4.0, 4.0 HC or 4.5: behaviour and reliability ?
Discussion
Hello,
sorry if those questions were raised previously:
1- Is there be a noticeable difference in the car behavior (I'm not talking about the 0-60 times which in my humble opinion don't mean much, but rather in terms such as progressive vs explosive,etc...) between those 3 engines ?
2- Any well-known differences in reliability as well ?
Wishing you a merry Christmas !!!
sorry if those questions were raised previously:
1- Is there be a noticeable difference in the car behavior (I'm not talking about the 0-60 times which in my humble opinion don't mean much, but rather in terms such as progressive vs explosive,etc...) between those 3 engines ?
2- Any well-known differences in reliability as well ?
Wishing you a merry Christmas !!!
fafnir said:
1- Is there be a noticeable difference in the car behavior (I'm not talking about the 0-60 times which in my humble opinion don't mean much, but rather in terms such as progressive vs explosive,etc...) between those 3 engines ?
The 4.0 is likely to be the smoothest, but thats very subjective in reality. The 4.5 is a good compromise between the 4.0 and the 5.0. The 5.0 is very fast and in the wrong hands a nightmare. But they do have astonishing torque and litterly blast away.
Torque is the big thing though. No turbo lag here - just clean progressive acceleration from as low as 1500 RPM for all engines. Its just that the bigger engines have more....
fafnir said:
2- Any well-known differences in reliability as well ?
Not really. The 5.0 is a more stressed engine and as a result *may* be a little more unreliable. But again thats very subjective. The 4.5 again is the good compromise and also newer, but I am not sure which is the most reliable.
My personal opinion would be to look at a 4.0 model. Unless you need the fastest one, the 4.0 is a good compromise. Its fast and there are plenty available, but also have fewer (though not that many) parts that are specific to TVR. This might ease the maintenance and running costs.... but as with all TVR's buy on condition and not necessarily the colour or engine size.....
Hi
I have recently gone through the same process to find a decent Chimaera after owning a 350i wedge for 5 years and looked at all variants 4.0, 4.0HC and 500.
I ended up with a 4.0 standard with PAS a 96 1 owner 1996 22k miles model, which after driving all of the others was in the best overall condition, and this is what really matters... which ever one you buy, you will be driving in an exclusive club, how many cars are made in such low volume, entirely by hand, that sound and accelerate like they do, for the money you can buy them for second hand. if you are byuying in the £14-15k bracket you will end up with a car that will be enormous fun but will only loose about a grand over 2 years.
The 500 i saw in my price range had been CAT D repaired so was Cheap but I couldnt live with the potential nightmare in resale, they guy had been advertising it for ages...
It had also has the head gasket repaired at 18k miles, which is something i know 2 other griff 500 owners have had to do.. legacy of track days for 2 of them, or the fact it is an engine that has been pretty much stretched to its limit of capacity,
or whether they encourage a thrashing (probably)But wheelspin in 3rd and 4th on slightly damp roads is fun at first but tiring after a while intense concentration needed at all times.
the 500 was a bit of a monster in traffic as it would not stay in 4th at 25-30mph it needed 3rd around those speeds.. very lumpy at low speed..
Really liked the 4.0 HC but not many straight ones about liked the 'kick' in power band at 4250rpm that the high compression engine gives...
450's are considered to be the best compromise but havent driven one as yet so cant comment...
I got lots of advice from the TVR car club owners, bonus of there being plenty of Chim owners..
most advice was to go for the post 1994/5 models with the T5 gearbox and serpentine engine, they also had the griffith chassis and 500 spec vented rear disks and bigger front calipers. of the early chimaeras the door locks were a weak point wit the key hole in the button on the rear wing. the keyless ones gave less problems and the door mirror buttons a la cerbies were the best.
there are also various arguments for or against power steering I prefer it and had less choice, but it is up to you.. I dont think there is anything wrong with the feel at speed and parking speeds is much improved..
the thing is is try all models with an open mind and buy the best you can afford, a cheap TVR of any type is likley to cost you dearly in the long run.. service history a must as is a full HPI check.. some dealers are good other just take the pi$$, so depending on where you live ask other owners for thier thoughts on buying from a dealer.
sorry to have gone on a bit... but i wish someone had when i bought my first TVR which was an eye opener!!
happy tivving !!
Tony
I have recently gone through the same process to find a decent Chimaera after owning a 350i wedge for 5 years and looked at all variants 4.0, 4.0HC and 500.
I ended up with a 4.0 standard with PAS a 96 1 owner 1996 22k miles model, which after driving all of the others was in the best overall condition, and this is what really matters... which ever one you buy, you will be driving in an exclusive club, how many cars are made in such low volume, entirely by hand, that sound and accelerate like they do, for the money you can buy them for second hand. if you are byuying in the £14-15k bracket you will end up with a car that will be enormous fun but will only loose about a grand over 2 years.
The 500 i saw in my price range had been CAT D repaired so was Cheap but I couldnt live with the potential nightmare in resale, they guy had been advertising it for ages...
It had also has the head gasket repaired at 18k miles, which is something i know 2 other griff 500 owners have had to do.. legacy of track days for 2 of them, or the fact it is an engine that has been pretty much stretched to its limit of capacity,
or whether they encourage a thrashing (probably)But wheelspin in 3rd and 4th on slightly damp roads is fun at first but tiring after a while intense concentration needed at all times.
the 500 was a bit of a monster in traffic as it would not stay in 4th at 25-30mph it needed 3rd around those speeds.. very lumpy at low speed..
Really liked the 4.0 HC but not many straight ones about liked the 'kick' in power band at 4250rpm that the high compression engine gives...
450's are considered to be the best compromise but havent driven one as yet so cant comment...
I got lots of advice from the TVR car club owners, bonus of there being plenty of Chim owners..
most advice was to go for the post 1994/5 models with the T5 gearbox and serpentine engine, they also had the griffith chassis and 500 spec vented rear disks and bigger front calipers. of the early chimaeras the door locks were a weak point wit the key hole in the button on the rear wing. the keyless ones gave less problems and the door mirror buttons a la cerbies were the best.
there are also various arguments for or against power steering I prefer it and had less choice, but it is up to you.. I dont think there is anything wrong with the feel at speed and parking speeds is much improved..
the thing is is try all models with an open mind and buy the best you can afford, a cheap TVR of any type is likley to cost you dearly in the long run.. service history a must as is a full HPI check.. some dealers are good other just take the pi$$, so depending on where you live ask other owners for thier thoughts on buying from a dealer.
sorry to have gone on a bit... but i wish someone had when i bought my first TVR which was an eye opener!!
happy tivving !!
Tony
I too went through the same issues but ended up with a '99 Chimaera 500, having driven several of all the models.
Yes you do need to be 100% concentrating in a 500 (110% in the rain)otherwise it will drive you rather than the other way 'round, but you should be in any car anyway.
Bottom line for me was that the 500 is substantially faster/more exciting/effortless, and as I have had cars before that I thought were powerful enough to start with but ended up finding them deficient I knew that I had to get the top end or find myself regretting it later.
Agree with everything else Monker said though, and a 100% condition 400 is better than a 75% condition 500.
Yes you do need to be 100% concentrating in a 500 (110% in the rain)otherwise it will drive you rather than the other way 'round, but you should be in any car anyway.
Bottom line for me was that the 500 is substantially faster/more exciting/effortless, and as I have had cars before that I thought were powerful enough to start with but ended up finding them deficient I knew that I had to get the top end or find myself regretting it later.
Agree with everything else Monker said though, and a 100% condition 400 is better than a 75% condition 500.
monker said:
the 500 was a bit of a monster in traffic as it would not stay in 4th at 25-30mph it needed 3rd around those speeds.. very lumpy at low speed..
Sounds like an older car and possibly a duffer to me. My 500 will tootle along in 5th at 30mph with no problems and accelerate smoothly from that speed. Re. engine sizes it's worth bearing in mind that you will get used to the performance. Depending on what you want from ownership, it may be worth looking out for a 450 or 500.
Steve.
fafnir said:
Hello,
sorry if those questions were raised previously:
1- Is there be a noticeable difference in the car behavior (I'm not talking about the 0-60 times which in my humble opinion don't mean much, but rather in terms such as progressive vs explosive,etc...) between those 3 engines ?
2- Any well-known differences in reliability as well ?
Wishing you a merry Christmas !!!
They are all pretty smooth as they are basically stock engines, even the 4.5 uses standard bottom end, it also has the best torque curve.
the "punch in the back" under acceleration will be noticably more with the 4.5 over 4.0L HC despite the published power figures being almost the same, the 4.5 will have around 40 lb ft extra torque.
generally they are very reliable and if you break the engine not to expensive to replace.
I think the 4.5 is the best of the bunch.
happy new year.
Tim
I've got a '99 450 which I use daily doing only about 20 miles. I've had it a year nearly and have had no reliability problems at all (touch wood). After driving all 3 varients I ended up with the best car I could find for the money......end of story.
Always, always go for the best car you can find regardless of engine size, otherwise you will regret it.
Always, always go for the best car you can find regardless of engine size, otherwise you will regret it.
Steve_T said:
the 500 was a bit of a monster in traffic as it would not stay in 4th at 25-30mph it needed 3rd around those speeds.. very lumpy at low speed..
Sounds like an older car and possibly a duffer to me. My 500 will tootle along in 5th at 30mph with no problems and accelerate smoothly from that speed. Re. engine sizes it's worth bearing in mind that you will get used to the performance. Depending on what you want from ownership, it may be worth looking out for a 450 or 500.
Steve.
Agree to all of the above
all set to get a 450 or 500, then I saw a late 400 in just the right colour combination and condition the was 100%.
That's what I got, never once regretted not getting a bigger engine. It's still a bloody quick and fun car.
If it looks right, feels right and the price is right, it is right. enjoy
Rich
That's what I got, never once regretted not getting a bigger engine. It's still a bloody quick and fun car.
If it looks right, feels right and the price is right, it is right. enjoy
Rich
for what its worth, I'll repeat something I read on here somewhere....
the 400 is a very fast car, and will slaughter just about anything on the road..... right up to that TVRCC track day you go on.... when you will be slower.
I don't want to start a "400 in the right hands can be as quick as a 500 in the wrong hands" debate.... just repeating something I read
edited to add that I wouldn't be without my 400
>> Edited by kdd on Tuesday 30th December 10:58
the 400 is a very fast car, and will slaughter just about anything on the road..... right up to that TVRCC track day you go on.... when you will be slower.
I don't want to start a "400 in the right hands can be as quick as a 500 in the wrong hands" debate.... just repeating something I read
edited to add that I wouldn't be without my 400
>> Edited by kdd on Tuesday 30th December 10:58
cheers guys for the comments...
i think the 500 i drove was a bit ropey to be honest... I think i was expecting to be swept along on a tidal wave of torque... think it was overdue a service..
anyways well chuffed with my 4.0litre.
will also be going to Pistonfest this year in July, so if anyone is there look out for a crimson starmist regd N695BAU chim....
i think the 500 i drove was a bit ropey to be honest... I think i was expecting to be swept along on a tidal wave of torque... think it was overdue a service..
anyways well chuffed with my 4.0litre.
will also be going to Pistonfest this year in July, so if anyone is there look out for a crimson starmist regd N695BAU chim....
Gazboy said:
Well owning a 500 straight off.My first TVR. I wouldn't want anything smaller.
THAT RAW POWER IS FANTASTIC!!
just treat It with respect ALWAYS....
Not having a go guys, but it is interesting that on both forums ( Griff & Chim) anyone with a 4.0 says size doesn't matter, anyone with a 5.0 says that nothing else would do, so with exception to the goldern rule of buy on condition-sod the engine, what's the deal? repeat, I'm not having a go.
guess it's what you get used to, if you never had anything like a 4ltr before then your going to think thats the muts nuts, but once you've experienced a 5ltr nothing else is gonna do!
You can never have too much power!
Twin turbo supra did'nt turn me on one bit (was an auto though), Esprits alway stuck me as being a bit of a 'lorry' at low speeds...love the looks though! (never had one out on the open road though!) I know i'd like the M3 and if you buy with caution dont think will be a problem, but not really 3rd car material in my book.
which leaves the Chimaera!
which leaves the Chimaera!
monker said:
Hi
I have recently gone through the same process to find a decent Chimaera after owning a 350i wedge for 5 years and looked at all variants 4.0, 4.0HC and 500.
-snip/snip-
sorry to have gone on a bit... but i wish someone had when i bought my first TVR which was an eye opener!!
happy tivving !!
Tony
Similar story here Monker. I had a 350SE wedge 4.0L for 5yrs but accidentally sold it two yrs ago. I decided on either 4.0-HC, 4.3 or 4.5 with/without PAS. With the help of Rob Ingleby I finished up with a gorgeous low mileage 4.3 and no PAS. Decision was solely on history/condition but I paid over the odds. No regrets though and no problems (except alarm) since.
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