Discussion
Appologies: forgot to put a new topic heading in the original thread, its been a long day!
I have a non PAS, pre-cat car. Although the non PAS is not to every ones taste, I do like the directness and simplicity of it. It also seems to compliment the early cars well IMHO (there are lots of threads on the subject so I won’t go there).
Unfortunately the non PAS racks do seem to wear quite quickly. Mine has a little play in the centre position so I would like to refurbish the steering rack it at some time in the future.
Tower View were quoting, I think, around or just over £600 to refurb the rack, refit it, including new track rod ends and VAT etc. That could well be a good price.
However, if the refurb on its own was not too expensive, I might have a go at changing it myself. To be honest I would also like to reduce the number of turns lock to lock. I seem to recall that the PAS rack is half a turn or so less, lock to lock, that the non PAS, obviously to reduce the steering loads.
The reason why is that I do seem to have to make quite big steering inputs to catch the back end sometimes (one of the plus points for the PAS I seem to recall).
Maybe there is no such thing as a non PAS “quick rack”; maybe the steering is just too heavy. Having said that, while I have many shortcomings; at 6’ 2” and 16 stone turning the wheel is not one of them.
Does anyone know is such a thing exists, who might know about these things or who would be the best people to get a quote from for a rack refurb?
Cheers
Peter
I have a non PAS, pre-cat car. Although the non PAS is not to every ones taste, I do like the directness and simplicity of it. It also seems to compliment the early cars well IMHO (there are lots of threads on the subject so I won’t go there).
Unfortunately the non PAS racks do seem to wear quite quickly. Mine has a little play in the centre position so I would like to refurbish the steering rack it at some time in the future.
Tower View were quoting, I think, around or just over £600 to refurb the rack, refit it, including new track rod ends and VAT etc. That could well be a good price.
However, if the refurb on its own was not too expensive, I might have a go at changing it myself. To be honest I would also like to reduce the number of turns lock to lock. I seem to recall that the PAS rack is half a turn or so less, lock to lock, that the non PAS, obviously to reduce the steering loads.
The reason why is that I do seem to have to make quite big steering inputs to catch the back end sometimes (one of the plus points for the PAS I seem to recall).
Maybe there is no such thing as a non PAS “quick rack”; maybe the steering is just too heavy. Having said that, while I have many shortcomings; at 6’ 2” and 16 stone turning the wheel is not one of them.
Does anyone know is such a thing exists, who might know about these things or who would be the best people to get a quote from for a rack refurb?
Cheers
Peter
If you want a quick rack, take a PAS rack and don't connect the PAS. You will find however that it is incredibly heavy and will put additional strain on you and the steering column as you fight it. You could go to narrower tyres to lighten the steering but that defeats the whole object. I doubt it will be any better as while the amount of input will be reduced, the amount of effort required will be a lot higher.
It might be possible to get some gears made to change the ratios but it will be expensive like any custom work of this type. Seriously, I would consider PAS if you want to improve the catchability.
It might be possible to get some gears made to change the ratios but it will be expensive like any custom work of this type. Seriously, I would consider PAS if you want to improve the catchability.
I would also recommend fitting PAS. Did it to my Griff 500 in the summer and it has transformed the car. Interesting that you mentioned a small amount of play in the central position. I have got a small amount even with a reconditioned PAS rack fitted. The TVR dealer who supplied the rack told me it was "normal for a TVR" !!!
IPAddis said:
Do the PAS racks have quicker gearing or do they just have less lock? When I put on 225/50 tyres (PAS spec) on my non-PAS Griff, they rubbed the arches on full lock. Got me wondering if PAS Griffs have slightly less lock / wider turning circle.
Ian A.
Good question. It really frustrates me when journalists rave about a 'quick rack' having '2.2 turns lock to lock' (or whatever) and then complain about the turning circle...
Thanks for the comments.
To be honest, it is only a small amount of play, so perhaps that is the norm. A couple of people a lot more experienced in TVRs than I, have thought it was not too much of a problem. However, a very early 4.3 non PAS that I tried, with only 18k miles on the clock, did appear to have less play.
Because it was the factory publicity 4.3 BV car, I suppose that I didn’t want to keep messing with it too much, although in reality it is now a long way from being a standard BV.
Having said that when I asked Heath Briggs at the factory (very helpful guy) what else he would do to the car if it was his (he had looked after it for 13 years) he did say that he would fit a PAS rack and then an electric pump / reservoir unit, from I think a Tuscan. When I looked into it I seem to recall that it was looking like a £1,600 or so project, if you could find a recon rack.
Incidentally, the car already came fitted with the narrower tyres from the factory.
Steve- do you have any experience of fitting the electric pump on a Griff? Is it a simpler / neater option? It is already fitted with the 100 amp alternator.
Cheers
Peter
To be honest, it is only a small amount of play, so perhaps that is the norm. A couple of people a lot more experienced in TVRs than I, have thought it was not too much of a problem. However, a very early 4.3 non PAS that I tried, with only 18k miles on the clock, did appear to have less play.
Because it was the factory publicity 4.3 BV car, I suppose that I didn’t want to keep messing with it too much, although in reality it is now a long way from being a standard BV.
Having said that when I asked Heath Briggs at the factory (very helpful guy) what else he would do to the car if it was his (he had looked after it for 13 years) he did say that he would fit a PAS rack and then an electric pump / reservoir unit, from I think a Tuscan. When I looked into it I seem to recall that it was looking like a £1,600 or so project, if you could find a recon rack.
Incidentally, the car already came fitted with the narrower tyres from the factory.
Steve- do you have any experience of fitting the electric pump on a Griff? Is it a simpler / neater option? It is already fitted with the 100 amp alternator.
Cheers
Peter
so look out for the postie 
Steve - Thanks for the advice. Is it just a case of trying to find a s/hand PAS rack (do they make them any more?) having it overhauled, buying a pump and then trying to get the resevoir, plumbing etc as best you can, assuming that you are trying to do it the cheapest route.
Maybe someone like Bell View would be the best place to start although I am guessing that a complete system from a damaged car would be at a premium.
BB - Thanks again for the magazine articles
Cheers
Peter
Maybe someone like Bell View would be the best place to start although I am guessing that a complete system from a damaged car would be at a premium.
BB - Thanks again for the magazine articles
Cheers
Peter
shpub said:
I'm doing it for the Corvette engine transplant on the Cerbera. It takes around 30A and needs some serious plumbing for both electricity and fluid.
To be honest I would simply fit a Rover pump on the engine. Cheap to pick up and a lot easier to install.
I would only agree that the Rover pump would be easier if you have a serp engine, if you have a pre-serp then elctric pmp is the way to go, I've converted my Griff to PAS this summer with an electric pump from a Peugeot 106/Citroen Saxo. It was a piece of pi** to do. Full PAS conversion for £400ish. ( I was lucky to pick up a PAS rack for £140 though !!).
shpub said:
For pre-serp engines a SD1 PAS pump is around the £10-15. s/h. Bit of bracketry and away you go.
No more difficult than for an electric pump. Still what ever works.
I looked at using an SD1 pump but with the reservoir part of the pump (the filler tube mainly), virtually made it impossible due to lack of space between engine and chassis. The Landrover pump would be a better bet (I still have one that I never used if anyones interested), if you're gonna try and fabricate brackets, as it has a seperate reservoir as per the serp setup. This was the way I was going till I opted for the electric pump. The other option I was contemplating was changing the front timing cover for a Landrover one in place of the SD1 one.
Like you say, whatever works for you.
wixer said:
For pre-serp engines a SD1 PAS pump is around the £10-15. s/h. Bit of bracketry and away you go.
No more difficult than for an electric pump. Still what ever works.
I looked at using an SD1 pump but with the reservoir part of the pump (the filler tube mainly), virtually made it impossible due to lack of space between engine and chassis. The Landrover pump would be a better bet (I still have one that I never used if anyones interested), if you're gonna try and fabricate brackets, as it has a seperate reservoir as per the serp setup. This was the way I was going till I opted for the electric pump. The other option I was contemplating was changing the front timing cover for a Landrover one in place of the SD1 one.
Like you say, whatever works for you.
Wixer - now you mention the Peugot / Citroen pump that is what Heath Briggs at the factory suggested. Does the pump come as a self contained pump / regulator / reservior?. If that is the case I guess you could mount it anywhere?
Are you able to plumb the pump to the rack using high pressure flexible hoses? I don't suppose you have any pictures of the installation? I have not seen one done before. I suppose the holy grail of it all is getting a decent rack and shaft cheaply as you did.
Cheers
The pump is self contained - I'm using one from a Kangoo which has a vertical setup. Two pipes to the rack and a substantial electrical feed to the pump and that's it. The unit is quite big in comparison because of the humungous motor needed to power it. The Kangoo one is around 6 inches in diameter and weighs several Kg.
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