Hiring out 'hot hatches' in the Highlands/Aberdeenshire
Discussion
Hello Pistonheads 
Long time lurker but never posted much in the past but given the wealth of knowledge on here, I thought it best to ask for some opinions!
Due to the high likelihood of losing my job through redundancy (dam you oil industry...) and looking for a total career change, I am currently in the very early stages of looking to form a hot hatch self drive business within the Aberdeen/Aberdeenshire area.
Given the rapidly growing popularity of the North Coast 500 & EVO recommended 'Old military Road' routes, I think I have spotted a gap in the market. People are flying from all over the world/up from England and Wales to experience the famous roads but are renting out boring rental cars (diesel Astras, Focus, Golf etc) in which to do the trip. In my opinion this dilutes the experience massively as the cars aren't designed to take advantage of the fun roads, so whilst you may love the scenery, you will end up hating your hire car, through no fault of its own.
My thought to remedy this boring solution is to offer an exciting alternative, with some fun hot hatches to rent out instead. They will give a massively rewarding driving experience and also take you around in relative comfort with pretty good practicality and storage, decent performance and cheap fuel costs. I have seen the popularity of the Nurburgring Rental companies with small hot hatches and I am currently thinking along the lines of RenaultSport 182 Clios (maybe even 197s if funds allowed), Gen 1 Ford Fiesta STs, EP3 Civic Type Rs and possibly even the R53 Mini Cooper S (maybe a bit soft?).
To begin with I would be looking at buying 2-3 cars, see how it takes off and upgrade/expand the fleet if the business were to grow. If it didn't take off, sell the cars again and lose minimal money. I know of one company that offers Caterhams to hire and they seem to do well but Caterhams can be a bit too compromised for some given the unpredictable Scottish weather and also lack decent storage. Also hot hatches may be easier to convince your significant other to come along with you!
My aim would be to cater to both the local Royal Deeside and Scottish Highland routes, all of which would be designed to take in as many fun roads as possible in your given holiday schedule. Having been born and bred in Aberdeenshire I have been exposed to some incredible driving roads for years and regularly enjoy them both in my own cars (JDM DC2, EP3 Civic, R53, classic Mini etc) and alongside friends in their cars too. I have explored all corners of Scotland so know lots of good stop off points, hotels, restaurants etc so could give first hand experiences to any potential customers as well for that personal touch.
So before I go into the depths of looking for some extra startup funding and contacting self drive insurance providers, I would greatly appreciate any feedback on my idea. Would it be something you/your friends would be interested in? Do the cars I mention seem suitable? If not, what would you recommend?
Well done if you made it to the end and thanks in advance!
Long time lurker but never posted much in the past but given the wealth of knowledge on here, I thought it best to ask for some opinions!
Due to the high likelihood of losing my job through redundancy (dam you oil industry...) and looking for a total career change, I am currently in the very early stages of looking to form a hot hatch self drive business within the Aberdeen/Aberdeenshire area.
Given the rapidly growing popularity of the North Coast 500 & EVO recommended 'Old military Road' routes, I think I have spotted a gap in the market. People are flying from all over the world/up from England and Wales to experience the famous roads but are renting out boring rental cars (diesel Astras, Focus, Golf etc) in which to do the trip. In my opinion this dilutes the experience massively as the cars aren't designed to take advantage of the fun roads, so whilst you may love the scenery, you will end up hating your hire car, through no fault of its own.
My thought to remedy this boring solution is to offer an exciting alternative, with some fun hot hatches to rent out instead. They will give a massively rewarding driving experience and also take you around in relative comfort with pretty good practicality and storage, decent performance and cheap fuel costs. I have seen the popularity of the Nurburgring Rental companies with small hot hatches and I am currently thinking along the lines of RenaultSport 182 Clios (maybe even 197s if funds allowed), Gen 1 Ford Fiesta STs, EP3 Civic Type Rs and possibly even the R53 Mini Cooper S (maybe a bit soft?).
To begin with I would be looking at buying 2-3 cars, see how it takes off and upgrade/expand the fleet if the business were to grow. If it didn't take off, sell the cars again and lose minimal money. I know of one company that offers Caterhams to hire and they seem to do well but Caterhams can be a bit too compromised for some given the unpredictable Scottish weather and also lack decent storage. Also hot hatches may be easier to convince your significant other to come along with you!
My aim would be to cater to both the local Royal Deeside and Scottish Highland routes, all of which would be designed to take in as many fun roads as possible in your given holiday schedule. Having been born and bred in Aberdeenshire I have been exposed to some incredible driving roads for years and regularly enjoy them both in my own cars (JDM DC2, EP3 Civic, R53, classic Mini etc) and alongside friends in their cars too. I have explored all corners of Scotland so know lots of good stop off points, hotels, restaurants etc so could give first hand experiences to any potential customers as well for that personal touch.
So before I go into the depths of looking for some extra startup funding and contacting self drive insurance providers, I would greatly appreciate any feedback on my idea. Would it be something you/your friends would be interested in? Do the cars I mention seem suitable? If not, what would you recommend?
Well done if you made it to the end and thanks in advance!
I can see insurance being a big issue,
what is your target age of driver as I suspect any driver under 30 will be very difficult ?
Would the cars be at all modified ?
I think insurance will be horrendous if available (although the Caterham company have obviously obtained cover)..
Best of luck
what is your target age of driver as I suspect any driver under 30 will be very difficult ?
Would the cars be at all modified ?
I think insurance will be horrendous if available (although the Caterham company have obviously obtained cover)..
Best of luck
This:
http://www.highlandcaterhamhire.co.uk/
I would do. And have been thinking about it for a couple of years.
Tooling around in a hot hatch that's been thrashed to within an inch of its life by the crowd that knows it's not theirs? Nope.
Just take a look at the various hire car threads on here for the various things that people get up to in what would effectively be a 'normal' car. The fact that it's a fast variant would make the situation even worse, in my opinion.
http://www.highlandcaterhamhire.co.uk/
I would do. And have been thinking about it for a couple of years.
Tooling around in a hot hatch that's been thrashed to within an inch of its life by the crowd that knows it's not theirs? Nope.
Just take a look at the various hire car threads on here for the various things that people get up to in what would effectively be a 'normal' car. The fact that it's a fast variant would make the situation even worse, in my opinion.
Hi - firstly sorry to hear about your situation. I stay in the area myself and know how tough it is around here at the moment!
The concept of monetising the NC500 I think is good but the range of cars I don't think would capture the audience you're looking for. I personally wouldn't fly to the EVO triangle to drive a 182 Trophy, but I might drive my own car down there to do it. Would I fly there for a few days in a brand new Focus RS? Perhaps, but maybe not for the cost you would need to charge!
A little pivot could be arranged tours - either a drive what you bring or supply something interesting/classic - but have arranged food stops, hotels, events etc. Either do it individually or you could try and get a group to tour together similar to Gumball. You might be able to get decent discounts for sending people to certain hotels or areas and upswell for day trips (e.g Skye, knockhill day)
If you were to go with your original idea I'd be inclined to swap out the cars for an Elise/Caterham/VW Camper or something like that which many people won't own anything similar to.
Good luck - and keep us informed! If you open up something locally I'll come along
The concept of monetising the NC500 I think is good but the range of cars I don't think would capture the audience you're looking for. I personally wouldn't fly to the EVO triangle to drive a 182 Trophy, but I might drive my own car down there to do it. Would I fly there for a few days in a brand new Focus RS? Perhaps, but maybe not for the cost you would need to charge!
A little pivot could be arranged tours - either a drive what you bring or supply something interesting/classic - but have arranged food stops, hotels, events etc. Either do it individually or you could try and get a group to tour together similar to Gumball. You might be able to get decent discounts for sending people to certain hotels or areas and upswell for day trips (e.g Skye, knockhill day)
If you were to go with your original idea I'd be inclined to swap out the cars for an Elise/Caterham/VW Camper or something like that which many people won't own anything similar to.
Good luck - and keep us informed! If you open up something locally I'll come along
I know the areas you hope to cover and like posters above a hot hatch would not appeal.
A sports car or even half decent soft top would.
Flights up north are not cheap so your customer may be expecting something a bit different from a GTI. I'm not sure you need a full 4 seater as Scotland is not big enough to travel enough to need that much luggage space and spirited driving and rear seat passengers do not go together.
A sports car or even half decent soft top would.
Flights up north are not cheap so your customer may be expecting something a bit different from a GTI. I'm not sure you need a full 4 seater as Scotland is not big enough to travel enough to need that much luggage space and spirited driving and rear seat passengers do not go together.
There are a number of issues with this idea that have already been discussed but mileage is defo one of them. The sort of hatch backs you describe don't stand up too well to mileage with a careful owner, let alone many would-be Lewis Hamilton's ragging the crap out of them. If you are based in Aberdeen(ish) you have about 100 miles to Inverness before the NC500 starts. It's then a 500 mile loop and 100 miles back to Aberdeen. Assuming the clients don't go off the beaten track or loop back over some good bits of road, that's 700 miles to run the NC500. Assuming you achieve optimal rental and the car is away close to all week for one NC500 trip plus one Old Military Road trip, that's 1,000 miles a week or about 40,000 hard miles per year (assuming 40wk season).
I'd fancy a 182 to feel tired after a few months of this and positively broken after a year or so. I have a caravan up the NW coast and drive parts of the NC500 regularly. When I push it hard in the right conditions I can get brakes, gearboxes, etc complaining in 10-15 minutes. That's in my own car driven with a decorum of mechanical sympathy. I shudder to think what a group of lads that have hired two clio's could do over a 700 mile drive. Clutches, brakes, gearboxes, tyres and suspension components would all take a hammering and you'd have to factor this into your pricing.
I'd actually be more comfortable with the business model if you were taking about supercars. You'd attract a different clientel, operating in a different pricing bracket and with a premium product coupled with a premium experience, you have greater scope IMHO to price in a way that covers your risk and provides a decent margin.
I'd fancy a 182 to feel tired after a few months of this and positively broken after a year or so. I have a caravan up the NW coast and drive parts of the NC500 regularly. When I push it hard in the right conditions I can get brakes, gearboxes, etc complaining in 10-15 minutes. That's in my own car driven with a decorum of mechanical sympathy. I shudder to think what a group of lads that have hired two clio's could do over a 700 mile drive. Clutches, brakes, gearboxes, tyres and suspension components would all take a hammering and you'd have to factor this into your pricing.
I'd actually be more comfortable with the business model if you were taking about supercars. You'd attract a different clientel, operating in a different pricing bracket and with a premium product coupled with a premium experience, you have greater scope IMHO to price in a way that covers your risk and provides a decent margin.
OP, what about considering some different candidates, like:
- a small herd of VX220's
- or 205GTis / MK1/2 Golf GTis
- MK3 MR2s
Maybe by offering something a bit different/iconic, there may be further interest.
With regard to wear and tear, not every driver is going to be giving it death every minute behind the wheel.
Why don't you just get started with one car this summer and see how it goes?
- a small herd of VX220's
- or 205GTis / MK1/2 Golf GTis
- MK3 MR2s
Maybe by offering something a bit different/iconic, there may be further interest.
With regard to wear and tear, not every driver is going to be giving it death every minute behind the wheel.
Why don't you just get started with one car this summer and see how it goes?
Err, this will probably sound like a tired cliché attempt, but I reckon the new-shape MX5 would be ideal for this. Pretty robust, more exciting than most peoples daily cars but not as uncompromising as the Caterham hire option. Roof down to maximise the scenic potential, easy to drive and well-known which should maximise your market. Less likely to attract petrolheads trying to kill your cars, more likely to appeal to people who actually want to tour.
Don't get me wrong, it wouldn't be my first choice for a three-day blast, but there are lots of good reason why they're popular! Plus, when it's worn out you can chop it in for a new one
Don't get me wrong, it wouldn't be my first choice for a three-day blast, but there are lots of good reason why they're popular! Plus, when it's worn out you can chop it in for a new one
This sounds like a great way to make a small fortune - out of a large one!
Insurance will be ridiculous, advertising costs high, maintenance costs high and how much can you really charge for the hire of some old clio?
Assuming rolling costs of say £2000 a month - insurance, maintenance, advertising, renting a unit, heating, electric, rates, telephone, and assuming its going to take 2 years to really get up and running, then you're going to be down maybe £50,000 on the hope that it flies PLUS whatever savings you'll need to pillage for your own wages in the meantime.
Even if I'm being wildly pessimistic with those costs and you take an optimistic 6 months at it to start it up and allow £1500 a month in costs, theres £10K down, plus whatever you need to dip into savings for your own wages for - say another £1500 a month, so another £10K.
Thats a minimum of £20K burned to find out IF this is going to work. Can you afford to lose that on a gamble?
Dont underestimate the cost of keeping older hot hatches in tip top shape either. Clio 197s eat third gear syncros for example, so theres £1,000 for a box rebuild - i knackered a perfectly good low miles Clio 197 gearbox in a month of hard driving. With a handful of older hot hatches you could have one car with that sort of bill every month or two.
When you're sitting on a lump sum and redundancy ideas like this seem like a goer (been there down that and sadly got the T shirt), but renting out Clios in Aberdeen?? Honestly, double your chances of success and buy a lottery ticket.
Sorry.
Insurance will be ridiculous, advertising costs high, maintenance costs high and how much can you really charge for the hire of some old clio?
Assuming rolling costs of say £2000 a month - insurance, maintenance, advertising, renting a unit, heating, electric, rates, telephone, and assuming its going to take 2 years to really get up and running, then you're going to be down maybe £50,000 on the hope that it flies PLUS whatever savings you'll need to pillage for your own wages in the meantime.
Even if I'm being wildly pessimistic with those costs and you take an optimistic 6 months at it to start it up and allow £1500 a month in costs, theres £10K down, plus whatever you need to dip into savings for your own wages for - say another £1500 a month, so another £10K.
Thats a minimum of £20K burned to find out IF this is going to work. Can you afford to lose that on a gamble?
Dont underestimate the cost of keeping older hot hatches in tip top shape either. Clio 197s eat third gear syncros for example, so theres £1,000 for a box rebuild - i knackered a perfectly good low miles Clio 197 gearbox in a month of hard driving. With a handful of older hot hatches you could have one car with that sort of bill every month or two.
When you're sitting on a lump sum and redundancy ideas like this seem like a goer (been there down that and sadly got the T shirt), but renting out Clios in Aberdeen?? Honestly, double your chances of success and buy a lottery ticket.
Sorry.
Edited by daemon on Tuesday 3rd January 21:42
Edited by daemon on Tuesday 3rd January 21:58
aww999 said:
Err, this will probably sound like a tired cliché attempt, but I reckon the new-shape MX5 would be ideal for this. Pretty robust, more exciting than most peoples daily cars but not as uncompromising as the Caterham hire option. Roof down to maximise the scenic potential, easy to drive and well-known which should maximise your market. Less likely to attract petrolheads trying to kill your cars, more likely to appeal to people who actually want to tour.
Don't get me wrong, it wouldn't be my first choice for a three-day blast, but there are lots of good reason why they're popular! Plus, when it's worn out you can chop it in for a new one
Three £20K MX5s will depreciate like snow off a ditch as hard driven hire cars. You could turn £60K of cars into £15Ks worth in three years.Don't get me wrong, it wouldn't be my first choice for a three-day blast, but there are lots of good reason why they're popular! Plus, when it's worn out you can chop it in for a new one
OP, read the MrH thread. May be worth getting in touch with him to see if there's an opportunity to partner with him on a Scottish branch of Drive Southwest.
Edit: found it. http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=952...
Edit: found it. http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=952...
Edited by 48k on Wednesday 4th January 21:32
I think it's a great idea but the devil is in the detail!
There's no doubt the NC500 is ridiculously hot right now, and this looks set to continue for some time. There's never been that much capacity in that part of the world so existing accommodation providers and businesses are full to bursting.
Whilst some of the roads can be taken at speed I think you'd be better changing from lukewarm hatches to an interesting mix of classic cars - albeit something which you can maintain and repair without losing your shirt.
The more added value you can factor in the better - premium guided tours are big business in Scotland, and rich travellers don't mind paying for that special touch.
Camper van hire along the route would also be a good opportunity as there aren't usually the same restrictions as in England and Wales on parking up for the night around a beauty spot.
I loved my Clio 182 but I don't think I'd be excited about paying good money to hire one. I could get excited by an interesting car from yesteryear - perhaps a Merc SL, Volvo P1800, MGB, classic VW camper van or Mk 1 Golf GTi. The trouble with older hot hatches is they're neither old enough to be an iconic classic, nor young enough to be a desirable current range. Mind you, an old Scooby Impreza Turbo would be almost the perfect car for those roads.
If you could find the sweet spot with interesting, desirable but affordable cars, then it could be a winner.
Let us know how you get on.
There's no doubt the NC500 is ridiculously hot right now, and this looks set to continue for some time. There's never been that much capacity in that part of the world so existing accommodation providers and businesses are full to bursting.
Whilst some of the roads can be taken at speed I think you'd be better changing from lukewarm hatches to an interesting mix of classic cars - albeit something which you can maintain and repair without losing your shirt.
The more added value you can factor in the better - premium guided tours are big business in Scotland, and rich travellers don't mind paying for that special touch.
Camper van hire along the route would also be a good opportunity as there aren't usually the same restrictions as in England and Wales on parking up for the night around a beauty spot.
I loved my Clio 182 but I don't think I'd be excited about paying good money to hire one. I could get excited by an interesting car from yesteryear - perhaps a Merc SL, Volvo P1800, MGB, classic VW camper van or Mk 1 Golf GTi. The trouble with older hot hatches is they're neither old enough to be an iconic classic, nor young enough to be a desirable current range. Mind you, an old Scooby Impreza Turbo would be almost the perfect car for those roads.
If you could find the sweet spot with interesting, desirable but affordable cars, then it could be a winner.
Let us know how you get on.
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