Just a coincidence?

[Cerbman]

We all know there has been much debate as to whether Jaguar was pulling its punches whilst Aston Martin were part of the Ford stable.
Now that Aston has gone the first new Jaguar since the split and we have a best in class car in the XF. The new XKRS to be released at the Geneva Motorshow will have its limiter removed. Just a coincidence?

[Triple7]

Is that the name of it, XKR-S. Sweet! 500BHP, 0-60mph in??? 4.5secs?

I think Jag have got the momentum to do a lot better, they still are cash concious though. Porsche were in this boat 10 years a go and look at them now. Massive profits=more investment for future development.

I don't believe the XK is the best car Jag could make, it is certainly the best car car they can do with the budget. I believe the same goes for the XF. It is great, but not quite there yet. When BMW releases their new 5 Series, this is when Jag could struggle a bit. There is speculation that the British press are just giving it a 'favourable' review.

But as with all Jag models they are an evolution, with the later models getting much better. Lets just hope Jag can evolve faster to be the trend setter and have all the other marques playing catch up.

G

Edited by Triple7 on Wednesday 13th February 15:42

[Jaguar steve]

Another problem is, what's the future for Jaguar as a company?

Who will buy Jaguar, and be prepared to invest the billions that Ford did on future product development, especially with the slowdown in the world markets. You're right Jaguar were a bit restrained by Aston Martin whilst under Ford and as a result most of the other prestige marques already had a head start and become better established in the far east and other developing economies, which it seems is where future growth will be.

If there's a squeeze it's unlikely that any serious investor will put up enough cash for long term development and future vision, and be much more tempted instead to milk the brand for all it's worth in the short term - leaving Jaguar a long way behind - if it exists at all in the future.

Unlike most other makes I think Jaguar have two distinct types of customer. On the one hand there's traditionalists like me who like the wood, chrome and leather and the old world charm, and on the other there's a younger generation who demand a modern cutting edge high tech product.

Keeping both types happy and staying loyal to the brand is going to be a very tough call.

[Triple7]

I think that most buying is done with marketing/trend/image. If you advertise you will sell. Every man and his dog wants a BMW 3 series, that's what Jag positon Jag need to be in. However it didn't work with the X-Type, because it Jag didn't have the right image. jag have few years to go before the new image is realised, because with the current XJ and X-Type sharing the dealership forecourts with the new XK and XF they are in this transition. I was wondering whether the Jag network will separate the dealership showroom into 2 halves because of this.

As for it's future, well I think TATA will end up as the owners. As an article I read the other day stated, the $1.5bn sale price is just the down payment. Lots of investment is still required, but TATA have $28bn in cash reserves. I think a bit of that will make sure Jag/LR will be top of the pile once more.

G

[Job38]

My opinion, for what it's worth:

1. Stop X Type NOW !!! and make Jaguar 'exclusive' again (not personal, I think it's a great car and would love to own one).
2. Get a MANUAL gearbox as an option FFS !!!!

I'd love to see Jaguar to develop a sports car, but to be honest, in my heart of hearts, I just don't think they could bring off something good enough to compete these days. The stakes are just SO high in terms of R&D costs and the quality of the opposition.

[steelej]

Job38 said:

2. Get a MANUAL gearbox as an option FFS !!!!

There are two camps with regards to the current Jag autobox, those who love it and those who've never tried it. I think I know which camp you're in

Job38 said:

I'd love to see Jaguar to develop a sports car, but to be honest, in my heart of hearts, I just don't think they could bring off something good enough to compete these days. The stakes are just SO high in terms of R&D costs and the quality of the opposition.

What? Have you seen the XKR, It's a proper sports car, always just behind the 911s and R8 in the list of best sports cars, I think they can compete just fine and I don't see the 911 or R8 with full aluminium construction etc.

Also I was reading about the XKRS in autocar tonight and it appears it won't have the 5.0 V8 but a tweaked 4.2, no indication of power/performance but it's expected to be 10k more than the standard XKR.

I think that Tata buying Jag will be the best thing for Jag, their plans are already encouraging, different versions of the XF, new XJ, the fabled F-Type. Tata have the cash to let Jaguar get on with it and be successful, Ford couldn't stop interfering, the world didn't need the X-type, although when it came to the crunch they did come through with the XK and XF but they're Jaguars that Ford just allowed to happen. Unfortunately for Ford I think Tata will swoop in and reap the benefit of the best come back since John Travolta in Pulp Fiction.....

John.

Edited by steelej on Wednesday 13th February 20:28

[Triple7]

I'm surprised the XK-RS will only be a tweaked 4.2. The Jag chap I spoke to said the XFR is out the end of this year with a 5.0ltr. It is just having some gremilns worked on.

As for the F-Type the clay model is being worked on as we speak.

G

[groomi]

Triple7 said:

As for the F-Type the clay model is being worked on as we speak.

When I was at uni 8 years ago, we were re-using the clay from the F-Type you all know and love from pictures.

If they're working on a new one, it must be very different to make it worthwile doing again.

[a8hex]

Triple7 said:

I'm surprised the XK-RS will only be a tweaked 4.2. The Jag chap I spoke to said the XFR is out the end of this year with a 5.0ltr. It is just having some gremilns worked on.

As for the F-Type the clay model is being worked on as we speak.

G

I guess a tweaked 4.2 is a stop gap till they can ship the 5L version. Obviously enough people have been asking for a harder edged XKR.

[NST]

i had heard from a source that the 5L was quite ready, but that info was late last year. iirc they are using the new eaton TVS(?) supercharger.

[a8hex]

NST said:

i had heard from a source that the 5L was quite ready, but that info was late last year. iirc they are using the new eaton TVS(?) supercharger.

I can't see them sitting on an engine if it's ready for production. There would be too much money tidied up. The Germans have moved the goal posts as part of their horse power race. If you want to be top of the super saloon/GT camp now 400ish BHP doesn't get you into the playing field coz it doesn't buy you any bragging rights down at the 19th hole.

[NST]

a8hex said:

NST said:

i had heard from a source that the 5L was quite ready, but that info was late last year. iirc they are using the new eaton TVS(?) supercharger.

I can't see them sitting on an engine if it's ready for production. There would be too much money tidied up. The Germans have moved the goal posts as part of their horse power race. If you want to be top of the super saloon/GT camp now 400ish BHP doesn't get you into the playing field coz it doesn't buy you any bragging rights down at the 19th hole.

d'oh! sorry meant 'wasn't quite ready'!
quite agree though with your comments

[Cerbman]

Triple7 said:

Is that the name of it, XKR-S. Sweet! 500BHP, 0-60mph in??? 4.5secs?

I think Jag have got the momentum to do a lot better, they still are cash concious though. Porsche were in this boat 10 years a go and look at them now. Massive profits=more investment for future development.

I don't believe the XK is the best car Jag could make, it is certainly the best car car they can do with the budget. I believe the same goes for the XF. It is great, but not quite there yet. When BMW releases their new 5 Series, this is when Jag could struggle a bit. There is speculation that the British press are just giving it a 'favourable' review.

But as with all Jag models they are an evolution, with the later models getting much better. Lets just hope Jag can evolve faster to be the trend setter and have all the other marques playing catch up.

G

Edited by Triple7 on Wednesday 13th February 15:42

0-60mph in??? 4.5secs? I hope so, the American roadtesters have already got that and better for the standard XKR.

[a8hex]

Cerbman said:

0-60mph in??? 4.5secs? I hope so, the American roadtesters have already got that and better for the standard XKR.

Haven't they been running them at about 4.2 or 4.3 to 60?

[Cerbman]

a8hex said:

Cerbman said:

0-60mph in??? 4.5secs? I hope so, the American roadtesters have already got that and better for the standard XKR.

Haven't they been running them at about 4.2 or 4.3 to 60?

Lowest I've seen is 4.3

[Triple7]

Just been to the Chicago Auto show, this is the competition. The Chevy ZR1 'Vette. 620+bhp from a Supercharged 6.2ltr V8. Yours for £50k and includes the carbon fibre body and ceramic brakes. The chrome alloys are extra







G

Edited by Triple7 on Thursday 14th February 17:16