Brake upgrade?
Discussion
Were you unhappy with the brakes before? Unless you are putting your brakes under extreme pressure for sustained periods, then I think the standard set up is fine. The first upgrades you should consider are dot 5.1 fluid, braided hoses and better pads, like the DS2500 mentioned, before you start changing disc sizes. Just my 2p.
If you need to replace just the discs, it may be worth considering 283mm diameter replacements. Nothing else need be changed - retain existing calipers, pads, etc if you like, yet you benefit from greater diameter discs. I bought mine with this already done so can't give you a before & after report, but mine are pretty good. 
Don't know if it's only happened to me,but my red stuff ceramic(latest compound) pads have scored my std discs,and it looks quite poor.They perform well when hot,but there are no brakes when wet and cold,until after the first press of the pedal,which has nearly caught me out once or twice
!!
I would try the Ferodo's next time
!! I would try the Ferodo's next time
LordGrover said:
If you need to replace just the discs, it may be worth considering 283mm diameter replacements. Nothing else need be changed - retain existing calipers, pads, etc if you like, yet you benefit from greater diameter discs. I bought mine with this already done so can't give you a before & after report, but mine are pretty good.
Surely you need to space the caliper a bit further out at least?
Otherwise won't the caliper crunch into the disc?
Matt
Edited by 350matt on Monday 2nd April 13:20
350matt said:
LordGrover said:
If you need to replace just the discs, it may be worth considering 283mm diameter replacements. Nothing else need be changed - retain existing calipers, pads, etc if you like, yet you benefit from greater diameter discs. I bought mine with this already done so can't give you a before & after report, but mine are pretty good.
Surely you need to space the caliper a bit further out at least?
Otherwise won't the caliper crunch into the disc?
Matt
Yep... my poor English. Clearer to say "Nothing else needs to be replaced", not changed as I said above.
GreenV8S said:
J B said:
Any suggestions what to upgrade to ? and where to get them from
Is there anything wrong with the existing brakes, other than being worn out? If it's just a fashion statement, it's a very expensive one.
I've referred to it before, but there's an interesting read here re brake upgrades.
as well on this as id like to sharpen mine up 
LordGrover said:
Ah yes, that old chestnut.
Julian's right, and he's not.
He's right in that the OE brake system will be perfectly capable of locking the wheels of the vehicle it's engineered for (i.e. exceed available tyre grip) under normal road circumstances.
Now there's a little place to the east of where I live called Germany, and they have an invention called the Autobahn. It's perfectly legal for me to drive at over 200 km/h there, and there might occur a situation where I need to shed speed from that 200+ km/h to say, 100 km/h, pronto. Now the ability to absorb and dissipate the huge amount of heat the brake system generates becomes the limiting factor, not tyre grip. Especially if I'm stupid enough to let myself catch out more than once in a short time span.
Like on... a race track. At Zandvoort, I found myself entering the brake zone at the main staight at an indicated 220 km/h and needing to lose rather more speed than I normally would have because there was sitting someone on the outside of the straight where I needed to be, and several on the inside at the apex of the Tarzan bend. Bugger. Cue braking from that 220 km/h to about 60. Every two minutes and a bit until I decided to take it a bit easier on the brakes. The smoke screen I filled the pitlane with after coming in to check if everything was OK, was a bit of an incentive I guess...
Other side of the coin: oversizing brake systems for a given application (for the sake of 'filling the space behind the wheels') is just as silly. You'll be adding lots of unsprung weight and more importantly, lots of rotating weight to the detriment of handling, acceleration and ironically enough, braking.
All in all, what you want for a given application/use is 'the smallest brakes that don't fade'. If you've never experienced brake fade, your brake system is adequately dimensioned and there's no gain to be had from upsizing unless the car (weight and/or performance - at what speed are you arriving at a given braking point) or the use (road driving -> track days -> competition) changes.
If you are experiencing fade which is not a result of lack of maintenance of your brake system (28% of cars in a recent survey needed immediate replacement of brake fluid, another survey of a brake disc manufacturer indicated 60% of replaced discs being below the minimum allowed thickness - think of your brake disc as a heat sink and you know why that spells trouble even apart from mechanical integrity issues), start with upgrading your brake pad material and your brake fluid (DOT 5.1). Neither of which will score you points at the next car park meet by having huge discs and a fancy brand name on bright coloured callipers lurking behind your alloys, but in the vast majority of cases, it will be quite sufficient for the use and application.
Then there's the niceties that can make it easier for the driver to extract the best performance from his/her brakes. Stainless braided Teflon flex brake lines improve pedal feel, or at least retain brake pedal feel at 'factory fresh' level, by resisting expansion under pressure better than rubber lines, especially over time. Those fancy multi-piston, monoblock, fixed callipers give a similar effect by tranferring your brake pressure into brake force more accurately because they resist torsion better (and they add to fade resistance because they don't heat up the brake fluid as much. In additionrake parts that keep cooler under given circumstances, will last longer so there's economics to consider, too - if your discs and pads hardly last between services, upgrading may be a wise move after all). But now we're already well into diminishing returns territory.
If your brake system is way over-servoed, or you have one of those early ABS systems with all the pedal feel of a block of wood, chances are you won't notice those differences anyway.
And we're assuming that the tyre is of the most suitable spec for the job and retains an optimum contact patch to the road at all times - if your shocks are knackered or your wishbone/strut bushings allow your wheels to flop around under braking, I suggest you start with tackling these issues.
Edited by 900T-R on Monday 2nd April 17:58
antonyj said:
Si, how long did yours take to bed in? (redstuff)
couple of Hundred I think
before they started feeling REALLY good. Cant knock them now, dont seem to have the when cold not very good problem? gues by the time I have got the engine to temp for a hooning hard the brakes are warmed up.
BB
spend said:
Seasider said:
Still happy & very little wear on Pads or discs so far
You are allowed to use the middle pedal (you paid for it!), lifting off the rightmost pedal doesnt activate the brakes
Dave
Then again you might get your bling brakes dirty 
& paid up for the better looking, faster car Now, back off to the Golf forum for you
900T-R said:
[quote=LordGrover]
Like on... a race track. At Zandvoort, I found myself entering the brake zone at the main staight at an indicated 220 km/h and needing to lose rather more speed than I normally would have because there was sitting someone on the outside of the straight where I needed to be, and several on the inside at the apex of the Tarzan bend. Bugger.
Like on... a race track. At Zandvoort, I found myself entering the brake zone at the main staight at an indicated 220 km/h and needing to lose rather more speed than I normally would have because there was sitting someone on the outside of the straight where I needed to be, and several on the inside at the apex of the Tarzan bend. Bugger.
I think you will be at Zandvoort april 22, am i right ?
Fred
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