nBuying the 'right' defender 90 for me.

[tomw2000]

Ok, I should be in a position to purchase my 90 soon.

So am looking for more advice.

Initially I'd assumed I should buy the youngest, lowest mileage I can get for my budget (say £17-19k). I'd want a 1-3 year old County or XS station wagon.

But what if I bought something older and spent less of the budget up front and used the rest to 'customise/tweak' to vehicle from the outset? Maybe an older TD5 hardtop and get one of these Station Wagon conversions and add ecu remap/suspension tweaks etc?

What would you do and why?

New and low miles as poss (i.e. 1-3yr old 2.4puma engined) and tweak in the future if I felt it needed it OR cheaper and older (TD5)and spend more budget up front on tweaks?

Thanks in advance. I'm just trying to work out the best option for me and the best use of my budget.

[budrover]

go for the Puma model - yes the Td5 engine can be better when tuned -- but a Puma defender is a good package and more civilised....and the 6th gear is better on the motorway

[BLUETHUNDER]

Well i previously had a 50th. Which i loved to bits. Good ride.Quiet. Good road handling and performance. But when i do go back to Defender ownership. Then i want a Puma XS. Just something a little more modern so to speak.

[macar]

Performance
Depends what you do with it, mostly 70+mph go for the Puma for its sixth gear- dont bother with the chip as not noticibly different. If all on A roads get a Td5 and chip it-big improvement and better performance mid range than the Puma, also better mpg. Had both models and chipped all, even had two lots of mapping on the Puma because of the lack of improvement. Good hunting
Comfort
Definately go the Puma, and get Air con,with all that glass and roof it get too hot in summer

[300bhp/ton]

tomw2000 said:

Ok, I should be in a position to purchase my 90 soon.

So am looking for more advice.

Initially I'd assumed I should buy the youngest, lowest mileage I can get for my budget (say £17-19k). I'd want a 1-3 year old County or XS station wagon.

But what if I bought something older and spent less of the budget up front and used the rest to 'customise/tweak' to vehicle from the outset? Maybe an older TD5 hardtop and get one of these Station Wagon conversions and add ecu remap/suspension tweaks etc?

What would you do and why?

New and low miles as poss (i.e. 1-3yr old 2.4puma engined) and tweak in the future if I felt it needed it OR cheaper and older (TD5)and spend more budget up front on tweaks?

Thanks in advance. I'm just trying to work out the best option for me and the best use of my budget.

I think it depends what you want from the Landy tbh.

Is it a play thing or a work thing?

Do you have the need and want for a new car? Or does it not bother you buying an older one.

Do you actually have the cash for the mods and such, or are you talking finance.

I would tend to agree the stock 2.4 TDCI's are quite well setup in stock trim and are arguably better performing than the poorly setup stock TD5's.

But I've also heard quite a number of issues with the new 6 speed box and engine, more so than TD5's over the years.

The TD5 is also a much nicer sounding engine and will offer up as much or more overall HP.

The traction control and anti-stall do appear better on the newer ones though, but if you go to post TD5, Defenders didn't have either anyhow.

Then there's the dash, as nice as the new one is, I personally much prefer the older one.


So what I think you need to do, is answer the questions above and then work out the total costs.

Modding is expensive, and you could easily sink £5000-7000 in parts. But you'd end up with a very different vehicle to a stock newer one.

Bell Auto offer a hybrid turbo conversion for the TD5 which will see over 200hp and make the Defender genuinely rapid.


All that said, there is a 3rd option.

Again this depends what you want the vehicle for, but you could buy a much earlier example, maybe a mid 80's 90. Strip it buy a new galvanized chassis and build it up. I'm fairly sure that if you have the cash to do this, it would be cheaper than buying a nearly new one and would still be worth a good value when complete.

This way you could choose what you want, maybe a V8, such as a Rover 4.6 or a Jaguar 4.2 or a Chevy LS1. Or a 2.7 TDV6 diesel or a TD5 and so on.

[tomw2000]

Many thanks for the responses and esp. 300bhp's detailed thoughts, much appreciated.

The 17-19k budget is cash/savings. No finance. Though there could be a possibility of putting a deposit down and finacing the rest over a couple of years if the boss decided 'we' wanted brand new and the right deal could be done.

On balance brand new is the least likely I suspect.

Thanks again, certainly helps and any more points, do keep them coming

[300bhp/ton]

tomw2000 said:

Many thanks for the responses and esp. 300bhp's detailed thoughts, much appreciated.

The 17-19k budget is cash/savings. No finance. Though there could be a possibility of putting a deposit down and finacing the rest over a couple of years if the boss decided 'we' wanted brand new and the right deal could be done.

On balance brand new is the least likely I suspect.

Thanks again, certainly helps and any more points, do keep them coming

Personally I'd setup a spreadsheet and log down all the bits you'd likely want to do to a Defender to get an idea of cost.

That way it'll then tell you what you could spend on one and you can see what's available. It might also be worth a trip to your local tuner to drive a tuned Defender to see if you think it'd be worth it.

Allisport, Jeremey J Fearn, Twisted Performance, Bell Auto to name but a few.

Also do you plan for on or off road use and mods?


And lastly, and I'm sure I'll get flamed for this. But depending on what you want from the vehicle and why you want one, it might be worth looking at some of these:



£19k will get you a new or almost new Sport or Sahara and maybe even a Rubicon if you can find one (there are some UK ones).

They are very similar size to a D90, but there are all new vehicle in 2005. Still a ladder chassis and live axles. But they are faster, more powerful, more economical, better specced and better options than a D90.

You can get an auto or 6 speed manual with a 2.8 CRD diesel engine making as much power as a tuned D90 would.

The Rubicon has 3.8 V6 and has diff lockers all round and electronically disconnecting anti-roll bars, to give it more flex and articulation than a D90 and as good or better road manners.

Or for £8-11k

You could get the older TJ Wrangler. Still coil suspension all round, these have a 4.0 litre Straight 6 and are faster than most tuned diesel Defenders.




I know this last bit of advice is frowned upon in this forum, but it doesn't alter the Wrangler being good 4x4's and obvious direct alternatives to a Defender.

[macar]

macar said:

300bhp/ton said:

tomw2000 said:

Many thanks for the responses and esp. 300bhp's detailed thoughts, much appreciated.

The 17-19k budget is cash/savings. No finance. Though there could be a possibility of putting a deposit down and finacing the rest over a couple of years if the boss decided 'we' wanted brand new and the right deal could be done.

On balance brand new is the least likely I suspect.

Thanks again, certainly helps and any more points, do keep them coming

Personally I'd setup a spreadsheet and log down all the bits you'd likely want to do to a Defender to get an idea of cost.

That way it'll then tell you what you could spend on one and you can see what's available. It might also be worth a trip to your local tuner to drive a tuned Defender to see if you think it'd be worth it.

Allisport, Jeremey J Fearn, Twisted Performance, Bell Auto to name but a few.

Also do you plan for on or off road use and mods?


And lastly, and I'm sure I'll get flamed for this. But depending on what you want from the vehicle and why you want one, it might be worth looking at some of these:



£19k will get you a new or almost new Sport or Sahara and maybe even a Rubicon if you can find one (there are some UK ones).

They are very similar size to a D90, but there are all new vehicle in 2005. Still a ladder chassis and live axles. But they are faster, more powerful, more economical, better specced and better options than a D90.

You can get an auto or 6 speed manual with a 2.8 CRD diesel engine making as much power as a tuned D90 would.

The Rubicon has 3.8 V6 and has diff lockers all round and electronically disconnecting anti-roll bars, to give it more flex and articulation than a D90 and as good or better road manners.

Or for £8-11k

You could get the older TJ Wrangler. Still coil suspension all round, these have a 4.0 litre Straight 6 and are faster than most tuned diesel Defenders.




I know this last bit of advice is frowned upon in this forum, but it doesn't alter the Wrangler being good 4x4's and obvious direct alternatives to a Defender.

Do you want to buy into a stylish icon or a heap of Yank #+##!!!!. Buy British,buy style

[West4x4]

buy style? that 90 looks awful especially with them wheels

[300bhp/ton]

macar said:

Do you want to buy into a stylish icon or a heap of Yank #+##!!!!.

What do you mean the icon that the Land Rover was based on? That the actual LR prototypes were built on, oh yes the Jeep :rolleye:

Very original and grown up response.....

[gavm5]

300bhp/ton said:

macar said:

Do you want to buy into a stylish icon or a heap of Yank #+##!!!!.

What do you mean the icon that the Land Rover was based on? That the actual LR prototypes were built on, oh yes the Jeep :rolleye:

Very original and grown up response.....

Here we go again lol

[300bhp/ton]

gavm5 said:

300bhp/ton said:

macar said:

Do you want to buy into a stylish icon or a heap of Yank #+##!!!!.

What do you mean the icon that the Land Rover was based on? That the actual LR prototypes were built on, oh yes the Jeep :rolleye:

Very original and grown up response.....

Here we go again lol

lol indeed

Someone asked in another thread why do people get so up tight about defending American cars. I think this is quite a good example of why.

As macar could have said I prefer the looks of the Defender, or the Defender is a much better workhorse (which it is) with better hauling and towing abilities.

But they didn't, they used derogatory slang and quote miss facts.

I really don't want to derail this thread for the op, so probably won't comment further on this.

But it does amaze me how blind some people, specifically some Land Rover people can be.

Personally I'm a huge fan of Land Rovers, my first car was a Land Rover 300Tdi D90 and I've owned others since then including 2 at the moment. My father and uncle were both founding members of our local ALRC Land Rover Club and I've been around and involved with Land Rovers all my life.

So I'm not anti them, just merely offering the OP (or anyone else) a potentially different vehicle, which offers 95% the same thing with a longer heritage and something they may not have thought of.

[Bish]

JEEP = Just Enough Essential Parts! Hahahahaha.

[macar]

Best of British old chap

[HellDiver]

300hp/ton, are you employed by the American motor industry, or why are you constantly pedalling their ste?

[tomw2000]

I'll stick with a Defender 90 anyway, but thanks for the other suggestions

I'll let you know whether I go for, used/modded, nearly new or new.

[macar]

Nice one

[BLUETHUNDER]

tomw2000 said:

I'll stick with a Defender 90 anyway, but thanks for the other suggestions

I'll let you know whether I go for, used/modded, nearly new or new.

I dont think you will be dissapointed which ever 90 you choose.

[Lefty 200 Drams]

West4x4 said:

buy style? that 90 looks awful especially with them wheels

I think it looks ok actually, apart from those godawful wheels. Alloys on a landie are a nono, steelies suit themn much better.

IMHO

[tomw2000]

Here she is:



I fully appreciate the 'look' might not appeal to all. But ultimately she belonged to a mate and I am happy with her history. Even if she _might_ be a bit tomb raider for some!

She's a 53 plate car with 39k on the clock and the following mods (mostly carried out by Je Engineering):

Full sound proof kit
Lowered up rated suspension
New ungraded, ventilated discs all round
New gearbox and Discovery final drive
Stage 1 & 2 engine, turbo and intercooler upgrade
Solid stainless steel accessories throughout cabin, and dials
Bespoke Range Rover style front grill and light surround
New instriment dials, including clock, rev counter, oil temp, outside temp , etc.
Safari bars
high intensity lamps fitted to safari bars!
High intensity bulbs fitted to rest of car.
Puma bonnet
Special snorkel that fits safari bars
Rear step bar that goes across whole of rear
Over size tyres x5
brand new 'puma' side runners
Land Rover rear rubber matt for the rear seats and also complete plastic tray also.
Brand new LR Seat covers
Darkened windows thought
Underbody protection plate
Roof rack system

Very pleased with her so far.Just what I was looking for and will be a keeper no doubt.

Now just need to find myself an 8' x4' double axle ifor williams trailer. If anyone knows of one going at a sensible price, do let me know

Thanks for everyone's comments. And if anyone wants a car similar, I know of a lovely black one (belonging to a fellpw PHer).