Griff Growl 2014 Rolling Road Videos & Charts

[QBee]

phazed said:

QBee said:

I have seen the Phazedmobile make 357 bhp on a proper rolling road, one we all trust.
My own car read 300 bhp on that same RR, and i was not a little disappointed. I expected around 330.
I am not 100% convinced about portable rolling roads.
They stick a lightweight rear wheel drive car's arse up in the air and expect to get accurate readings.
The first RR I took my car on was flat, and 3 of us had to sit on the boot to get proper readings.

Don't forget Jools tweaked the map since then and got about another 10 bhp!

YHM

[Quinny]

eff eff said:

Mine showed 446 brake and 368 lbs/ft,

There is no way in hell that your car is producing only 368 ft/lbs

[eff eff]

Quinny said:

eff eff said:

Mine showed 446 brake and 368 lbs/ft,

There is no way in hell that your car is producing only 368 ft/lbs

I agree mate, there was a lot of tyre slip, don't want to be critical but it would help if they had a compressor to
increase tyre pressure.

[spitfire4v8]

QBee said:

I have seen the Phazedmobile make 357 bhp on a proper rolling road, one we all trust.
My own car read 300 bhp on that same RR, and i was not a little disappointed. I expected around 330.
I am not 100% convinced about portable rolling roads.
They stick a lightweight rear wheel drive car's arse up in the air and expect to get accurate readings.
The first RR I took my car on was flat, and 3 of us had to sit on the boot to get proper readings.

there's nothing wrong with dyno dynamics dynos .. one of the most highly regarded dynos out there in fact.
what was the "trusted" dyno ?
300hp on a dyno dynamics is a lot of power, 330 would be a seriously modified engine , which I don't think yours is ?

[spitfire4v8]

Quinny said:

Here's mine..

The graph suggests my fueling is crap and way to rich...but I'd suggest its a spurious reading... I'm averaging 28 mpg, car doesn't smell of fuel, and at a recent MOT it nearly passed a cat test.... With no cats fitted.


This is supposed to be the torque figure, but again, my old griff had 326ft/lbs, so I know what that feels like... There's no way this car has the same torque as my old one....

A full throttle run tells you nothing about part throttle fuelling or its ability to pass an mot test though ..
Your fuelling is massively rich and costing you power. Also I do think the numbers were about 5% down on the day based on cars I know of .. i suspect your engine is in reality a 470hp one? just not with that fuelling! It needs sorting.

[Quinny]

But surely if it were that rich I'd be seeing a sooty exhaust, and it'd stink of petrol..??

[spitfire4v8]

It may well be smoky flat out, but you're in the car driving not looking at the exhaust?
The mixture may well be perfectly fine at anything other than full throttle, but the only thing you can tell from the graph is that on full throttle it's too rich.

to add .. just looked at previous topics and yes it's a 470hp engine (excellent!) , so something has changed?

Edited by spitfire4v8 on Monday 7th July 13:32

[spitfire4v8]

MPoxon said:

any idea what the blip in the fuelling is at the top end? noticed it's on the tvr power graphs too so definately something consistent. It's certainly a safe mixture at 12afr.

[MPoxon]

spitfire4v8 said:

any idea what the blip in the fuelling is at the top end? noticed it's on the tvr power graphs too so definately something consistent. It's certainly a safe mixture at 12afr.

Hi Jools, No idea what that anomaly is, I'll ask Mark next time I speak to him. I hadn't noticed it on the TVR Power dyno when I first looked at is but it is definitely there now I have looked again, it seems more pronounced on this dyno. The car drives spot on and there is no hesitation through the rev range so it is not anything that is causing issues.

I am sure we could have got a bit more power out if it with a slightly leaner mixture but I prefer to be on the safe side.

[Quinny]

spitfire4v8 said:

It may well be smoky flat out, but you're in the car driving not looking at the exhaust?
The mixture may well be perfectly fine at anything other than full throttle, but the only thing you can tell from the graph is that on full throttle it's too rich.

to add .. just looked at previous topics and yes it's a 470hp engine (excellent!) , so something has changed?

Jools.... I only have one other graph from Gregs dyno at protuner...(this was when the original mapping was done). As you can see, it made a nice 445 BHP and 450 ish ft/lbs..

Regarding full throttle fueling, I understand completely where you're coming from, but what I'm struggling with, is that they did 8 runs on Saturday, and there wasn't even a hint of smoke of any kind from the exhaust....
In fact a few bystanders made the same comment...

Either way I'll get some basic checks done and go from there...

[spitfire4v8]

Ah plops i had been looking at effeff's graph by mistake at 470hp.
doh.

[CHIMV8]

MPoxon said:

Afternoon gents,

I have created a wiki for the rolling road results here so feel free to add your results:
http://www.pistonheads.com/GASSING/topic.asp?h=0&a...

Here are a few videos I took of the Rolling Road

FFG Griff 430 BV:
http://youtu.be/illucgLCAMo

Moycie Cerb 4.5 Red Rose
http://youtu.be/1K7DnxBuNic

pjac Griff 540
http://youtu.be/kagztOdWTD0 - Flame map only
http://youtu.be/8LGthZHOcFo - Petrol, LPG & Flame runs

MPoxon Griff 500
http://youtu.be/616GxwDgZcY

Feel free to post up your Dyno charts, here are mine.... fuelling looking good and a nice flat torque curve

Only just beat my RR from last week Matt

[Quinny]

spitfire4v8 said:

Ah plops i had been looking at effeff's graph by mistake at 470hp.
doh.

I thought you'd got them mixed up.... His is a 6.2 with cats I think, whereas mine is just a 6.0, and without cats

Anyway I've booked it in just to do some basic sensor checks, Make sure its nothing silly like a Lambda gone walkabout or something...

[spitfire4v8]

Yep good plan anyway

[Quinny]

MPoxon said:

Afternoon gents,
Moycie Cerb 4.5 Red Rose
http://youtu.be/1K7DnxBuNic

Who's that dokey looking bugger in the background with the green cap??

[MPoxon]

CHIMV8 said:

Only just beat my RR from last week Matt

Yeah I am not convinced by the results this year to be honest, not just mine but on a number of cars we see dyno'd each year all appear to be down on figures. I know dyno results are very subjective but the Growl Dyno has always been fairly consistent in the past.

Mine has apparently lost about 20BHP and 20 torques since 2 weeks ago on the TVR Power dyno.

[MPoxon]

Quinny said:

Who's that dokey looking bugger in the background with the green cap??

Good to see you again chap and great to see you back in a Griff.

[eff eff]

Quinny said:

spitfire4v8 said:

Ah plops i had been looking at effeff's graph by mistake at 470hp.
doh.

I thought you'd got them mixed up.... His is a 6.2 with cats I think, whereas mine is just a 6.0, and without cats

Anyway I've booked it in just to do some basic sensor checks, Make sure its nothing silly like a Lambda gone walkabout or something...

No cats in mine Quinny, the BHP numbers at the Growl were 30 odd brake down on the numbers from Protune, but what was really down as you know was the torque 368 vs 500 and that was due to tyre slip. So the rolling road maybe ok but as I said before if you can't get consistent grip on the rollers then the numbers will be off. As for the fuelling no idea, but when I lost a Lambda the smell of petrol was overpowering and there was plenty of soot.

[Quinny]

Cheers eff eff that's good to know.........

[CHIMV8]

MPoxon said:

CHIMV8 said:

Only just beat my RR from last week Matt

Yeah I am not convinced by the results this year to be honest, not just mine but on a number of cars we see dyno'd each year all appear to be down on figures. I know dyno results are very subjective but the Growl Dyno has always been fairly consistent in the past.

Mine has apparently lost about 20BHP and 20 torques since 2 weeks ago on the TVR Power dyno.

It does seem a common theme from the Growl RR