Diagnosis please
Discussion
Hi all,
My car is a '94 pre-serp Chimaera 400 and I've recently had a problem.
The car was starting and running fine up to about 3-4 weeks ago. I didn't try to start it for about 3 weeks and last weekend I was going to head out for a blast. Got in, battery dead - to be expected.
I got out the jump leads, left connected for half an hour or so and I got ignition, lights etc. but then nothing. Not even a click from the starter motor.
Tried again this evening and charged her for two hours. Same result.
I'm thinking maybe a fuse has blown somewhere but don't know where to start! Any ideas?
Thanks
My car is a '94 pre-serp Chimaera 400 and I've recently had a problem.
The car was starting and running fine up to about 3-4 weeks ago. I didn't try to start it for about 3 weeks and last weekend I was going to head out for a blast. Got in, battery dead - to be expected.
I got out the jump leads, left connected for half an hour or so and I got ignition, lights etc. but then nothing. Not even a click from the starter motor.
Tried again this evening and charged her for two hours. Same result.
I'm thinking maybe a fuse has blown somewhere but don't know where to start! Any ideas?
Thanks
I had it serviced just before Christmas and the guys at X-Works mentioned that it will need a new alternator at some stage but it was okay for now. I can't remember if a battery light stays on when it was running.. I don't recall any lights and this would have stuck out?
After two hours charging from jump leads and still connected to the leads there was nothing. When disconnected from the jump leads I was still getting ignition and headlights (I switched on the lights just to check)
After two hours charging from jump leads and still connected to the leads there was nothing. When disconnected from the jump leads I was still getting ignition and headlights (I switched on the lights just to check)
Johnny 89 said:
I had it serviced just before Christmas and the guys at X-Works mentioned that it will need a new alternator at some stage but it was okay for now. I can't remember if a battery light stays on when it was running.. I don't recall any lights and this would have stuck out?
After two hours charging from jump leads and still connected to the leads there was nothing. When disconnected from the jump leads I was still getting ignition and headlights (I switched on the lights just to check)
So the car wouldn't start connected whilst connected to jump leads? Or did you just test that the lights worked okay? After two hours charging from jump leads and still connected to the leads there was nothing. When disconnected from the jump leads I was still getting ignition and headlights (I switched on the lights just to check)
What I was trying to say in my first post was that if the battery light remains on when the engine is running, then I recommend (as Wyn above) to check the 100amp fuse. If this is blown, the alternator will not charge the battery. However, as you are charging the battery directly and it still isn't starting, you need to get the battery tested first to rule it out, as it may be knackered and no longer holding a charge. If the battery is okay and the 100amp fuse is good (worth a change anyway), then check the alternator is charging. Meanwhile, it is worth checking the earths to ensure you don't have a short or drain somewhere. I would definitely start with the battery though.
What do you get with no jump leads/ other battery attached?
A blown 100 amp fuse wouldn't stop it starting if you had enough charge in the battery. All it would do is to stop the alternator from charging the battery. The fuse is located under the chassis, near where the rear arm of the lower off-side front wishbone meets the chassis. Electrically it s between the alternator and the battery.
Your battery is probably f
ked. But it might just need a good charge. Ie 24 hours, not 2.
With long enough jump leads, jump start the car off another car and then with the engine running, test the volts at the back of the alternator with a cheap multimeter, set to the 0-20 volts scale. If you get over 14 volts with the engine running, the alternator is ok. Then drive it to an independent battery place and get them to use a professional battery tester to let you know the battery's condition.
New alternator is £110 - ask where if you need one.
New battery is about £80.
Your battery is probably f
ked. But it might just need a good charge. Ie 24 hours, not 2. With long enough jump leads, jump start the car off another car and then with the engine running, test the volts at the back of the alternator with a cheap multimeter, set to the 0-20 volts scale. If you get over 14 volts with the engine running, the alternator is ok. Then drive it to an independent battery place and get them to use a professional battery tester to let you know the battery's condition.
New alternator is £110 - ask where if you need one.
New battery is about £80.
Of your measuring off the back of the alternator it's worth mentioning that on mine at least I have to temporarily blip the throttle to around 2k to get it to charge and for the light to go out. Not sure if that's normal but I have had false readings before (edit ignore this I just realised it was suggested to measure with engine off)
Johnny 89 said:
Thanks guys,
Yeah, I am trying to jump start it from another car, after leaving it charge for a couple of hours. Not getting anything I'm afraid.
Remove your battery and try connecting the fully charged battery from the other car directly to the terminals and then give it a go. Can you hear the fuel pump priming when you turn the ignition key whilst the battery is charging?Yeah, I am trying to jump start it from another car, after leaving it charge for a couple of hours. Not getting anything I'm afraid.
Please check your terminal connections to the battery. If they get a bit corroded you can get these issues. Even if you put a charger or battery on it will still not start. Especially the earth connection. Just unscrew and wiggle and see what happens. I known the issue from my Alfa GTV.
Best,
Peter
Best,
Peter
My money is on the alarm/imobiliser, mine used to do this if I let the battery go dead flat connected...I would have to disconnect the battery and give it a "good" charge before reconnecting and then have to arm and disarm the alarm a couple of times then it would be fine ( gemini alarm) . Never an issue if the battery still had enough life to keep the alarm active, only if it went stone dead.
Thanks for all the replies guys, much appreciated.
Yes, I can hear the fuel pump priming. I will take out the battery, charge overnight and re-fit. This will cover terminal corrosian, bad connections etc. so I should have a better idea then.
It's a Clifford alarm fitted to mine.
Having not done it before, is the battery difficult to disconnect? There is a fiberglass panel with two holes for the terminals in the footwell. Do I remove this panel?
Yes, I can hear the fuel pump priming. I will take out the battery, charge overnight and re-fit. This will cover terminal corrosian, bad connections etc. so I should have a better idea then.
It's a Clifford alarm fitted to mine.
Having not done it before, is the battery difficult to disconnect? There is a fiberglass panel with two holes for the terminals in the footwell. Do I remove this panel?
Not sure about your car, but some batteries are in fibre glass boxes that are secured to the footwell via two bolts that come through the pax footwell and underneath. They can be a pain to remove. Depending on year, yours may be different. I ditched my box and made my own so I can just pull the battery forwards.
When you turn the ignition, does the starter motor click or do you get nothing? If the starter clicks, then it maybe the starter. If it does nothing, then read below!
If you have a fully working battery, the fuel pump primes and it still will not turn over, then it is possibly a bad earth. The fact that the fuel pump is priming suggests that the immobiliser has disarmed. Before you do anything though, I would get the battery tested, check your earthing points: under radio above transmission tunnel (follow it back from battery negative), near the oil pressure switch at the front of the block and under the radiator. If these are good, then it is time to start testing other things.
Once you have a working battery connected up, if it still fails to start, you could try getting using your negative jump lead, connecting it to the negative battery terminal and then to a clean earthing point on the chassis or engine block and then try to turn her over again. If it starts, then you would to have an earthing issue.
If this fails, it could be the live feed. In which case, you can do the same using a the positive battery terminal: jack the car up, disconnect the king lead from the coil, ensure the car is in neutral and then connect a cable from the live terminal to the live on the starter motor. If this starts, it may suggest a bad live feed or even an immobiliser issue.
I'm sure that somebody with much more experience will be along soon with a whole more things to test/ list of possibilities!
When you turn the ignition, does the starter motor click or do you get nothing? If the starter clicks, then it maybe the starter. If it does nothing, then read below!
If you have a fully working battery, the fuel pump primes and it still will not turn over, then it is possibly a bad earth. The fact that the fuel pump is priming suggests that the immobiliser has disarmed. Before you do anything though, I would get the battery tested, check your earthing points: under radio above transmission tunnel (follow it back from battery negative), near the oil pressure switch at the front of the block and under the radiator. If these are good, then it is time to start testing other things.
Once you have a working battery connected up, if it still fails to start, you could try getting using your negative jump lead, connecting it to the negative battery terminal and then to a clean earthing point on the chassis or engine block and then try to turn her over again. If it starts, then you would to have an earthing issue.
If this fails, it could be the live feed. In which case, you can do the same using a the positive battery terminal: jack the car up, disconnect the king lead from the coil, ensure the car is in neutral and then connect a cable from the live terminal to the live on the starter motor. If this starts, it may suggest a bad live feed or even an immobiliser issue.
I'm sure that somebody with much more experience will be along soon with a whole more things to test/ list of possibilities!
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