Grrr - car stuck at work - starter not working
Discussion
My starter motor has stopped working.
I turn on the ignition and the ignition lights come on, fuel pump primes but when I turn the key for the starter nothing happens. Can't hear the solenoid clicking - nothing.
It happened a few days ago but I found a loose wire to the hot start kit and i fixed that and everything was fine. I stopped and started the car repeatedly and no issue so I thought the issue was fixed.
Car started first time no problem this morning and drove to work. Came to start it at lunch time and found the problem had re-occured. I assumed it was the same issue so I pulled out the wiring and it all looks fine. Have fiddled with the wires but nothing is loose and can't seem to see anything obviously wrong.
I can hear the relay in the hot start click so I think that is OK.
anyone got any bright ideas before I find someone in the office to give me a push to get me going? Don't know if I can stand the piss taking I'll get.
I turn on the ignition and the ignition lights come on, fuel pump primes but when I turn the key for the starter nothing happens. Can't hear the solenoid clicking - nothing.
It happened a few days ago but I found a loose wire to the hot start kit and i fixed that and everything was fine. I stopped and started the car repeatedly and no issue so I thought the issue was fixed.
Car started first time no problem this morning and drove to work. Came to start it at lunch time and found the problem had re-occured. I assumed it was the same issue so I pulled out the wiring and it all looks fine. Have fiddled with the wires but nothing is loose and can't seem to see anything obviously wrong.
I can hear the relay in the hot start click so I think that is OK.
anyone got any bright ideas before I find someone in the office to give me a push to get me going? Don't know if I can stand the piss taking I'll get.
Double Grrrrrrrrrr
Got two guys to give me a push start at work and drove home. Back in the garage at home and it's working again. Stopped and started it several times and it worked every time.
I'm really puzzled. I tried it several time during the afternoon as well as checking the connections in the footwell and it wasn't working at all. Then a push start and a bit of a run and all's well again.
Maybe I need to leave it to cool down again and see if the problem comes back. But it started fine this morning (twice) when it was cold.
Can only think it's some sort of loose connection. Guess I'll need to get a multi meter on it and check the connections
Got two guys to give me a push start at work and drove home. Back in the garage at home and it's working again. Stopped and started it several times and it worked every time.
I'm really puzzled. I tried it several time during the afternoon as well as checking the connections in the footwell and it wasn't working at all. Then a push start and a bit of a run and all's well again.
Maybe I need to leave it to cool down again and see if the problem comes back. But it started fine this morning (twice) when it was cold.
Can only think it's some sort of loose connection. Guess I'll need to get a multi meter on it and check the connections
I've got the hot start kit fitted and I can hear the hot start relay clicking when I try to start it. As I understand it when the immobiliser is faulty, it breaks the starter circuit so the relay wouldn't trigger would it?
But I'll certainly bear that in mind if I can't find anything more obvious.
But I'll certainly bear that in mind if I can't find anything more obvious.
I had a similar thing happen happen at the Griff Growl this year. I went out to fill up with fuel, reached the garage filled up, paid went to drive off and the car wouldn't start. Turned the key in the ignition and nothing happens, no clicking, nothing. Tried locking and unlocking the car just incase the immobiliser had engaged, nothing.
I decided to push my car out from the filling area to allow other people to fill up and so I could have a proper look at it. Turned the key and it fired up.... very strange! I had a chat with a few gurus back at the Growl and a number of people said that sometimes the starter motor can get stuck, apparently rocking the car can sure this?
I decided to push my car out from the filling area to allow other people to fill up and so I could have a proper look at it. Turned the key and it fired up.... very strange! I had a chat with a few gurus back at the Growl and a number of people said that sometimes the starter motor can get stuck, apparently rocking the car can sure this?
Two possible & very common causes, both of which I've experienced:-
Infamous HotStart fault.
Colin RedGriff, if you have the ModWise HotStart kit I guess this ISN'T your fault but it does sound like MPoxon's. Always seems to happen stopping at a garage. I didn't have the ModWise kit cos I found that when I stopped, just make sure I left the ignition on / fans running until they cutoff to bring down the temp. Was usually OK then. If ever I forgot, I'd have a long embarrassing wait till it cooled enough on it's own! Hot days after a good 'blast' obviously the worst!
2x Fuel Relays.
Seems to be another very common fault Colin RedGriff. So much so, I had it twice myself...once on the actual day I bought and picked up my last Griff! Sitting on top of the battery, where the ECU lives, are two silver, square relays. They are prone to failure. I'm no Auto Electrician so didn't know how to test when this was first suggested to me. However, was easy proven / fixed by stealing an identical looking relay from my 54 Mondeo!!!
Always carried two ever since as they're only a tenner a pair!
I'm sure it also caused some poor running issues as I had some trouble for a while before the second failure. Swapped the relay once again, starting issue sorted but so was the poor running? (maybe the relay wad fluctuating before it finally died?)
Might be worth checking?
Steve.
Infamous HotStart fault.
Colin RedGriff, if you have the ModWise HotStart kit I guess this ISN'T your fault but it does sound like MPoxon's. Always seems to happen stopping at a garage. I didn't have the ModWise kit cos I found that when I stopped, just make sure I left the ignition on / fans running until they cutoff to bring down the temp. Was usually OK then. If ever I forgot, I'd have a long embarrassing wait till it cooled enough on it's own! Hot days after a good 'blast' obviously the worst!
2x Fuel Relays.
Seems to be another very common fault Colin RedGriff. So much so, I had it twice myself...once on the actual day I bought and picked up my last Griff! Sitting on top of the battery, where the ECU lives, are two silver, square relays. They are prone to failure. I'm no Auto Electrician so didn't know how to test when this was first suggested to me. However, was easy proven / fixed by stealing an identical looking relay from my 54 Mondeo!!!
Always carried two ever since as they're only a tenner a pair!
I'm sure it also caused some poor running issues as I had some trouble for a while before the second failure. Swapped the relay once again, starting issue sorted but so was the poor running? (maybe the relay wad fluctuating before it finally died?)
Might be worth checking?
Steve.
One is the pump relay , the other is the ecu [which controls the pump relay] I think the solenoid is probably the problem. If you run a lead from the battery direct to the small solenoid wire on the starter motor the solenoid should click and/or turn the starter.
Edited by Aussie John on Wednesday 12th January 18:46
Well that was pretty inconclusive.
It started no problem today. But I put it up on the ramp and pulled out the starter motor. It was pretty clean (it was renewed about a year ago). I wiped it down and checked everything moved properly.
I replaced the 100 amp fuse holder and fuse and cleaned up all the connections.
I also redid all the connections for the hot start kit, replaced all the choc block connectors with proper soldered connections
Put it all back together and guess what....................?
It still worked.
So we shall see if the problem happens again.
It started no problem today. But I put it up on the ramp and pulled out the starter motor. It was pretty clean (it was renewed about a year ago). I wiped it down and checked everything moved properly.
I replaced the 100 amp fuse holder and fuse and cleaned up all the connections.
I also redid all the connections for the hot start kit, replaced all the choc block connectors with proper soldered connections
Put it all back together and guess what....................?
It still worked.
So we shall see if the problem happens again.
Had similar problem on my Griff (about 6 or 7 years ago). Removed starter and stripped and found signs of the solenoid armature binding inside it's coil - but only when hot!!
I increased the solenoid airgap slightly (by about 0.002"), refitted the starter with a heatsheild blanket around it and I've had no problems since!
If you need more details of what to do - let me know....
Chris
TVRCC RO
I increased the solenoid airgap slightly (by about 0.002"), refitted the starter with a heatsheild blanket around it and I've had no problems since!
If you need more details of what to do - let me know....
Chris
TVRCC RO
Hmmm would be interested if the problem shows up again. Although the problem has only happened when the engine is stone cold.
I did loosen off the solenoid cover as mine seems to be completely sealed but it seemed fine.
Had to drive Griffith in the horrid rain today (because my girlfriends Audi is at the garage with a power steering problem and she's got my Alfa!) and no problem at all with the starter.
I did loosen off the solenoid cover as mine seems to be completely sealed but it seemed fine.
Had to drive Griffith in the horrid rain today (because my girlfriends Audi is at the garage with a power steering problem and she's got my Alfa!) and no problem at all with the starter.
Over in the Chim world we've found a not uncommon problem with the immobiliser. There are two relays in the immobiliser - one for the fuel pump and one for the starter.
The starter relay can fail and stop the starter intermittently. I had an intermittent start problem on my Chim and spent ages trying to fix it. The problem was random and not affected by engine heat.
One day I discovered that slapping the underside of the passenger dash while holding the key in the start position started the Chim virtually every time. After a little research I realised that the immobiliser is in the passenger dash. A quick visit to Carl Baker and one new immobiliser and I've had no starting problems since.
The starter relay can fail and stop the starter intermittently. I had an intermittent start problem on my Chim and spent ages trying to fix it. The problem was random and not affected by engine heat.
One day I discovered that slapping the underside of the passenger dash while holding the key in the start position started the Chim virtually every time. After a little research I realised that the immobiliser is in the passenger dash. A quick visit to Carl Baker and one new immobiliser and I've had no starting problems since.
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