Any ideas, electrical problem?

[Paul V]

The Griff broke down last night on the M20, I first thought it to be a fuel problem as it was running low so got someone to bring me some out, but it still wouldn’t go, when it stopped it cut out straight away, no coughing and spluttering so though it could be a electrical problem, I took a lead off and stuck a key in the end to check for a spark but there was nothing there, I then took the coil lead from the centre of the cap and tried but there was no spark there but when I put a screw driver into the end of the coil there was a spark. I replace the lead from the cap to the coil and the car now fires up but cuts out instantly after. I’m suspecting maybe it’s the spare lead I replaced the old one with as it’s been in the boot for a while, also thinking maybe the coil is breaking down.

[starmist]

I had similar problems when I'd tried (in Vain) to start the car with a coil that had no earth. It fouled the plugs really badly and wouldn't start. In the end I got it tow started and eventually it ran, but wouldn't tick over. This cleared after 5 or 10 miles, so it may be worth taking it out for a long drive and see if the plugs clean up.

[Paul V]

I suppose I could try putting new plugs in it then, there was a smell of petrol as it was trying to start so could just be flooded.

It won’t stay running so can’t drive it to clear it

[starmist]

Not even if you keep blipping the throttle?

[Paul V]

Nope, fires and dies straight away which is why I thought there might be something breaking down.

[nawarne]

Sounds similar to a problem I had last year at Le Mans. (in my V8S).
I'd check the coil, then the ignition amplifier on the side of the distributor.....and then (most expensive option) the dizzy itself. On my car it proved to be the dizzy - cost about £250 recon or £400 new.
I experienced similar symptoms - in fact coming off the ferry at Portsmouth last year and trying to rendezvous with the RAC to get relayed home, I drove up to the end of the M275 and it seemed fine - but later cut out again, just as yours did.

One other thought - have you checked the inertia switch? - but it does sound like sparks rather than petrol.

[Paul V]

I’ll look at the dizzy, haven’t checked the inertia switch though, does the Griff have one?

>> Edited by Paul V on Thursday 22 July 12:23

[starmist]

Yes, it's mounted o the front of the heater matrix box, under the dash. You can get to it by removing the glove box lid ( allen key bolts) rather than fumbling around underneath.

Presumably you can hear the fuel pumps whir when you first turn the ignition key?

[Paul V]

Yes the fuel pump is priming ok, I presume the inertia switch would cut power to it? I’m going to pick up another coil this evening and see if that helps.

[B16 RFF]

Paul V said:

Yes the fuel pump is priming ok, I presume the inertia switch would cut power to it? I’m going to pick up another coil this evening and see if that helps.

Hi Paul,
Yes, I would check the coil by replacement as a likely cause. Did you break down to or from the Windmill?

Paul.

[Paul V]

I didn’t manage to get the coil last night but will pick one up today, I’ll also grab a new lead as well.

I was on my way to the windmill, fortunate really as it was 12.45 by the time I got home from breaking down at 8.

[Paul V]

Quick update, I replaced the coil and the coil lead. This didn’t seem to make any difference, so after some testing with the voltmeter I moved on to the foot well, checked the relays were plugged in properly which the were the unplugged the ECU, after putting it back in I tried to start it, it didn’t want to then all of a sudden fired up, I revved it a little and it seemed fine, so let it warm up, I then got ready to take it up the road, as soon as a pressed the throttle it died again, now sounds like it’s not even trying again. Wondering if there’s anything in the foot well that would affect the spark?

I've tested the supply to the fuel pump, it gets 12v as it primes when the ignition is turned on, then drops back to nothing when, I’ve been told that the fuel pump will only get voltage with the engine running though.

[Ballistic Banana]

I wonder if a Diagnostic tester would be able to find the fault?
I feel for you these type of faults are so frustrating.

I take it you have the Bible, theres some good stuf on page 106 of the new edition of possible causes.
Temp sensor Lamba sensor/dirty injectors

As I have been told before It can get expensive replacing things at a a chance it will cure the fault.

God luck

BB

[B16 RFF]

Paul V said:

Quick update, I replaced the coil and the coil lead. This didn’t seem to make any difference, so after some testing with the voltmeter I moved on to the foot well, checked the relays were plugged in properly which the were the unplugged the ECU, after putting it back in I tried to start it, it didn’t want to then all of a sudden fired up, I revved it a little and it seemed fine, so let it warm up, I then got ready to take it up the road, as soon as a pressed the throttle it died again, now sounds like it’s not even trying again. Wondering if there’s anything in the foot well that would affect the spark? I've tested the supply to the fuel pump, it gets 12v as it primes when the ignition is turned on, then drops back to nothing when, I’ve been told that the fuel pump will only get voltage with the engine running though.

The supply to the fuel pump is controlled by a relay. This allows power to the pump for a few seconds when the key is first turned, then it requires pulses from the ignition to keep the contacts closed. This relay can be a problem, and you can test it by removing it altogether and fitting a jumper wire between terminals 87 and 30 of the relay socket. The pump should now run continuously and the car should drive OK. Not sure where this relay is fitted, but I suspect it is in the passenger footwell somewhere. Perhaps it would be simpler to run a fused 12v supply directly from the battery to the pump. If all is now OK, it must be a problem with the relay/connectors.

It could also be the pump itself that is faulty.

>> Edited by B16 RFF on Saturday 24th July 09:56

>> Edited by B16 RFF on Saturday 24th July 09:57

[Paul V]

Well we’re off to Brands hatch today so won’t get a chance to look at it till tomorrow now, I was going to run a direct live to the fuel pump to see if it makes any difference. One for tomorrow morning then.

[Paul V]

Looks like I’ve managed to fix it, turned out to be the multi plug that connects to the ignition module, luckily I had a spare in the garage so put a new one on, also managed to tidy the ignition wires up a little.

[B16 RFF]

Paul V said:

Looks like I’ve managed to fix it, turned out to be the multi plug that connects to the ignition module, luckily I had a spare in the garage so put a new one on, also managed to tidy the ignition wires up a little.

Well done!
How did you track it down to that?

[Paul V]

Started again, with checking for a spark, there wasn’t one again, so played the the connections to the coil, no difference, then tried the module, it started sparking and fired up and ran ok, so chopped the old one off and replaced it.