Discussion
Well, I have one, but it was so long ago that I fitted it that I don't remember all that was invovled. The pins of the plug align with the AFM but I think there was some trimming of the plastic socket to be done. Any gains in airflow will probably necessitate extra fuelling through a remap/chip change.
I think Tim (ACT) sells 'em (amongst others); give him a call and he'll explain all.
I think Tim (ACT) sells 'em (amongst others); give him a call and he'll explain all.
Ive tried taking 5mm out of the standard unit, but it obviously looses its calibration in the process, although it still works (on the bench). I then recalibrated the internal electronics to compensate as this would remove the need for an expensive rechip. Although it matched the output of a standard unit exactly, it did not run well on the car. I think this was due to the pulsed airflow an engine has, over the airflow system I used, so the calibration was still out. I really needed an engine on a test bed to get any further, as road testing on the car with 2 AFMS is difficult to say the least. I think I am / was 90% of the way for a low cost upgrade, but dont have the facilites or finance to take it further. Tim at ACT showed some interest, maybe I should send him the development unit......
Mark
Mark
blitzracing said:
I think I am / was 90% of the way for a low cost upgrade, but dont have the facilites or finance to take it further. Tim at ACT showed some interest, maybe I should send him the development unit......
Mark
Sounds promising, that. Mark
A 'fit and forget' upgrade that wouldn't necessitate a(nother) remap would be A Good Thing, as on its own I can't see the possible gains justifying the time & money needed to be spent in addition. I saw this set up at the BNG.
http://www.torquev8.com/products.html
Looks like it would remove restrictions in the airflow and when combined with a re-chip and 72mm plenum, is reasonable value.
http://www.torquev8.com/products.html
Looks like it would remove restrictions in the airflow and when combined with a re-chip and 72mm plenum, is reasonable value.
Just to add to my last:
There's not only a wire mesh strainer in the throat of the Big Bosch but a plastic air guide; the area of which reduces the effective choke size considerably. I understand that in some applications, the upstream duct routing is rather contorted necessitating the guide to correct the airflow over the hot-film. The ducting in the Griff (and presumably the Chim) is relatively straight; as such I removed the guide (and mesh) to derestrict the induction further. Despite being told that it may cause problems to running, it has not. I didn't conduct any back-to-back testing here, but, common sense would suggest that breathing would be improved.
And before you comment; I know the device looks poorly aligned to the plenum defuser and somewhat disproportioned. It's hangin' in situ, and erm . . . . . isn't!
There's not only a wire mesh strainer in the throat of the Big Bosch but a plastic air guide; the area of which reduces the effective choke size considerably. I understand that in some applications, the upstream duct routing is rather contorted necessitating the guide to correct the airflow over the hot-film. The ducting in the Griff (and presumably the Chim) is relatively straight; as such I removed the guide (and mesh) to derestrict the induction further. Despite being told that it may cause problems to running, it has not. I didn't conduct any back-to-back testing here, but, common sense would suggest that breathing would be improved.
And before you comment; I know the device looks poorly aligned to the plenum defuser and somewhat disproportioned. It's hangin' in situ, and erm . . . . . isn't!
There are pictures and wiring diagrams for changing here :
http://www.v8engines.com/carbs-2.htm#gems
http://www.v8engines.com/carbs-2.htm#gems
350Matt said:
Oh for gods sake
put the antiquated Rover washing machine electronics in the bin and fit something from this century
The way fuel price are going it'll have paid for itself in 6 months
Matt
Not convinced TBH - had an engine erm, engineered properly and presto, suddendly the ol' RV8 is capable of getting 25-30 mpg in mixed traffic using the factory standard management...put the antiquated Rover washing machine electronics in the bin and fit something from this century
The way fuel price are going it'll have paid for itself in 6 months
Matt
Besides - the fueling part of most aftermarket ECUs isn't massively more advanced than the CU(X)14 stuff... it's having mapped ignition that makes all the difference. The rest of the features of aftermarket systems is by and large relevant if you're running forced induction, nitrous oxide etc. if one can relieve it of the airflow restiction caused by a smallish AMM, so much the better - but given the other restictions posed by the head castings and intake manifold even that may not be as essential as it's made out to be.
So far I 've found the Lucas stuff more robust and adaptive than the systems I've delved into so far... I've got damn near perfect driveability, good economy (for a 50 year old pushrod V8 design), a 100% reliability record (except for a nut on the throttle cable that came undone... it now has a tiewrap on it to prevent it from moving ;hehe
and ample power across the rev range... why want to fix something that's not broken? IMHO you're far better off spending the money on a stack of top notch suspension and a proper set up
.Edited by 900T-R on Thursday 9th October 19:12
You're a bit quick, See my edit. 
It's simple - if someone provides me with a bigger AFM of which the voltage output already comes correctly scled to take account of the higher flow, then the whole procedure is as simple as swapping your AFM->plenum 90 degree bend for a smooth bore silicone one, or changing the air filter for a different one and provided it would cost say, 150-200 notes it'd be rude not to on a 'flow optimised' engine. Even if it brings like 5 bhp gain on an engine such as mine without any side effects, it'd be rude not to if only for peace of mind.
Ripping out the complete fuel and ignition systems, spending like 2 grand, fabricating a crank or cam sensor installation connecting a new wiring loom to the relvant points in the car and then having to re-do all the mapping development the factory or TVR Power did, seems a lot of expense and potential reliability pitfalls for say, a potential of 20 bhp gain - unless you really need those last 20 bhp...
Of course, things will be rather different if and when the Lucas gear gets wonky.
Oh, and don't forget the probability of future Europe-wide legislation that will probably need anything non-standard to be tested and certified like in Germany for your car to remain road legal (I hear through the grapevine that this is mooted for Dutch MOT regulations starting in 2010 - of course you'll still be able to do it but it's yet another cost and aggro factor I can do without (another factor in selling the bonkers Saab - I may want to sell up and buy a house in Germany but I couldn't see myself getting thast car registered there without dozens of test station visits and incurring huge cost in the process.
Right now it's just a car with a rebuilt/blueprinted engine and an updated ECU chip of the OE engine supplier (Power). I'm sure Henk Thuis will be able to provide a test certificate for the suspension by then...
It's simple - if someone provides me with a bigger AFM of which the voltage output already comes correctly scled to take account of the higher flow, then the whole procedure is as simple as swapping your AFM->plenum 90 degree bend for a smooth bore silicone one, or changing the air filter for a different one and provided it would cost say, 150-200 notes it'd be rude not to on a 'flow optimised' engine. Even if it brings like 5 bhp gain on an engine such as mine without any side effects, it'd be rude not to if only for peace of mind.
Ripping out the complete fuel and ignition systems, spending like 2 grand, fabricating a crank or cam sensor installation connecting a new wiring loom to the relvant points in the car and then having to re-do all the mapping development the factory or TVR Power did, seems a lot of expense and potential reliability pitfalls for say, a potential of 20 bhp gain - unless you really need those last 20 bhp...
Of course, things will be rather different if and when the Lucas gear gets wonky.
Oh, and don't forget the probability of future Europe-wide legislation that will probably need anything non-standard to be tested and certified like in Germany for your car to remain road legal (I hear through the grapevine that this is mooted for Dutch MOT regulations starting in 2010 - of course you'll still be able to do it but it's yet another cost and aggro factor I can do without (another factor in selling the bonkers Saab - I may want to sell up and buy a house in Germany but I couldn't see myself getting thast car registered there without dozens of test station visits and incurring huge cost in the process.
Right now it's just a car with a rebuilt/blueprinted engine and an updated ECU chip of the OE engine supplier (Power). I'm sure Henk Thuis will be able to provide a test certificate for the suspension by then...
Edited by 900T-R on Thursday 9th October 19:32
Good points there,
However the way I see it the Lucas stuff is unsupported by the manufacturer and old.
TVR wiring is poor from new, so ripping it all out and doing it properly is a good thing.
Mapped ignition and modern idle speed control makes the car a LOT nicer to drive and will save you fuel.
More power is available across the range.
Easier to fix as you have a window into the ECU.
You reduce engine bay components so increasing reliability.
If you can tackle the spanner work and wiring yourself its not 2K more like 1.2K.
Throttle response is improved.
You will understand your car much more and so inherently increase its reliability as you are halfway to fixing any problem.
Still each to his own and all that
Matt
However the way I see it the Lucas stuff is unsupported by the manufacturer and old.
TVR wiring is poor from new, so ripping it all out and doing it properly is a good thing.
Mapped ignition and modern idle speed control makes the car a LOT nicer to drive and will save you fuel.
More power is available across the range.
Easier to fix as you have a window into the ECU.
You reduce engine bay components so increasing reliability.
If you can tackle the spanner work and wiring yourself its not 2K more like 1.2K.
Throttle response is improved.
You will understand your car much more and so inherently increase its reliability as you are halfway to fixing any problem.
Still each to his own and all that
Matt
Sorry, I have to agree with MR "T". The ignition mapping has nothing to do with the 14CUX, so if you could bolt a mappable ignition system onto the current set up, thats half the battle won. Megasquirt were doing a system called mega volt or something, but I think it was dropped and I have not yet looked into another system. OK so the ECU its not supported, but there are dozens of maps out there without having to start form scratch and its dead simple sensor wise. The ECU also has the correct fuelling patterns to keep the emissions low, and far as I can see the Emerald is sold primarily for Race cars, that don’t need MOT's. You also have to be realistic about fitting an aftermarket ECU, how many hours have you spent getting it right ??
Mark
Mark
Hi guys
Megajolt is alive and you can get it here:
http://www.autosportlabs.com/-c-1_21.html
In their forum is a post from somebody who has fitted it to his RangeRover but it is not running yet.
A friend of mine wants to try it on his Fiat 124 Spider. If that works i might try it too.
Cheers Jens
Megajolt is alive and you can get it here:
http://www.autosportlabs.com/-c-1_21.html
In their forum is a post from somebody who has fitted it to his RangeRover but it is not running yet.
A friend of mine wants to try it on his Fiat 124 Spider. If that works i might try it too.
Cheers Jens
350Matt said:
TVR wiring is poor from new, so ripping it all out and doing it properly is a good thing.
Oh, and if you've ever seen the Bosch L(H)-Jetronic wiring loom out of a mid-Eighties Saab/Volvo/Mercedes you'll marvel at the quality of the insulation TVR used for their looms having survived this well in an extremely hostile (heat) environment... Ten years ago, the abovementioned were crumbling away already to the extent that you would get some lovely special effects due to exposed bare wires crossing... spent quite a few fun hours with the soldering iron and shrink wrapping myself.
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