfwit manager.
Halfwits have not even made half an effort to check your battery - get your money back (you owe me 15%
)!!(PS my mate regularily leaves his Chim for well over a month and it always starts first time, both his and my car have the later larger 100A alternator on them)
Just playing devils advocate here........
Why is that on PH we (TVR Chim owners) seem to have so many threads relating to batteries failing, use of trickle chargers and all sorts of other topics 'battery draining' related. My last chim would constantly kill batteries and no matter what I tried to do to fix it wouls still do it.
Before blaming 'poor battery quality' I think there is merit in the fact that Chims (some at least) do discharge batteries for some reason. You never see VW golf owners sticking a trickle charger on. Of all the cars I've owned I have never had any charging/battery problems like those I've had with my Chim.
I pose the question:
What is the common factor in Chims that causes them the drain batteries ?
There must be some circuit that takes a lot out of the battery when the car is parked. Maybe it is the alarm/immobiliser system, but once agin all modern cars have them and even leaving them for 6 months plus when you come to start them they work, so what is it with Chimaera's ?
In support though, they still have the responsibility to 'prove' that the battery has been abused, not all discharged batteries are caused by abuse, some are faulty, and if yours is faulty then it should be replaced. I'd go see the manager, and his manager, and his manager you will get high enough up the chain for them to cave in. If all else fail contact trading standards.
Why is that on PH we (TVR Chim owners) seem to have so many threads relating to batteries failing, use of trickle chargers and all sorts of other topics 'battery draining' related. My last chim would constantly kill batteries and no matter what I tried to do to fix it wouls still do it.
Before blaming 'poor battery quality' I think there is merit in the fact that Chims (some at least) do discharge batteries for some reason. You never see VW golf owners sticking a trickle charger on. Of all the cars I've owned I have never had any charging/battery problems like those I've had with my Chim.
I pose the question:
What is the common factor in Chims that causes them the drain batteries ?
There must be some circuit that takes a lot out of the battery when the car is parked. Maybe it is the alarm/immobiliser system, but once agin all modern cars have them and even leaving them for 6 months plus when you come to start them they work, so what is it with Chimaera's ?
In support though, they still have the responsibility to 'prove' that the battery has been abused, not all discharged batteries are caused by abuse, some are faulty, and if yours is faulty then it should be replaced. I'd go see the manager, and his manager, and his manager you will get high enough up the chain for them to cave in. If all else fail contact trading standards.
Edited by blaze_away on Wednesday 4th July 09:13
blaze_away said:
I pose the question:
What is the common factor in Chims that causes them the drain batteries ?
I would say the single biggest factor is usage, many are weekend/hobby cars and don't get enough use. Starting a car up and going for a quick blast before and after polishing it will not keep a battery fully charged. The early ones had smaller alternators which were not really up to the job, which wouldn't help.What is the common factor in Chims that causes them the drain batteries ?
There are also people that think if you jump start a car with a flat battery, drive it around for a few hours it will be charged up - wrong. All you will have done is postpone the next flat battery.
Now you can get started with the discharge theories, but keep in mind that they don't all suffer from this .....................
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