Griffith Modifications
Discussion
I have a 1999 Griff that the last owner spent a good deal on but he never got serious with the engine ......
As far as he went was the obligatory straight through for the exhaust, removal of the precats, a foam panel filter and a Mark Adams session on the rollers. The result was - and still is - a healthy 267bhp with 330 ft Ib of torque on Austec's RR.
He spent money and the suspension uprated with Avo's and had the brakes replaced with Wilwood items.
Question is, what can I do next to get a little more power. I would like a bit more / easier breathing at the top end but don't want it to be rough at the bottom end. I was thinking of the ACT inlet stuff as opposed to a new camshaft ......
Is this a logical step ? I presume it would need remapping again ..... and what sort of increase would I reasonably expect ?
If anyone has any comments or different ideas please feel free to share .......
As far as he went was the obligatory straight through for the exhaust, removal of the precats, a foam panel filter and a Mark Adams session on the rollers. The result was - and still is - a healthy 267bhp with 330 ft Ib of torque on Austec's RR.
He spent money and the suspension uprated with Avo's and had the brakes replaced with Wilwood items.
Question is, what can I do next to get a little more power. I would like a bit more / easier breathing at the top end but don't want it to be rough at the bottom end. I was thinking of the ACT inlet stuff as opposed to a new camshaft ......
Is this a logical step ? I presume it would need remapping again ..... and what sort of increase would I reasonably expect ?
If anyone has any comments or different ideas please feel free to share .......
richb said:
a foam panel filter
I thought the std Griff air filter was a(n) (oil soaked) foam one. I've been considering the K&N panel ones at ACT recently, but really don't know if they'd be any improvement.
geoffvalenti said:
a foam panel filter
I thought the std Griff air filter was a(n) (oil soaked) foam one. I've been considering the K&N panel ones at ACT recently, but really don't know if they'd be any improvement.
Maybe it is the standard filter ....
As for how much to spend ..... £1500 'ish max if poss
Not got any data to back this up yet (my car's been off the road for a fortnight), but I think there's sizable gains to be had from a better ECU that can control both fuelling and ignition timing.
I expect to have a decent amount of proof (one way or the other) in March.
And I'm hoping for quite a bit more than 6 bhp Peter!
I expect to have a decent amount of proof (one way or the other) in March.
And I'm hoping for quite a bit more than 6 bhp Peter!
you would only nede to remap it if the uprated airflow goes outside hte upper limits of the airflow meter, in which case junk teh meter and go remappable ecu as said earlier .. as mark adams tells us the Lucas can cope with differing airflows as long as the scaling doesn't max out.
so on that basis, just go for a bigger butterfly, blended trumpet base and thermal isolator and some silicone inlet hoses (particularly the 90degree one from the air flow meter) and wrap sopme heat reflective insulation around it, you may need uprated fuel line pressure which can be set up on the rollers. I'd be surprised if you couldn't get another 15hp for under 1000 pounds on your current car based on the gains i got on my 4 litre.
so on that basis, just go for a bigger butterfly, blended trumpet base and thermal isolator and some silicone inlet hoses (particularly the 90degree one from the air flow meter) and wrap sopme heat reflective insulation around it, you may need uprated fuel line pressure which can be set up on the rollers. I'd be surprised if you couldn't get another 15hp for under 1000 pounds on your current car based on the gains i got on my 4 litre.
I would have thought that uprating the inlet manifold, plenum base and trumpets (and possibly a new cam) followed by an R/R session with Mark Adams would give more bang for your buck than replacing the Lucas system (which can't be that easy and a distributor-less system WILL need extensive mapping on a R/R no?).
Certainly that's the route that V8D were advising when I had mine done. Mark Adams advises on a new AFM, bigger injectors and bigger throttle body / plenum chamber IIRC but that's also a bit pricey by comparison.
Ian A.
Certainly that's the route that V8D were advising when I had mine done. Mark Adams advises on a new AFM, bigger injectors and bigger throttle body / plenum chamber IIRC but that's also a bit pricey by comparison.
Ian A.
my fully mapped sequential fuel and ignition system has cost me £600 (so far - just new injectors still to go) When the rest of the car wants to play and isn't plagued by leaks and worn out gaskets, it all runs very well, is much smoother and more responsive than the Lucas ECU. No power figures for after yet, as I'm still tinkering and tuning. Oh, and all the mapping has been done on real roads, so no RR bills yet. 
IPAddis said:Replacing the Lucas system has become very cost effective nowadays.I made my choice to junk the lucas over a year ago,and then there weren't so many choices which were well known.The Lucas is very expensive to get mapped,and very restrictive to performance with it's 2 injector output and no spark control.It obviously is more work to map the spark as well,but it's still a lot cheaper to do this at independant rolling roads,than to use Mark to map your Lucas for just fuel!!'Upgrading to a bigger AFM is also not required with an alternative ecu,so that's another great expense spared,you also get more bhp by doing this!.Theres just no sense in keeping the Lucas system any more,not if you want to make power,and make it cost effectively.Even if you only want the to map once or twice with minor mods,the costs just don't add up.You can even sell the Lucas kit to offset the costs if you like,making it even cheaper to do this
I would have thought that uprating the inlet manifold, plenum base and trumpets (and possibly a new cam) followed by an R/R session with Mark Adams would give more bang for your buck than replacing the Lucas system (which can't be that easy and a distributor-less system WILL need extensive mapping on a R/R no?).
Ian A.
IPAddis said:
Dellortos Topsparks had the full 400bhp engine and then when in car post remap - it is crap - binning the whole bloody lot as a total waste of time. He is spending around 1500 on the kit and fitting and set up.
Eh?
What jon is saying was i built an engine for topsparks that made very close to 400 bhp on our dyno, however to get the fuelling right i had to jack the fuel presure up and run a an airbleed into the plenum as it was pulling the airflow meter up too far, when it was fitted in his car obviously you cant run it like this so it wasnt as it should be, it is still pretty quick apparently it stays with jons ls6 beasty up to about 5000 rpm but then it was suffering, IMHO for slightly modded cars you may as well stick with the 14cux, but the more mods you do you have to start looking at a minimum of mapable ignition
mongoose said:
I would have thought that uprating the inlet manifold, plenum base and trumpets (and possibly a new cam) followed by an R/R session with Mark Adams would give more bang for your buck than replacing the Lucas system (which can't be that easy and a distributor-less system WILL need extensive mapping on a R/R no?).
Ian A.
Although I'm on the outside of the Rover V8 world these days, I'm always interested in these kinds of modification debates. When you say cheaper, what are the actual costs for the modifications you've done Mike?
Cheers,
Steve
Steve_T said:Which mods Steve?The Omex to replace the Lucas,was an expensive choice and one which even a year ago i could have taken a cheaper option on which would still give similar benefits that i mentioned.It cost me £1450,all fitted,up and running.I would imagine it would cost you up to 2k to do this now,but you would have to ask V8D for a current price.This is why i mentioned the fact that there are now other options.The megasquirt is the way i would go if i was in the same position now.I know Joo was looking at doing these,fitted and mapped for fuel and spark at a target price of £500!.I quite literally sold my AFM and Lucas ecu for £350 to offset some of the costs,but then bought it back to keep in case i want to revert to originality!!
When you say cheaper, what are the actual costs for the modifications you've done Mike?
Cheers,
Steve
As far as the mapping costs go,i had a full afternoons mapping session at Nobles for £275 i think it was.I'm off to Track car solutions on Friday,but dont know what he charges/hour. The engine mods were a kit(stage 3) sold and fitted by V8D and cost about £1600 from memory,yet give Taraka performance levels(some say even better).Suspension was from Trackcar solutions at over £800 then-£570 for the same kit now!Front end bushes were £100ish from memory......er is that it?
I think i'm close with all of the prices,but apologise if i'm not correct on some of them,as i dont have the reciepts to hand at the mo.
>> Edited by mongoose on Tuesday 21st February 19:23
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