Modified Griff value
Discussion
With various discussions about future classic values of Griffs rising, what's the general consensus to how modifications affect the future 'classic value' of Griffs?
I guess a bog standard low mileage late (SE) mint example will potentially hold the most value, but what about the normal cars...
Will sensible mods on '95 serp cars if done tastefully, by which I mean 7" light conversion, SE mirrors, retrim affect the potential value?
And what about majour engine mods? Would a detailed engine rebuild away from standard dent vlaue...ECU swap, cam upgrade thrttle bodies? Any thoughts on scaring potential buyers away even though it might be a very well sorted powerful example...
I guess a bog standard low mileage late (SE) mint example will potentially hold the most value, but what about the normal cars...
Will sensible mods on '95 serp cars if done tastefully, by which I mean 7" light conversion, SE mirrors, retrim affect the potential value?
And what about majour engine mods? Would a detailed engine rebuild away from standard dent vlaue...ECU swap, cam upgrade thrttle bodies? Any thoughts on scaring potential buyers away even though it might be a very well sorted powerful example...
In my opinion and many will disagree, long term the most valuable cars will be the cars that are as they left the factory. That's not to say that you won't get a premium now from some buyers by upgrading the shocks, brakes or engine/ECU and so on.
I have changed my shocks for Protechs but I have retained the original Bilsteins. Only other mod is
a hot start kit and an Anderson connector but both of these are installed without altering any original
parts. No plans to change the wheels or touch-up the paint.
L.F.
I have changed my shocks for Protechs but I have retained the original Bilsteins. Only other mod is
a hot start kit and an Anderson connector but both of these are installed without altering any original
parts. No plans to change the wheels or touch-up the paint.
L.F.
That must depend on who you are selling to. When I bought mine some years ago I would have happily paid a premium over the going rate for one that already had some of the mods I wanted for hill climbing. I even advertised for such a car without success. Having said that I have probably spent more on my current car than it cost to buy but I would not expect to see much if any of that back in the event of selling it.
If I was looking for another Griff now, I would certainly choose one that had a properly balanced engine, modern ECU, decent dampers etc if given the choice and would pay more for that car if well done. If you are buying a concourse show car plainly you will want original, if you are buying one to drive then presumably you would want the one that is best to drive.
If I was looking for another Griff now, I would certainly choose one that had a properly balanced engine, modern ECU, decent dampers etc if given the choice and would pay more for that car if well done. If you are buying a concourse show car plainly you will want original, if you are buying one to drive then presumably you would want the one that is best to drive.
Generally, standard is king...
...but Nitrons, better brakes, remapping and internals etc that reduce shunting and improve throttle response etc will always be desireable though not necessarily add value.
I went pretty much the whole way with mine, as its what I wanted, but I never expected it to add massively to the value. Though it did. Either go the whole hog, or nothing. IMHO.
...but Nitrons, better brakes, remapping and internals etc that reduce shunting and improve throttle response etc will always be desireable though not necessarily add value.
I went pretty much the whole way with mine, as its what I wanted, but I never expected it to add massively to the value. Though it did. Either go the whole hog, or nothing. IMHO.
The reality is as far as im concerned!! if the car is what you want and in good/clean condition you are going to pay a good price, mods etc... there is a car for everyone, i think one thing that really stands out with working with tvr's (rover v8 based only) is the massive spread of what customers want and without sounding horrible there age, i can have a 20 year old that wants a full out race engine that is a total pig to drive but makes huge power, and a 70 year old that wants a very civilised country outing car he can drive at 30mph in top!
dnb said:
Don't forget to not drive it while you keep it standard. Only low mileage standard cars will attract a premium...
Unfortunately...very true.It will however, be clunky, tight and shunty.
One with reasonable miles for year, will be fluid and drive a load better. It will also have all the niggles sorted so is liable to be a much better experience on the road and in the workshop.
We are just talking value here.
Condition is always king but I guess either end of the spectrum may attract a premium if any do - either BV pre-cats or late SE's.
In that respect I have a mish mash - a very rare BV but with mods. I bought thinking the mods make the car better without changing what it is and I still believe that. At the end of the day if someone wants to take plenums/brakes/nitrons off and put inferior parts back on to make it "original" then that's totally down to them and it's easy to do.
I think anyone buying with a hope or expectation of making money is likely to be disappointed ultimately. Having said that over the medium to long term I can't really see good Griffs loaing money.
I plan to lavish my car with love and attention and enjoy driving it.
In that respect I have a mish mash - a very rare BV but with mods. I bought thinking the mods make the car better without changing what it is and I still believe that. At the end of the day if someone wants to take plenums/brakes/nitrons off and put inferior parts back on to make it "original" then that's totally down to them and it's easy to do.
I think anyone buying with a hope or expectation of making money is likely to be disappointed ultimately. Having said that over the medium to long term I can't really see good Griffs loaing money.
I plan to lavish my car with love and attention and enjoy driving it.
My view is that modifications which make an improvement to the standard components that TVR had to use for cost or availability reasons can only increase the value of a good, solid car. In contrast, stuff that's way in excess of that or particularly personal in nature will not.
My Griffith 500 for example has Nitrons, poly bushes, rose jointed drop links, braided steel brake lines, new TVR Power cam, uprated radiator and improved induction tubing - each one of these is such a major improvement to the car that I'd be astonished if it were not reflected in a valuation. In fact, based upon my experience of having owned the car for nine years these are all things that I would want to get done immediately were I to ever buy a replacement Griff so I'd have this additional £4k of cost firmly fixed in my mind when valuing other cars.
However, it also has 17" wheels which are lighter, use better rubber and in my view look much nicer but as this is more of a personal call I would not expect this to improve the value at all. Some purchasers may even reduce their valuation based upon this if I didn't have the originals to swap back to.
Even further, if an owner had for example fitted aftermarket seats or a roll cage I'd expect a negative impact on value purely because it would take a car beyond it's general market into a more specific, smaller niche of buyers.
I'm half considering changing my car and so this is a really interesting thread.
dumbfunk
My Griffith 500 for example has Nitrons, poly bushes, rose jointed drop links, braided steel brake lines, new TVR Power cam, uprated radiator and improved induction tubing - each one of these is such a major improvement to the car that I'd be astonished if it were not reflected in a valuation. In fact, based upon my experience of having owned the car for nine years these are all things that I would want to get done immediately were I to ever buy a replacement Griff so I'd have this additional £4k of cost firmly fixed in my mind when valuing other cars.
However, it also has 17" wheels which are lighter, use better rubber and in my view look much nicer but as this is more of a personal call I would not expect this to improve the value at all. Some purchasers may even reduce their valuation based upon this if I didn't have the originals to swap back to.
Even further, if an owner had for example fitted aftermarket seats or a roll cage I'd expect a negative impact on value purely because it would take a car beyond it's general market into a more specific, smaller niche of buyers.
I'm half considering changing my car and so this is a really interesting thread.
dumbfunk
dumbfunk said:
My view is that modifications which make an improvement to the standard components that TVR had to use for cost or availability reasons can only increase the value of a good, solid car. In contrast, stuff that's way in excess of that or particularly personal in nature will not.
My Griffith 500 for example has Nitrons, poly bushes, rose jointed drop links, braided steel brake lines, new TVR Power cam, uprated radiator and improved induction tubing - each one of these is such a major improvement to the car that I'd be astonished if it were not reflected in a valuation. In fact, based upon my experience of having owned the car for nine years these are all things that I would want to get done immediately were I to ever buy a replacement Griff so I'd have this additional £4k of cost firmly fixed in my mind when valuing other cars.
However, it also has 17" wheels which are lighter, use better rubber and in my view look much nicer but as this is more of a personal call I would not expect this to improve the value at all. Some purchasers may even reduce their valuation based upon this if I didn't have the originals to swap back to.
Even further, if an owner had for example fitted aftermarket seats or a roll cage I'd expect a negative impact on value purely because it would take a car beyond it's general market into a more specific, smaller niche of buyers.
dumbfunk
I agree 100% with that. I believe that any buyer that has done their research will understand that sensible mods that are well known in the TVR community are an advantage over a standard car especially if you want actually drive the thing and not sit their polishing and admiring it.My Griffith 500 for example has Nitrons, poly bushes, rose jointed drop links, braided steel brake lines, new TVR Power cam, uprated radiator and improved induction tubing - each one of these is such a major improvement to the car that I'd be astonished if it were not reflected in a valuation. In fact, based upon my experience of having owned the car for nine years these are all things that I would want to get done immediately were I to ever buy a replacement Griff so I'd have this additional £4k of cost firmly fixed in my mind when valuing other cars.
However, it also has 17" wheels which are lighter, use better rubber and in my view look much nicer but as this is more of a personal call I would not expect this to improve the value at all. Some purchasers may even reduce their valuation based upon this if I didn't have the originals to swap back to.
Even further, if an owner had for example fitted aftermarket seats or a roll cage I'd expect a negative impact on value purely because it would take a car beyond it's general market into a more specific, smaller niche of buyers.
dumbfunk
dumbfunk said:
My view is that modifications which make an improvement to the standard components that TVR had to use for cost or availability reasons can only increase the value of a good, solid car. In contrast, stuff that's way in excess of that or particularly personal in nature will not.
My Griffith 500 for example has Nitrons, poly bushes, rose jointed drop links, braided steel brake lines, new TVR Power cam, uprated radiator and improved induction tubing - each one of these is such a major improvement to the car that I'd be astonished if it were not reflected in a valuation. In fact, based upon my experience of having owned the car for nine years these are all things that I would want to get done immediately were I to ever buy a replacement Griff so I'd have this additional £4k of cost firmly fixed in my mind when valuing other cars.
My Griffith 500 for example has Nitrons, poly bushes, rose jointed drop links, braided steel brake lines, new TVR Power cam, uprated radiator and improved induction tubing - each one of these is such a major improvement to the car that I'd be astonished if it were not reflected in a valuation. In fact, based upon my experience of having owned the car for nine years these are all things that I would want to get done immediately were I to ever buy a replacement Griff so I'd have this additional £4k of cost firmly fixed in my mind when valuing other cars.
I would agree whole heartedly with this, minor internal mods to improve / upgrade the car will not decrease the value of a car, a car with these mods will look completely standard and as it left the factory, only it will be a far more enjoyable car to drive.dumbfunk said:
However, it also has 17" wheels which are lighter, use better rubber and in my view look much nicer but as this is more of a personal call I would not expect this to improve the value at all. Some purchasers may even reduce their valuation based upon this if I didn't have the originals to swap back to.
I personally like the look of the standard wheels on a Griff - whether they are Gotti's, OZ X-spokes or Estorils. I understand the improvements of 17 / 18" rims with better rubber, but as stated above if I was buying a car on non standard rims I would have to budget in the deal for a set of originals too. Increase or decrease in value in this case is all down to the buyers preferences IMO.dumbfunk said:
Even further, if an owner had for example fitted aftermarket seats or a roll cage I'd expect a negative impact on value purely because it would take a car beyond it's general market into a more specific, smaller niche of buyers.
This I think is a certainty. A hugely modified car is going to appeal to a far smaller audience when trying to sell however I really do think that alot of what effects values of our cars is that they still look as they left the factory inside and out. Clives AJP Griff was testament to that. Completely standard looking Griff (OK it had a set of gold MO6's on it) but what lurked beneath was a monster, far from standard and a work of art. But on the surface it looked like a very nice clean standard Griff 
dnb said:
Don't forget to not drive it while you keep it standard. Only low mileage standard cars will attract a premium...
This . . . plus the other points about standard is king.Why bother owning a great driving car if you're going to spend your entire time worrying about the re-sale value, therefore not using it, not making sensible modifications and wrapping it in cotton wool. It's like buying nice watches, why bother having a collection of em and then leaving them in the safe, never wearing them to ensure their value is retained.
Buy it, use it, look after it, accept it depreciates but gather the memories.
My SE is worth 12p at todays values, it's modified although mildly and has 85k miles on the clock.
Do I care . . no, because when all is said and done I did what it was designed for, drive it. Yes I'm obsessive at polishing, yes I'm obsessive about the mechanicals, but that's because I want to drive it. I'd also happily put it up against many of the garage queens around . .
All this notion of value is only what you think it's worth in pound notes . .. I offered to sell mine the other day as we have a large cost coming our way and I was shot down by everyone who knows me, the fiance, the parents, the parents in law, firends, colleageus etc becasue the value of our car is far more than the resale value would ever be. I couldn't replace it for one as good, we'd be gutted we didn't have a decent car for the weekends and I'd have to go through the same time of finding, affording and sorting another car . ..
Modern Griffiths will not reach the heady heights the originals are starting to command for another 30-40yrs by which time we'll all have our own jet pacs, hover craft running on compressed grass extract and be able to teleport ourselves wherever we need to go. I doubt you'll be able to fire up a 5ltr V8 without a permit and adopting 57 baby foxes and an otter, with one foot.
So for those who worry about the resale value of your cars, all power to your wallet, I'm sure it must be great fun owning someting that occupies your garage and you can go and look at daily. I'll be out driving mine as it was intended though and will have the memories rather than the investment returns to remember.
In simple terms my car could never re-pay what I have put into it financially before I'm too old or too mad to be able to drive.
This forum is full of garage queens already, now because values have steadied and maybe crept up a little the place will get even more bereft of interesting topics than it is now . .
Can we have some topics about driving the cars rather than endless mechanical threads about the same stuff again and again and again . . .
All items are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them. I'd rather not see to many mods but that's my opinion only. Sensible upgrades (ie suspension, silicon hoses etc) are no brainers as superior technology is available at sensible prices. Some mods will never recoup anywhere near what is spend but may make it more desirable than the next car. We've got a mildly modified 500 which is used daily (by Mrs FFG) and a 430BV which has done 250k miles so they get used. I agree with Johno a car is for driving and not looking at. We didn't buy any for financial gain just wanted enjoyment now. As we'd only sell if we had to then any resale value is irrelevant.
We've had roll bars on both but purely as a safety feature given what a Griff looks like when it is rolled. Hopefully it never happens but just in case. As you get older you seem to be more fearful which is ironic as you've got less years left than when you were young and fearless.
FFG
We've had roll bars on both but purely as a safety feature given what a Griff looks like when it is rolled. Hopefully it never happens but just in case. As you get older you seem to be more fearful which is ironic as you've got less years left than when you were young and fearless.
FFG
Johno said:
My SE is worth 12p at todays values, it's modified although mildly and has 85k miles on the clock.
Johno said:
Do I care . . no.
Johno said:
All this notion of value is only what you think it's worth in pound notes . .. I offered to sell mine the other day as we have a large cost coming our way and I was shot down by everyone who knows me
You should have asked me Johno. I have a little pot full of 20p pieces, you could have had the very nicest shiny example in exchange for that bag of nails you drive around in 
There are a few of likeminded people on this forum, who will have their Griffs for years to come and will drive them, tinker with them, modify them to varying degrees, polish and generally love and care for them.
Mind you, I would have included Ballistic Banana and LordGrover in that list, so what do I know.
And when we are too old to get in or out of the Griff, it will be the same piece of advice potential buyers of our cars will come armed with. Buy on condition.
And the condition of most mildly modified (or fettled) cars is likely to be a hell of a lot better than a garage queen when you start to look where it really matters.
Barreti said:
There are a few of likeminded people on this forum, who will have their Griffs for years to come and will drive them, tinker with them, modify them to varying degrees, polish and generally love and care for them.
Mind you, I would have included Ballistic Banana and LordGrover in that list, so what do I know.
And when we are too old to get in or out of the Griff, it will be the same piece of advice potential buyers of our cars will come armed with. Buy on condition.
And the condition of most mildly modified (or fettled) cars is likely to be a hell of a lot better than a garage queen when you start to look where it really matters.
Mind you, I would have included Ballistic Banana and LordGrover in that list, so what do I know.
And when we are too old to get in or out of the Griff, it will be the same piece of advice potential buyers of our cars will come armed with. Buy on condition.
And the condition of most mildly modified (or fettled) cars is likely to be a hell of a lot better than a garage queen when you start to look where it really matters.
Not planning on parting with mine until I can no longer get in or out of it, so as Johno said future values are pretty irrelevant. Until that day comes I plan on putting as many miles on it as I can and keeping it as it deserves to be kept.( Oh and Johno, no I haven't replaced/sorted out my rear badge yet before you mention it !! )
Don't agree with Johnno's comments about the cars not reaching the old Griffith's heights for 30-40 years. I'd give it 10-15 years. It's not that long ago that Healeys were £8-10,000 and there are many more of them.
1)There's nothing like it on sale now at anywhere near the price of a Griffith.
2)Inevitable decline in numbers for various reasons.
3)The classic car market will expand considerably over the next decade driven by demand from emerging markets for high-end stuff but the lesser cars will be pulled up as well. A rising tide lifts all boats.
L.F.
1)There's nothing like it on sale now at anywhere near the price of a Griffith.
2)Inevitable decline in numbers for various reasons.
3)The classic car market will expand considerably over the next decade driven by demand from emerging markets for high-end stuff but the lesser cars will be pulled up as well. A rising tide lifts all boats.
L.F.
Guillotine said:
A great chassis is king in my book in any case. Everything else is easy-peasy.
Its the absolute first in my book...............Wayout ways anything else, changing lights etc is easy.......
I think all Griffs will keep their money very well, hand built british sports car, and low volume..
i've seen low mileage Griffs, a lot worse than higher miles ones around
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