ABS rings for front hubs ?

[steve-V8s]

Each side of the Diff there is a toothed wheel, the one on the right is used by the road speed sensor. I guess that these wheels are really intended as ABS sensors.

I have been thinking about a traction (or rather launch control system). To do this it seems to me that I need to know if either or both of the rear wheels are going more quickly than the front. A couple of sensors either side of the Diff solves the rear but has anybody worked out how to fit ABS rings on they front ? Were they ever used on the original Ford that used the hubs ?

[TheGriffalo]

RaceLogic do a TC system. IIRC it's written up in The Bible and was fitted by Tower View Racing.

[spend]

Steve the hubs don't always have the holes/mount for the sensors, but the hub flange normally does.

You can just see it under the thread, here:


This shows where the sensor bolts in:


Dave

[AntonyJ]

spend said:

Steve the hubs don't always have the holes/mount for the sensors, but the hub flange normally does.

You can just see it under the thread, here:


This shows where the sensor bolts in:


Dave

Dave, surely that part of the hub is where the large washer locates behind the nyloc nut? Pretty sure the thinkness of the washer would hide all if that part when fitted.

[spend]

Yes, not sure if they are the exact parts Ant, just pulled some pics together to try & illustrate how the Ford bits assemble

Dave

[shpub]

Fit a sensor that senses the back of the wheel nuts. You could even use the brake calliper mounts for the bracket mounting.
Job done.

[GreenV8S]

The same basic design was used on ABS and non-ABS cars, but the ABS sensor mounting isn't machined out on the non-ABS cars. The simplest solution is to simply swap the whole upright for the one from an ABS model, it is a direct bolt-on replacement. Alternatively you can add an external sensor, but make sure you're careful with the tolerances otherwise you may end up getting false readings under hard cornering or when it's all hot and the clearances have opened up. The wheel bolts provide a handy signal if you add your own sensor, but you might want to file the manufacturers marks off the heads first because the sensors are sensitive enough to pick this up and give a false signal. As always, this sort of problem will only be intermittent and it may be hard to work out exactly why the car just tried to kill you. Far safer, as well as easier, to swap to a standard known reliable hub that includes the sensor.

[steve-V8s]

Thanks for those replies, I was thinking of a higher resolution than four pulses per rev but that is a starting point while I sort out the electronics.

[Barkychoc]

Guys sorry to but in but was ABS ever available on a Chim / Griff?

I have a V8S and as the suspension front and rear is sierra based I worked out that theoretically at least Sierra ABS should fit on with the right hubs as above (and it was standard on later Sierra Ghia models if you want a donor).
The fly in the ointment is that the main ABS pump unit may not fit under the bonnet (too high), but unless I actually try one I guess I'll never know.
I'll probably keep this on my wish list forever, though it would be good to hear opinion as to whether it would be worth the serious hassle to install it and if anyone has ever had a go at an install.

Chris

Edited by Barkychoc on Sunday 23 December 13:17

[shpub]

ABS was never fitted.

[GreenV8S]

Although the hardware could probably be made to fit, the inertial characteristics of the V8S are completely different to the Sierra and you would need to do a lot of work to tune it to suit the car. That's fine if you design ABS systems for a living, but it's not exactly a DIY job.

If you're struggling with the brakes I suggest that the first step should be to ensure that they're working properly (especially the calliper sliders) and the second step should be to make sure the static balance is correct. On mine it was miles out and a 285mm conversion on the front improved the brake balance dramatically.

[virgil]

GreenV8S said:

Although the hardware could probably be made to fit, the inertial characteristics of the V8S are completely different to the Sierra and you would need to do a lot of work to tune it to suit the car. That's fine if you design ABS systems for a living, but it's not exactly a DIY job.

If you're struggling with the brakes I suggest that the first step should be to ensure that they're working properly (especially the calliper sliders) and the second step should be to make sure the static balance is correct. On mine it was miles out and a 285mm conversion on the front improved the brake balance dramatically.

Just out of interest, how do you measure the static ballance??

[steve-V8s]

No doubt Pete will be along soon to answer this but I guess that is exactly what the MOT man is measuring, ie checking the brake efficiency without any dynamic loading (inertia) in the equation. When you stand on the brakes weight transfers to the front increasing the front and reducing the rear grip. This means the front end can wear much bigger discs that the rear without locking up, obviously the weight transfer depends on how the suspension is set up. All soft and soggy = more transfer. Or at least that is my understanding.

Sorry for butting in there Pete.

[GreenV8S]

virgil said:

Just out of interest, how do you measure the static ballance??

There are various ways. The most practical way is to set the car up in a high speed corner in slippery conditions close to the limit of grip, and without disturbing anything gently brush the brakes. If the front washes out, you've got a static bias to the front. If the balance of the car remains unchanged, you have a neutral static balance. If the car turns in, you have a static bias to the rear.

The ideal static balance is usually with a slight bias to the front - just enough to keep the car stable but not enough to provoke excessive understeer.

Once the static balance is right you can test the dynamic balance in a similar way. For this you brake hard enough to be close to the limit of grip in grippy conditions with the car *almost* straight. If the back steps out, you have a rear bias. If the front washes out you have a front bias. If it stays neutral you have a neutral balance.