Discussion
Bit of a long shot, this, but there's no one on the forum who's thinking of trading their Griff for something that goes round corners and doesn't break down, is there?
Due to a girlfriend with a bad back, I'm having to think about selling my Elise to buy a comfy, old mans car with squishy seats and proper, full height doors, and the Griffith is coming up favourite (guess I'll just have to learn to slow down for corners
)
Looking for a Griff up to about £18K, against a value for the Elise of about £12.5K.
If anyone is interested, my ad. is on www.pistonheads.com/sales/detail.asp?i=25427&s=12
>>> Edited by Martin_S on Friday 2nd July 08:01
Due to a girlfriend with a bad back, I'm having to think about selling my Elise to buy a comfy, old mans car with squishy seats and proper, full height doors, and the Griffith is coming up favourite (guess I'll just have to learn to slow down for corners
) Looking for a Griff up to about £18K, against a value for the Elise of about £12.5K.
If anyone is interested, my ad. is on www.pistonheads.com/sales/detail.asp?i=25427&s=12
>>> Edited by Martin_S on Friday 2nd July 08:01
I would think that if you could DETUNE a griff to the 'pathetic' power to weight ratio that an elise has. You would find that a griff has a pretty good chassis, (based on the tuscn challenge car originally) and that they are just designed to have a silly power to weight ratio, to make you learn to drive a powerful car, rather than just be a passenger and let the car do all the work for you (theory for tuscan challenge - cars DESIGNED to have more power than grip, to make the racing interesting.
Anyway I can't fit in an elise, so no swap from me
Edited to add, a new lotus dealer has offered me a test in an exige tommorrow, so that might be fun.
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Friday 2nd July 08:55
power to weight ratio that an elise has. You would find that a griff has a pretty good chassis, (based on the tuscn challenge car originally) and that they are just designed to have a silly power to weight ratio, to make you learn to drive a powerful car, rather than just be a passenger and let the car do all the work for you (theory for tuscan challenge - cars DESIGNED to have more power than grip, to make the racing interesting. Anyway I can't fit in an elise, so no swap from me
Edited to add, a new lotus dealer has offered me a test in an exige tommorrow, so that might be fun.
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Friday 2nd July 08:55
Martin_S said:
www.pistonheads.com/sales/detail.asp?i=25427&s=12
I like the idea that your car comes with a shower cap.
Is that the Elise Integrated Hair Protection unit by another name?
bjwoods said:
I would think that if you could DETUNE a griff to the 'pathetic'
Anyway I can't fit in an elise, so no swap from me
Edited to add, a new lotus dealer has offered me a test in an exige tommorrow, so that might be fun.
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Friday 2nd July 08:55
Don't want to worry you, B, but the Exige is an even tighter fit than the Elise. Make sure they have the tools available to get the roof off, or you may have to spend the weekend in there!
Done a couple of track days recently where there were plenty of Elises (all of which Simon, Tony and I were passing on a fairly regular basis) which proves either
a). They are so slow, higher corner speed does not compensate
b) They are slow and don't go round corners any better than a Griff
or c) They're driven by people who don't know how to drive.
Word of advice: If you're serious about finding someone to swap with, I'd ask your questions in a manner less likley to piss off your potential helpers.
editied to add: Sorry, re-reading your post, my reply seems a little harse, but you get the point...
>> Edited by starmist on Friday 2nd July 18:33
a). They are so slow, higher corner speed does not compensate
b) They are slow and don't go round corners any better than a Griff
or c) They're driven by people who don't know how to drive.
Word of advice: If you're serious about finding someone to swap with, I'd ask your questions in a manner less likley to piss off your potential helpers.
editied to add: Sorry, re-reading your post, my reply seems a little harse, but you get the point...
>> Edited by starmist on Friday 2nd July 18:33
Chill Starmist, chill!
Lotus owners are quite happy to take the p155 out of each other and their cars, without anyone taking it remotely seriously...obviously I misjudged the frail egos that go with some TVR owners, for which I apologise.
FWIIW, Griffith and Elise lap times in the hands of a consistent professional driver are very, very similar. I have a video clip of an Elise walking all over a Cerbera at Donington, and I have thrashed a Griff on country roads driving (don't laugh!) a Vauxhall Carlton 3000GSi 24V, so I guess it is mainly down to driver competence (or, perhaps, confidence).
Personally, I use a race spec. Sylva Clubmans for my track use, which will show a clean pair of heels to either a Griff (better power:weight ratio than a Griff 500 - 175bhp in 508kg car) or an Elise (much stiffer suspension set-up, lighter weight, better weight distribution), but you really wouldn't want to drive it on the road!
I'm in the market for a car, not a penis extension, so I have no problems with the fact that both the car I am selling and the car I am buying have flaws. I don't think there can be any question that Griffs are less reliable than Elises (though probably more reliable than any other car Lotus has ever manufactured), or that Elises are underpowered compared to Griffs. Elises are also bloody uncomfortable and have lousy gearchanges, but, hey, you pays your money and you takes your choice!
As to the question of handling, could I ask for a genuine show of hands from anyone who has the confidence to set up 4-wheel drifts in their Griffith on a regular basis on public roads? I asked a major specialist TVR dealer, who is well known on the hillclimb scene in single seaters but who had better remain nameless to protect his business, what his honest opinion of the handling was (in the context of him trying to sell me a car). He knew I was a Lotus owner. He just grimaced and said 'slow in, fast out'!
Apologies once again for any offence caused - just put it down to the quirky sense of humour you develop after 15 years of driving cars that go by the acronymn 'Lots Of Trouble, Usually Serious'!
Lotus owners are quite happy to take the p155 out of each other and their cars, without anyone taking it remotely seriously...obviously I misjudged the frail egos that go with some TVR owners, for which I apologise.
FWIIW, Griffith and Elise lap times in the hands of a consistent professional driver are very, very similar. I have a video clip of an Elise walking all over a Cerbera at Donington, and I have thrashed a Griff on country roads driving (don't laugh!) a Vauxhall Carlton 3000GSi 24V, so I guess it is mainly down to driver competence (or, perhaps, confidence).
Personally, I use a race spec. Sylva Clubmans for my track use, which will show a clean pair of heels to either a Griff (better power:weight ratio than a Griff 500 - 175bhp in 508kg car) or an Elise (much stiffer suspension set-up, lighter weight, better weight distribution), but you really wouldn't want to drive it on the road!
I'm in the market for a car, not a penis extension, so I have no problems with the fact that both the car I am selling and the car I am buying have flaws. I don't think there can be any question that Griffs are less reliable than Elises (though probably more reliable than any other car Lotus has ever manufactured), or that Elises are underpowered compared to Griffs. Elises are also bloody uncomfortable and have lousy gearchanges, but, hey, you pays your money and you takes your choice!
As to the question of handling, could I ask for a genuine show of hands from anyone who has the confidence to set up 4-wheel drifts in their Griffith on a regular basis on public roads? I asked a major specialist TVR dealer, who is well known on the hillclimb scene in single seaters but who had better remain nameless to protect his business, what his honest opinion of the handling was (in the context of him trying to sell me a car). He knew I was a Lotus owner. He just grimaced and said 'slow in, fast out'!
Apologies once again for any offence caused - just put it down to the quirky sense of humour you develop after 15 years of driving cars that go by the acronymn 'Lots Of Trouble, Usually Serious'!
I would say fair play to Martin - friend of mine has an Elise, and I reckon I could pedal his Elise round a twisty track faster than I could my Griff (though I might have a stupider grin in the Griff), which is probably more of a testament to my poor wheelmanship than anything else. But they are unquestionably a very sorted, highly entertaining sports car. If you don't like the way they drive, you need some help !
My girlfriend has an Elise and I want a Griff.
The Elise is a great car if you are going to do loads of trackdays and country road driving, but its just not fast enough in std guise on most 'normal roads'.
I got beaten off the lights in it by an Audi A8 last week and that sort of sums it up. The Elise would kill the A8 on a track or on twisties, but I want a car that will kill it anywhere !!
So now that all you Griff owners are on my side, how about somebody offers me a nice 95 model for a decent price !!
SOOTY
The Elise is a great car if you are going to do loads of trackdays and country road driving, but its just not fast enough in std guise on most 'normal roads'.
I got beaten off the lights in it by an Audi A8 last week and that sort of sums it up. The Elise would kill the A8 on a track or on twisties, but I want a car that will kill it anywhere !!
So now that all you Griff owners are on my side, how about somebody offers me a nice 95 model for a decent price !!
SOOTY
Interesting... Very.
I've been posting requests for advice on car choice since late last night and I think I'm getting closer to an answer.
I have been waiting for some honest Biased(!) opinions.
I like power. So it has to be the Griff. Good luck with the Elise, I'll mention it to my girlfriend!
I've been posting requests for advice on car choice since late last night and I think I'm getting closer to an answer.
I have been waiting for some honest Biased(!) opinions.
I like power. So it has to be the Griff. Good luck with the Elise, I'll mention it to my girlfriend!
Martin_S said:I would suggest that the Griffith driver was simply having a bit of fun and not really trying, after all why bother? On the the other hand the fact that you remember the incident and recount it as a one of your better moments suggests you were flat out. Rich...
I have thrashed a Griff on country roads driving a Vauxhall Carlton 3000GSi 24V...
Ed Winchester said:
Interesting... Very.
I've been posting requests for advice on car choice since late last night and I think I'm getting closer to an answer.
I have been waiting for some honest Biased(!) opinions.
I like power. So it has to be the Griff. Good luck with the Elise, I'll mention it to my girlfriend!
And there was me trying to be unbiased in my opinion when we were talking Elise vs. Chimeara
I have experience of Elise vs. Griff and to be honest it still depends on what you like if you want to be able to:
a) Have massive acceleration out of corners and for overtaking (I had my foot flat to the floor and the Griff was gaining hand over fist) then Griff is what you need looks better than a Chim too
b) Carry unbelieveable amounts of speed into corners or do your favourite back road at high speed without using the brakes (quote Griff driver ** 'I was waiting for your brake lights to come on
) then you need an Elise. As for on track - I don't know I've never been on a track with any TVRs around so I can't comment, I suspect on an average track they are quite similar in times but will entertain in different ways.
Test drive both and see what floats your boat.
** the Griff driver was a well known indecisive South Coast PHer
Edit>> Martin - sorry to hear you're giving up Elise ownership, it looks in good condition though and should sell well. Pleased to see the value of it too
>> Edited by cuzza on Friday 9th July 15:51
RichB said:
I have thrashed a Griff on country roads driving a Vauxhall Carlton 3000GSi 24V...
I would suggest that the Griffith driver was simply having a bit of fun and not really trying, after all why bother? On the the other hand the fact that you remember the incident and recount it as a one of your better moments suggests you were flat out. Rich...
He was trying hard enough to provoke a fairly fierce tailslide on dampish, coolish autumn roads, after which he really slowed down for some reason
I wasn't flat out by any means...I just remember it because it's about the only time I've been able to provoke a Griff into a race.
FWIIW, the car that I really wouldn't tangle with on the road is a Misubishi Evo VII or VIII...absurdly quick, and would leave either a Griffith or an Elise for dead unless driven by a comlplete gimp. Wouldn't have one given, though - not even as a company car. There's more to driving than sheer speed!
simpo two said:
Umm - if you like Elise's so much and not Griffs, stay with what you've got.
You obviously haven't read my earlier post, so I'll quote from it again: 'I have no problems with the fact that both the car I am selling and the car I am buying have flaws. I don't think there can be any question that Griffs are less reliable than Elises (though probably more reliable than any other car Lotus has ever manufactured), or that Elises are underpowered compared to Griffs. Elises are also bloody uncomfortable and have lousy gearchanges, but, hey, you pays your money and you takes your choice!'
I love certain elements of the Elise, and hate others. I'm sure it will be the same with the Griff (think I've found the right one, now, by the way).
Bottom line, though, is that I probably wouldn't have bothered changing to a Griff if it wasn't for pressure from my g/f to get something more comfortable. We regularly do 300 mile+ jaunts in a day on sunny weekends, and the Elise is quite literally a pain in the arse for that sort of journey!
cinqster said:
Anyway I can't fit in an elise, so no swap from me
>> Edited by bjwoods on Friday 2nd July 08:55
I'm lost on this? I had both the Griff and Elise on my wish list, but the Elise won because the Griff has no legroom.
John S.
Lol...the two cars must draw on that one, then! Can't say that I've noticed the Griff being short on space (then again I'm only 5'10"), but getting into an Elise with the hood up is like climbing through a letterbox - even if you do fit alright once you've managed to get in there! My shortarse (5'0") girlfriend gan get in an out easier than me, but then isn't comfortable 'cos she can't reach the footrest to brace herself when I go round corners.
cinqster said:
Anyway I can't fit in an elise, so no swap from me
>> Edited by bjwoods on Friday 2nd July 08:55
I'm lost on this? I had both the Griff and Elise on my wish list, but the Elise won because the Griff has no legroom.
John S.
Peter Wheeler fits in a griffith and he's 6 foot 5?????!!!!.
Elises are terrible to get in and out of especially with the roof on, the griff just feels like a real sports car, not some sort of underpowered kart like toy.
B
Well, I've owned both- and although the Griff has been off the road for most of my ownership, I'm not going back.
I still feel that I will get these small things fixed, and Griff ownership will be more pleasant.
Now if Lotus would put a V8 in an Elise- na, I still need to make some concessions for passengers!
(the Griff is a much more special place to be, and it looks nearly as good as an S1 Elise)
And it gets GF approval!
I still feel that I will get these small things fixed, and Griff ownership will be more pleasant.
Now if Lotus would put a V8 in an Elise- na, I still need to make some concessions for passengers!
(the Griff is a much more special place to be, and it looks nearly as good as an S1 Elise)
And it gets GF approval!
Martin_S said:
He was trying hard enough to provoke a fairly fierce tailslide on dampish, coolish autumn roads,
kinda says it all really, a griff in damp conditions is tricky to drive fast and hard, compared to the weight of a 3.0l carlton. i am sure in the dry it wouldn't even be a close contest.
Gassing Station | Griffith | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff