Bank holding on to international wire payment for 10 days
Discussion
Hello,
Has anybody here had any experience with their bank holding on to a international wire payment while they perform "due diligence"?
For the last 2 years, I've been paying a supplier in Ireland roughly 12,000 euros per month for services, and never had any issues.
I paid them using a forex company, who use a intermediate bank to send the funds to my suppliers bank in Ireland. That was on 02/10/18, the payment left my account but hasn't arrived at my supplier. Upon calling the forex company, they've told me the intermediary bank has held the payment while it performs checks, but there is no time frame or updates on how long it will take, and there is nothing they can do because it's another bank that's causing the issue. My supplier has been patient but I'm starting to worry now. They said outright that there is no time frame and they can't say how long it will take.
After doing a bit of research on the internet, I'm hearing of horror stories of banks seizing funds for months or even years due to money laundering etc, and innocent people get dragged in. Has this happened to anyone else?
Has anybody here had any experience with their bank holding on to a international wire payment while they perform "due diligence"?
For the last 2 years, I've been paying a supplier in Ireland roughly 12,000 euros per month for services, and never had any issues.
I paid them using a forex company, who use a intermediate bank to send the funds to my suppliers bank in Ireland. That was on 02/10/18, the payment left my account but hasn't arrived at my supplier. Upon calling the forex company, they've told me the intermediary bank has held the payment while it performs checks, but there is no time frame or updates on how long it will take, and there is nothing they can do because it's another bank that's causing the issue. My supplier has been patient but I'm starting to worry now. They said outright that there is no time frame and they can't say how long it will take.
After doing a bit of research on the internet, I'm hearing of horror stories of banks seizing funds for months or even years due to money laundering etc, and innocent people get dragged in. Has this happened to anyone else?
Yes, where an international customer used my personal name on a bank transfer coming in to my dollar account rather than the company name. The account details were correct but the correspondent bank didn’t like it one bit and two weeks in the money still hadn’t arrived.
We solved it by both parties (me and customer) emailing our respective banks requesting that the held funds be immediately returned to sender.
This was done (about another week) and the money arrived back with him less a fair chunk of “administration” fee. My customer is fair but not easy, and I copped for that fee when he resent it so the experience cost me a few hundred dollars.
Obviously can’t comment on why your payment is held but my experience suggests that you need to make contact with the payments team at the bank rather than customer service and actually create a call to action for them. Best of luck.
We solved it by both parties (me and customer) emailing our respective banks requesting that the held funds be immediately returned to sender.
This was done (about another week) and the money arrived back with him less a fair chunk of “administration” fee. My customer is fair but not easy, and I copped for that fee when he resent it so the experience cost me a few hundred dollars.
Obviously can’t comment on why your payment is held but my experience suggests that you need to make contact with the payments team at the bank rather than customer service and actually create a call to action for them. Best of luck.
Is the relationship with the forex company new or have you been using them for the full two years? If the latter they should be able to see the payments and this should help.
If the relationship with the forex company is new, and hence there is a new correspondent bank in the mix, think carefully about whether there is anything at all in the payment that may trigger suspicions - a mismatch of data (goods coming to one address while ordered from another) a misspelled name etc. The bank in question has no real interest in holding your money - even if it thinks it is suspicious and has filed a SAR they will likely just wait the statutory period in Ireland and then release the payment. It is always possible the problem is with the supplier not you - are they a large multi-national or a small outfit?
As suggested above I would get onto the remittance company and ask them to put you in touch with their contact at the correspondent bank and then just offer to help. Don’t be defensive or aggressive just see if their is info they need.
Good luck.
If the relationship with the forex company is new, and hence there is a new correspondent bank in the mix, think carefully about whether there is anything at all in the payment that may trigger suspicions - a mismatch of data (goods coming to one address while ordered from another) a misspelled name etc. The bank in question has no real interest in holding your money - even if it thinks it is suspicious and has filed a SAR they will likely just wait the statutory period in Ireland and then release the payment. It is always possible the problem is with the supplier not you - are they a large multi-national or a small outfit?
As suggested above I would get onto the remittance company and ask them to put you in touch with their contact at the correspondent bank and then just offer to help. Don’t be defensive or aggressive just see if their is info they need.
Good luck.
Unfortunately this is fairly common practice and a lot of the newer boutique FX companies use these banks.
If you need a reliable service then I can highly recommend Argentex. They are a large established firm that carry out the transactions even on behalf of banks. Do all ours, no fees and same day clearance of funds. Chris Canning is the manager and very easy to talk to for a personal service, he may even be able to advise on your current situation. He works with many Pistonhead members.
If you need a reliable service then I can highly recommend Argentex. They are a large established firm that carry out the transactions even on behalf of banks. Do all ours, no fees and same day clearance of funds. Chris Canning is the manager and very easy to talk to for a personal service, he may even be able to advise on your current situation. He works with many Pistonhead members.
It's American Express International Payments, who I've used for years.
The payment in question is going to Ulster Bank in Dublin, and I've made this same payment to the same supplier every single month for over 2 years.
I think Amex's correspondent bank is JP Morgan Chase.
Amex have advised me not to contact the beneficiary bank (Ulster Bank) because the payment hasn't reached them yet, and is with the correspondent bank.
So I'm in limbo
Every time I call, I'm told there is no update.
The payment in question is going to Ulster Bank in Dublin, and I've made this same payment to the same supplier every single month for over 2 years.
I think Amex's correspondent bank is JP Morgan Chase.
Amex have advised me not to contact the beneficiary bank (Ulster Bank) because the payment hasn't reached them yet, and is with the correspondent bank.
So I'm in limbo
Every time I call, I'm told there is no update.It is always possible that the problem is at the supplier end (something about them has triggered the alert) but even assuming something caused AMEX to file a suspicious activity report then one would normally hear nothing from the NCA and then be free to make the payment after 7 days. That can be extended to 31 in certain circumstances but that is very unusual.
Usually banks wont tell you anything due to concerns about "tipping off" however this isn't always valid (see this case reported last week: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lawyer-leaves-n... )
Do you have legal expenses insurance for your business? If you do, I'd be tempted to go direct access to David Lonsdale and see if he can give you some advice.
Usually banks wont tell you anything due to concerns about "tipping off" however this isn't always valid (see this case reported last week: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lawyer-leaves-n... )
Do you have legal expenses insurance for your business? If you do, I'd be tempted to go direct access to David Lonsdale and see if he can give you some advice.
williaa68 said:
It is always possible that the problem is at the supplier end (something about them has triggered the alert) but even assuming something caused AMEX to file a suspicious activity report then one would normally hear nothing from the NCA and then be free to make the payment after 7 days. That can be extended to 31 in certain circumstances but that is very unusual.
Usually banks wont tell you anything due to concerns about "tipping off" however this isn't always valid (see this case reported last week: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lawyer-leaves-n... )
Do you have legal expenses insurance for your business? If you do, I'd be tempted to go direct access to David Lonsdale and see if he can give you some advice.
Well that makes for interesting reading! After doing my research, the situation is much worse in the USA:Usually banks wont tell you anything due to concerns about "tipping off" however this isn't always valid (see this case reported last week: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lawyer-leaves-n... )
Do you have legal expenses insurance for your business? If you do, I'd be tempted to go direct access to David Lonsdale and see if he can give you some advice.
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/irs-structu...
Anyhow, 2 weeks on, Amex have informed me that the correspondent bank (JP Morgan) asked for my name, address, and if I was connected to a company with a similar name to that of a company in Sierra Leone, which is on a sanction list noted as related to jihadi terrorism. I only found this out from Amex today.
I suppose that it's good that it's not a SAR, but still. Amex reckon it took 2 weeks because they had to liaise with multiple departments within Amex, They have done their own investigation, and now the money is sent for settlement with JP Morgan as the correspondent bank, however JP Morgan are going to investigate further and who knows how long that will take. Surely it is obvious, they have a copy of my passport etc.
Say my company name was Red Tractor Supplies Ltd, well the company in Sierra Leone is called Red Tractor Group Ltd, what a pain in the arse!!
So if your going to start a company, check the sanction list first and save yourself a lot of bother.
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