Wishbone to wishbone adjuster fail

[Lolo256]

Hi everybodys,

My 99 chim 500 have been to camber/toe adjustment. The guy tell me he couldnt do it because the car was previously adjusted WITH a problem between the wishbone and the wishbone adjuster. He told me about a collapsed bush, but, i just read that there is no bush there (please see the pictures below to get a more precise idea ).

The first picture show the problematic place (nut not centered + deeper inside the ajuster, please click on it to get a high res picture). The second picture show the not damaged one.
I looked at these parts wich seems to be all you can find in this specific place: D0086     /    D0060     /    D0067 (pictures of the parts far below)

Do you know, from your experience, whats going on there and which is (are?) The faulty part (s)? Wishbone? Wish bone adjuster? Screw? "Flat" hex nut? Anything else?








My chim and myself are very gratefull. Thx!

Edited by Lolo256 on Tuesday 7th August 17:49

Edited by Lolo256 on Tuesday 7th August 17:50

Edited by Lolo256 on Tuesday 7th August 17:51

[Belle427]

There is a bush that fits in the last picture you posted, this could be worn but the adjuster you picture first usually siezes up and requires freeing off.
It’s a wishbone off the car job to do it properly, mine required lots of heat to get it to budge.

[TJC46]

There are a few parts you need .

First one is the adjuster http://www.racetechdirect.co.uk/car-parts/suspensi...

If you look on the link at the related products you will also need a new suspension bush, a new lock nut, and a new wishbone bush holder and stud.

You will also need a new washer an nyloc nut to fit on the thread of the stud.


This is for one side so you need 2 of everything to do both lower wishbone adjusters.



The bush needs to be pressed into the bush holder and stud. The adjuster and lock nut need to be screwed into the wishbone, and then you push the bush

holder and stud through this, holding it in position with the nyloc nut and washer.

For adjustment, slacken off the nyloc, and screw the adjuster in or out as required, and tighten up the nyloc on the stud end, and then the lock nut on the

adjuster.

I apologise in advance if this doesn't make sense.

Edited to add a picture of my rear wishbone.



Here you can clearly see the threaded adjuster and lock nut going into the wishbone on the left [in the pic]

On the right hidden inside the wishbone is the threaded end of the bush holder/stud, onto which fits a washer and nyloc nut.

Also note on the top side of the bush holder [as in the pic] there is a steel thrust washer. This is a must have, so check this on your car.

Edited by TJC46 on Tuesday 7th August 21:18

[Lolo256]

TJC46 said:

There are a few parts you need .

First one is the adjuster http://www.racetechdirect.co.uk/car-parts/suspensi...

If you look on the link at the related products you will also need a new suspension bush, a new lock nut, and a new wishbone bush holder and stud.

You will also need a new washer an nyloc nut to fit on the thread of the stud.


This is for one side so you need 2 of everything to do both lower wishbone adjusters.



The bush needs to be pressed into the bush holder and stud. The adjuster and lock nut need to be screwed into the wishbone, and then you push the bush

holder and stud through this, holding it in position with the nyloc nut and washer.

For adjustment, slacken off the nyloc, and screw the adjuster in or out as required, and tighten up the nyloc on the stud end, and then the lock nut on the

adjuster.

I apologise in advance if this doesn't make sense.

Edited to add a picture of my rear wishbone.



Here you can clearly see the threaded adjuster and lock nut going into the wishbone on the left [in the pic]

On the right hidden inside the wishbone is the threaded end of the bush holder/stud, onto which fits a washer and nyloc nut.

Also note on the top side of the bush holder [as in the pic] there is a steel thrust washer. This is a must have, so check this on your car.

Edited by TJC46 on Tuesday 7th August 21:18

Thanks a lot
I saw some other pictures of this same superb red frame and get the basics of this setup with this help. With your perfect description now i think i get it. Thx!!

The rear lock nut is present and i start to think the person from the shop just didnt get the fonctionning of this setup (nor myself). Correct me pls if i m wrong but i feel like everything is fine and the adjustment screw d0067(large thread) is, simply, not screwed enough to maintain the nut of the threaded part of the extender (is that right that the nut stay directly on the "external border" of the big d0067 hollow screw...see picture). ... i think you described it there it s finally a simple adjustment and in any way a fault :
"For adjustment, slacken off the nyloc, and screw the adjuster in or out as required, and tighten up the nyloc on the stud end, and then the lock nut on the adjuster"

I m really care about your other advices but I m on a strict budget and, in a first step, i can only buy the parts i really need ... my adjusters arm, screw, nuts etc seems in really good shape. Do you really think they absolutely need a change to resolve my problem? You also told me to change the top bush, do you think from the pictures they a really need a change? Do i need to change it anyway if i remove the adjuster from the wishbone?

Thanks again!

Edited by Lolo256 on Tuesday 7th August 23:39

Edited by Lolo256 on Wednesday 8th August 00:11

[Lolo256]

Belle427 said:

There is a bush that fits in the last picture you posted, this could be worn but the adjuster you picture first usually siezes up and requires freeing off.
It’s a wishbone off the car job to do it properly, mine required lots of heat to get it to budge.

Hi,
Thx!
Am i right it is the threaded part of the arm that could be seized, your not talking about the bigger adjustment screw...?

[Belle427]

The large adjuster normally seizes up in the wishbone.

[Steve_D]

Belle427 said:

The large adjuster normally seizes up in the wishbone.

This is why others have said to remove the whole wishbone. If it is seized then it is very easy to damage the flats with a spanner but with the wishbone removed you can hold the flats in a vice and use the wishbone as the leverage to undo it.

It may be your alignment man did not know how the adjuster works. To adjust... release the Nyloc nut down inside the wishbone by about one turn, Release the locknut on the large adjuster, Use the flats on the adjuster to make a change, nip up the Nyloc nut before taking a new alignment reading, If reading OK lock up all nuts.

Steve

[Lolo256]

Steve_D said:

This is why others have said to remove the whole wishbone. If it is seized then it is very easy to damage the flats with a spanner but with the wishbone removed you can hold the flats in a vice and use the wishbone as the leverage to undo it.

It may be your alignment man did not know how the adjuster works. To adjust... release the Nyloc nut down inside the wishbone by about one turn, Release the locknut on the large adjuster, Use the flats on the adjuster to make a change, nip up the Nyloc nut before taking a new alignment reading, If reading OK lock up all nuts.

Steve

Thank you very much. I'll try this exact procedure.

Is there some parts that are really needed when you disasemble and reassemble the whole wishbone (bush, special washers) or is it thanksfully possible to keep all the sames parts without problem.

Thx again

Ps are you the steeve that wrote the bible i read every morning!

[Lolo256]

Belle427 said:

The large adjuster normally seizes up in the wishbone.

I ll try steve advices to not give damage on the seized part by disasembling the wishbone. Anyway i ordered two large d0086 screws if something wrong happens with the stock ones... from your experience the thread on the wishbone could only be damaged by the operation (do you think i need to buy some new wishbones too???) Or the d0086 "large screw" is sufficient enough as a backup.

Thx!

[Belle427]

Your wishbones will probably be ok but i would recommend taking both sides off, freeing up and applying anti seize compound for the future.

[TJC46]

Belle427 said:

Your wishbones will probably be ok but i would recommend taking both sides off, freeing up and applying anti seize compound for the future.

Exactly this. .

Remove both lower wishbones from the car and remove the bush holder and stud. You can now try to remove the large threaded adjuster

from the wishbone.

As others have said they usually are seized inside the wishbone.

If you have already managed to free them, then strip, clean and grease everything. Check for play in the bush itself, and make sure you have

the metal washer on the correct side of the bush.

If you have ordered 2 new large adjusters then it would make sense to fit them.

If you remove the bush holder and adjuster from both lower wishbones, you can then compare the threaded length of the stud, as someone

in the past may have managed to snap some of the thread, hence shortenening its length.

[Steve_D]

No I'm not the Bible Steve but am in the TVR business.

Anyway back to the wishbone. Whilst we are all giving advice on how to free up the seized adjuster I am not convinced this is the issue.
The alignment man said he could not adjust it but he may not have known the correct process.
Best thing would be to release the nyloc nut down in the wishbone, release the large locknut then see if the adjuster will move. If it moves then grease it and wind it in and out a few times. Lock it all up and take it back for alignment. Tell the aligner the process I gave in an earlier post.

Steve

[Lolo256]

Steve_D said:

No I'm not the Bible Steve but am in the TVR business.

Anyway back to the wishbone. Whilst we are all giving advice on how to free up the seized adjuster I am not convinced this is the issue.
The alignment man said he could not adjust it but he may not have known the correct process.
Best thing would be to release the nyloc nut down in the wishbone, release the large locknut then see if the adjuster will move. If it moves then grease it and wind it in and out a few times. Lock it all up and take it back for alignment. Tell the aligner the process I gave in an earlier post.

Steve

Thanks a lot!
I ordered the adjuster for an eventual emergency but i m also convict the man just had any idea of the actual setup and was just headblown by the all around adjustable setup possibilities (they are specialists that do 3 alignments/hour but there is NO tvr )

Thx again. I ll do exactly what you said.

[Lolo256]

Ps: it is the biggest tyre seller in all switzerland too and they never sold any tires to any tvr ever (30years)

[Steve_D]

Lolo256 said:

........Thx again. I ll do exactly what you said.

Should have said measure how far the adjuster is sticking out from the wishbone before you start trying to move it then if it moves and you grease it up you can set it back to the adjustment it is now.

Steve

[Lolo256]

Steve_D said:

No I'm not the Bible Steve but am in the TVR business.

The alignment man said he could not adjust it but he may not have known the correct.
Best thing would be to release the nyloc nut down in the wishbone, release the large locknut then see if the adjuster will move. If it moves then grease it and wind it in and out a few times. Lock it all up and take it back for alignment. Tell the aligner the process I gave in an earlier post.

Steve

On the problematic side, My nyloc nut is so far inside the wishbone (because the big adjustment screw is not screw enough at the other side and dont maintain the nyloc far enough) that it is totally impossible to unscrew it (because the wishbone "hole" is there only a few milimeters bigger than the nyloc).

In my understandment i just need to release the large locknut and then try to screw the "big adjuster screw" until the nyloc comme back to a more appropriate place, where i could release it too. You tell me to unscrew the nyloc first; so i was wondering if i could damage anything doing it this way?

Edited by Lolo256 on Friday 10th August 10:10

[Steve_D]

The nyloc has to be loosened first as it is acting like a locknut. You need to get a deep socket and if it is still tight then grind down the outside of the socket although I have never seen the need for this before.

Steve

[Lolo256]

Hi,
I just want to thank you for all these advices. We grinded the socket like you said the nyloc went out and we adjusted everything on your instructions...

Thank you!!!

Edited by Lolo256 on Monday 3rd September 11:31

[BIG DUNC]

Thanks for taking the time to update the thread.

Always good to hear a success and that the problem has been solved on the advice of those who give up their time for free on here.

[Lolo256]

You take so much time to help me, it would be a shame not to give any feedback!
Thanks again!