VW Phaeton: any owners on PH?
Discussion
I'm pondering buying an early VW Phaeton in the next year or 2. I fancy a big, quick luxury barge for weekend jaunts and the Phaeton appeals as it's cheap, can be had with big engines, has (IMO) a lovely interior and from outside just looks like another dull diesel Passat.
Are there any major problem areas with the early (2003/04/05) cars? Ideally I'd like to find a W12 version, although these are so rare I may end up with a V8 or perhaps V10 TDi. Don't fancy any kind of 6 pot engine.
Also what do owners think of the car in terms of comfort, ride quality, ergonomics, practicality?
Cheers,
Jonny
Are there any major problem areas with the early (2003/04/05) cars? Ideally I'd like to find a W12 version, although these are so rare I may end up with a V8 or perhaps V10 TDi. Don't fancy any kind of 6 pot engine.
Also what do owners think of the car in terms of comfort, ride quality, ergonomics, practicality?
Cheers,
Jonny
We looked at one a while back and what put me off then was that our local VW dealer told me only certain VW dealers have the expertise to look after them.
If you're going to be taking it outside the network, this isn't a problem, but does mean you'll need to find an expert specialist.
If you're going to be taking it outside the network, this isn't a problem, but does mean you'll need to find an expert specialist.
I've got an 07-reg 3.0 diesel. Great car, though I can see that the electricals will be its downfall. Lovely to drive slowly, pretty good rolling along at speed, in no way a performance car. I understand that the 5.0TDi is worse, as it's so nose heavy. I've had mine remapped by Revo to 275hp with no impact on economy (35mpg on a run). The guy at the dealers figures it runs much more like the 5.0 model now. It was too slow beford I had it remapped.
I'd shy away from the 5.0TDi, as I hear it's not hugely reliable. The big engine variants get very poor mileage around town. Think 12-15mpg for the 6.0. And avoid the 4-seater, as they are a swine to sell on. IMHO My set-up is the best compromise.
I'd shy away from the 5.0TDi, as I hear it's not hugely reliable. The big engine variants get very poor mileage around town. Think 12-15mpg for the 6.0. And avoid the 4-seater, as they are a swine to sell on. IMHO My set-up is the best compromise.
Edited by ArnieVXR on Monday 25th February 12:51
Kell - that bears out what I've heard, which is that only four VW dealers actually work on Phaetons. Don't suppose anyone knows which ones they are? (A brief Googling sesh failed to find out!)
Ideally, if I buy a car with full VW history (as I'd prefer), I'd like to continue with at least main dealer servicing - would probably go independent for MoTs and carry out my own repairs as far as possible, though.
Arnie - I think the same thing; any car with such a complicated electrical system could be a liability. But so far it seems they're pretty reliable in that respect. I might try to stay away from the V10 TDi as even the poxiest four-pot common rail turbodiesel is an expensive beast to fix should anything go wrong with the turbo or injection systems.
I'm not overly worried about fuel consumption as I only intend to cover maybe a few hundred miles a month in the Phaeton. Strictly for pleasure trips as I have a company car (which I'll downsize to an eco-special supermini when it's up for replacement) for work use and other mundane stuff, plus the mrs has her own little runaround as well. Hence I may as well go for the full-fat W12 option if I can find one!
What's the idea with the 4-seaters - do they have 4 seats to accomodate some sort of fancy super-duper rear centre console? And do the 5-seater versions have a foldable rear seat? (Not that this would be a dealbreaker but it may come in handy occasionally)
Thanks for the info so far guys - much appreciated
Ideally, if I buy a car with full VW history (as I'd prefer), I'd like to continue with at least main dealer servicing - would probably go independent for MoTs and carry out my own repairs as far as possible, though.
Arnie - I think the same thing; any car with such a complicated electrical system could be a liability. But so far it seems they're pretty reliable in that respect. I might try to stay away from the V10 TDi as even the poxiest four-pot common rail turbodiesel is an expensive beast to fix should anything go wrong with the turbo or injection systems.
I'm not overly worried about fuel consumption as I only intend to cover maybe a few hundred miles a month in the Phaeton. Strictly for pleasure trips as I have a company car (which I'll downsize to an eco-special supermini when it's up for replacement) for work use and other mundane stuff, plus the mrs has her own little runaround as well. Hence I may as well go for the full-fat W12 option if I can find one!
What's the idea with the 4-seaters - do they have 4 seats to accomodate some sort of fancy super-duper rear centre console? And do the 5-seater versions have a foldable rear seat? (Not that this would be a dealbreaker but it may come in handy occasionally)
Thanks for the info so far guys - much appreciated
The four seater has a massive centre console that runs front to back with a big control panel for the rear climate control. You tend to find them on the LWB 5.0TDi.
The rear seats don't fold, so the boot size is fixed at 500-litres, which is pretty big.
On the electrics, I find that on my car lots of 'odd' things happen. One touch windows readily need re-programming, the electric boot lid can be a right bugger if you touch it (you'll need to read up on the manual override), the satnav DVD keeps spitting the disc out, etc, etc. Nothing failed as such, just annoying.
I bought my Phaeton from Citygate VW in Colindale. Their group services these cars. The garage is in Little Chalfont (not far from J19 on the M25). I'm guessing that VW dealers that sell new Phaetons will service them (search Autotrader, there's quite a few).
As I said before, the car is lovely to drive. Very peaceful cruising. Easily as good as my Audi A8, Mercedes S-Class, BMW 5-series, etc. It will hustle along, but the vast weight catches the chassis and the brakes out from time to time. However, having 4WD means you get to feel superior every time it snows and you pull onto roundabout in the wet without any worries (don't buy the FWD model)
One really bad point is the SATNAV, which is sooooooo slow. I get the impression that it's steam powered...
Weird useful things include: Two batteries (one for starting), which helped out when the other battery went flat. Ride height adjustment (by an inch), for when I drive down this really rutted private road near me. The visual parking sensors that 'show' you how close the object is. Pop down cup holders for holding the mobile. Sliding face vent covers, 'cause they look so cool.
Low points: Not once, but twice being mistaken for a taxi when waiting to pick my daughter up from a party.
The rear seats don't fold, so the boot size is fixed at 500-litres, which is pretty big.
On the electrics, I find that on my car lots of 'odd' things happen. One touch windows readily need re-programming, the electric boot lid can be a right bugger if you touch it (you'll need to read up on the manual override), the satnav DVD keeps spitting the disc out, etc, etc. Nothing failed as such, just annoying.
I bought my Phaeton from Citygate VW in Colindale. Their group services these cars. The garage is in Little Chalfont (not far from J19 on the M25). I'm guessing that VW dealers that sell new Phaetons will service them (search Autotrader, there's quite a few).
As I said before, the car is lovely to drive. Very peaceful cruising. Easily as good as my Audi A8, Mercedes S-Class, BMW 5-series, etc. It will hustle along, but the vast weight catches the chassis and the brakes out from time to time. However, having 4WD means you get to feel superior every time it snows and you pull onto roundabout in the wet without any worries (don't buy the FWD model)
One really bad point is the SATNAV, which is sooooooo slow. I get the impression that it's steam powered...
Weird useful things include: Two batteries (one for starting), which helped out when the other battery went flat. Ride height adjustment (by an inch), for when I drive down this really rutted private road near me. The visual parking sensors that 'show' you how close the object is. Pop down cup holders for holding the mobile. Sliding face vent covers, 'cause they look so cool.
Low points: Not once, but twice being mistaken for a taxi when waiting to pick my daughter up from a party.
Jonny_ said:
Kell - that bears out what I've heard, which is that only four VW dealers actually work on Phaetons. Don't suppose anyone knows which ones they are? (A brief Googling sesh failed to find out!)
I can't remember whether I'd seen one at our local dealer or was just asking about them while our Golf was in for a service, but I'm fairly sure they said they did look after them. High Wycombe - which may be part of the same group at Little Chalfont.
ArnieVXR said:
Low points: Not once, but twice being mistaken for a taxi when waiting to pick my daughter up from a party.
We had one of the first MKIV Golfs in the country. Combine the fact that people weren't used to seeing one with our choice of black, meant that twice while driving in London we had people trying to 'hail' it.Edited by Kell on Wednesday 27th February 12:01
Having found a few photos of the interior I do quite like the look of the 4-seater - perhaps not overly practical but does look very smart. Think the Mrs would like having her own climate control as she currently has to sit in the back of the car with our baby daughter. Although all those buttons could become a problem as she gets older and more able to reach them!
Not overly surprised about the satnav, it's a pretty old design (did they even update it between the first 03 cars and your 07?), probably not cheap to update? Always got Google Maps on the phone as a backup! Didn't realise they had the ride height selector though - last car I saw that in was my parents' old C5.
Interested to see that you had an A8 before Arnie, that's my other option if I fail to find the right Phaeton at the right price. Doesn't quite have the Q-car appeal of a 6-litre "Passat XL", but the aluminium body should help fuel economy and performance as well as not having to worry about rust, and there are lots of 4.2 V8s about at tempting prices as well as the odd W12. Plus it still has the 4WD which is a massive advantage over the S Class or 7 Series in winter. Probably easier to get parts too as there are more of them about than the Phaeton. How would you say the two compare in terms of refinement?
Not overly surprised about the satnav, it's a pretty old design (did they even update it between the first 03 cars and your 07?), probably not cheap to update? Always got Google Maps on the phone as a backup! Didn't realise they had the ride height selector though - last car I saw that in was my parents' old C5.
Interested to see that you had an A8 before Arnie, that's my other option if I fail to find the right Phaeton at the right price. Doesn't quite have the Q-car appeal of a 6-litre "Passat XL", but the aluminium body should help fuel economy and performance as well as not having to worry about rust, and there are lots of 4.2 V8s about at tempting prices as well as the odd W12. Plus it still has the 4WD which is a massive advantage over the S Class or 7 Series in winter. Probably easier to get parts too as there are more of them about than the Phaeton. How would you say the two compare in terms of refinement?
I had the earlier model A8, which was a similar ride in luxury terms. Quite a big more sporty, though, due to the weight difference. The newer model has a much smaller 'cockpit' than the Phaeton. In fact,the whole car feels smaller. I haven't driven the newer model, so can't comment.
When I was looking for a sub £10k barge, I liked the idea of the Phaeton and thought the interior was lovely, but in the end I was swayed by the lighter body and apparently better build quality of the A8. I bought a 9 year old 4.2 and it has required nothing more than scheduled maintenance in 13 months and 36k miles.
I had a 4 seat w12 for a couple of years, lovely car but did not use it much working offshore and its a big thing to park so the missus would rather use hers so just stood there. Sold it a while ago but struggled to get a desent price for it everyone is scared off 6 litre but it was quite good on juice and once returned 25mpg on a run.
get one lifes to short not to but be aware it will not hold money but at the bottom end there is not much further to fall.
Rob
get one lifes to short not to but be aware it will not hold money but at the bottom end there is not much further to fall.
Rob
You'll find the V8's are difficult to find with around 20 being registered in the UK as oppose to around 100 W12's. Around 1700 diesels are within our shores. In the US the V8 was a much more popular option.
I've had my 2007 V8 about 4 months now and in that time I've only seen 4 others come up for sale - all of them 2003 - 2004 models. I like to keep an eye on values
Consumption for me is about 22mpg on a good run, 15mpg on my way to work ! It costs me just over £100 to fill up and I get 270 miles from that tank full. I'm also in the situation where I really don't drive many miles so the actual cost is no more than someone doing 12k a year ... at least this the man maths I applied to justify the purchase !
Take a look at this forum for a wealth of information .... http://forums.vwvortex.com/forumdisplay.php?112-Ph...
Martin
I've had my 2007 V8 about 4 months now and in that time I've only seen 4 others come up for sale - all of them 2003 - 2004 models. I like to keep an eye on values
Consumption for me is about 22mpg on a good run, 15mpg on my way to work ! It costs me just over £100 to fill up and I get 270 miles from that tank full. I'm also in the situation where I really don't drive many miles so the actual cost is no more than someone doing 12k a year ... at least this the man maths I applied to justify the purchase !
Take a look at this forum for a wealth of information .... http://forums.vwvortex.com/forumdisplay.php?112-Ph...
Martin
Oops, thought I'd replied to this a while ago, evidently I failed!
Sorry chaps... terribly poor manners on my part... thanks again for all the info, it's had a bearing on my idle perusal of fleabay and autotrader of late.
I'm swaying more toward the A8 (2003- version) lately. The number of 4.2 V8s available means less grief finding a good 'un, and also less of an uphill struggle to find spares should the need arise. (There's even a handful of W12s on offer although most appear to have been owned by the kind of twit who thinks 20" wheels and red brake calipers belong on a luxury car
)
I still prefer the image of the Phaeton; there's just something about having a car that most will dismiss as just another Passat, but with the engine and luxury bits from a Bentley, that appeals massively. Whereas the A8 is "blingier" - which is a negative in my book!
But... comparing A8 4.2 to Phaeton 6.0:
- insurance is £300 a year less
- aluminium shell won't rot
- easier to find both car and parts
- lighter weight should make up for much of the ~90bhp deficit
If a W12 Phaeton crops up then I'll have a hard time resisting, but with mysensible slightly less daft head on the A8 is the more sensible choice.
(... Expect an "A8 Buying Advice" thread to appear fairly soon...!
)
Sorry chaps... terribly poor manners on my part... thanks again for all the info, it's had a bearing on my idle perusal of fleabay and autotrader of late.
I'm swaying more toward the A8 (2003- version) lately. The number of 4.2 V8s available means less grief finding a good 'un, and also less of an uphill struggle to find spares should the need arise. (There's even a handful of W12s on offer although most appear to have been owned by the kind of twit who thinks 20" wheels and red brake calipers belong on a luxury car
)I still prefer the image of the Phaeton; there's just something about having a car that most will dismiss as just another Passat, but with the engine and luxury bits from a Bentley, that appeals massively. Whereas the A8 is "blingier" - which is a negative in my book!
But... comparing A8 4.2 to Phaeton 6.0:
- insurance is £300 a year less
- aluminium shell won't rot
- easier to find both car and parts
- lighter weight should make up for much of the ~90bhp deficit
If a W12 Phaeton crops up then I'll have a hard time resisting, but with my
(... Expect an "A8 Buying Advice" thread to appear fairly soon...!
)F***'s sake.
Not only are there hardly any V8s in the country, but some have suffered the indignity and sheer relentless incompetence of a Halfords "service":
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2003-VOLKSWAGEN-PHAETON-V8-A-5S...
Not only are there hardly any V8s in the country, but some have suffered the indignity and sheer relentless incompetence of a Halfords "service":
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2003-VOLKSWAGEN-PHAETON-V8-A-5S...
Jonny_ said:
F***'s sake.
Not only are there hardly any V8s in the country, but some have suffered the indignity and sheer relentless incompetence of a Halfords "service":
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2003-VOLKSWAGEN-PHAETON-V8-A-5S...
Not only are there hardly any V8s in the country, but some have suffered the indignity and sheer relentless incompetence of a Halfords "service":
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2003-VOLKSWAGEN-PHAETON-V8-A-5S...
The fact that it was owned by 'Sir Lipton' seven whole years ago is not wholly relevant either is it? It's not exactly like it was last year!
It gets worse...
www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/volkswag...
Holy f
king ste. And it's on PH too. Good luck flogging that...
www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/volkswag...
Holy f
king ste. And it's on PH too. Good luck flogging that...Gassing Station | Audi, Seat, Skoda & VW | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff