Moonlighting on furlough

[Kiribati268]

I'm aware there's already a thread on furloughing, but it's a bit more unique question.

My company has lost 90% of work over the past week and is seeking the 80% wage contribution from the government, the wheels are still in motion but it looks like most of the workforce will be stood down and told to not come in as there's nothing to do for at least a couple of weeks, probably a month or two, maybe more. It is yet to be confirmed but it seems that we will be getting 80% of our wage for being at home watching TV, which I can't grumble about, better than being made redundant or unpaid (which is what this is for)

Now, to top up my wage can I work for another company on an ad-hoc basis? I have a class 1 HGV licence and could use the time to do some agency work. Or what about those that want to use the time to do a few weeks in a supermarket? The gov website say I cannot work for my employer during the time, but nothing about a different employer.

With how huge this is I guess even if not allowed then it's a drop in the ocean and no-one will ever notice anyway, but i'd rather it didn't bite me on the arse down the line.

[DKL]

I think the payments will be made directly to the employee not via the employer. This should stop any unscrupulous types keeping the money or inventing staff but also to be able to monitor your NI number for any other payments by anyone else at which point your 80% stops dead.

[Ean218]

DKL said:

I think the payments will be made directly to the employee not via the employer. This should stop any unscrupulous types keeping the money or inventing staff but also to be able to monitor your NI number for any other payments by anyone else at which point your 80% stops dead.

That is wholly guesswork, .gov.uk is the only place to get information.

It is actually expected that employers would continue to pay and they would then be refunded much later through the currently non-existent on-line portal. The Coronavirus Business Interruption Loan Scheme has been set up to enable employers to borrow the money in the meantime, should they not have enough funds.

Absolutely nothing has been said yet about restricting, or otherwise, the ability of furloughed employees to work elsewhere.

[chrispmartha]

Ean218 said:

DKL said:

I think the payments will be made directly to the employee not via the employer. This should stop any unscrupulous types keeping the money or inventing staff but also to be able to monitor your NI number for any other payments by anyone else at which point your 80% stops dead.

That is wholly guesswork, .gov.uk is the only place to get information.

It is actually expected that employers would continue to pay and they would then be refunded much later through the currently non-existent on-line portal. The Coronavirus Business Interruption Loan Scheme has been set up to enable employers to borrow the money in the meantime, should they not have enough funds.

Absolutely nothing has been said yet about restricting, or otherwise, the ability of furloughed employees to work elsewhere.

If the employers have to pay then reclaim, doesn’t that defeat the whole objective?

[Eric Mc]

No.

[chrispmartha]

Eric Mc said:

No.

No what? If the employer still has to pay the wages, how does that help any cash flow situation?

[DKL]

Ean218 said:

DKL said:

I think the payments will be made directly to the employee not via the employer. This should stop any unscrupulous types keeping the money or inventing staff but also to be able to monitor your NI number for any other payments by anyone else at which point your 80% stops dead.

That is wholly guesswork, .gov.uk is the only place to get information.

It is actually expected that employers would continue to pay and they would then be refunded much later through the currently non-existent on-line portal. The Coronavirus Business Interruption Loan Scheme has been set up to enable employers to borrow the money in the meantime, should they not have enough funds.

Absolutely nothing has been said yet about restricting, or otherwise, the ability of furloughed employees to work elsewhere.

Is it or is that guesswork too? I haven't heard or read that. As you say gov.uk will inform us but I can't see them being willing to pay out if you can, legitimately earn.

[Eric Mc]

chrispmartha said:

Eric Mc said:

No.

No what? If the employer still has to pay the wages, how does that help any cash flow situation?

It all depends on how quickly the cash comes through. We simply don't know anything about how this scheme will operate yet to be able to criticise what we think its shortcomings might be.

I am pretty sure that the one thing the government will NOT be doing is paying money directly into individual furloughed employee bank accounts. That would simply be a nightmare to administer. Even more so when you consider that many furloughed employees may not even have bank accounts. Would they be expected to queue up at Post Offices to collect their "government subsidised salary" each month? I very much doubt it.

[chrispmartha]

Eric Mc said:

chrispmartha said:

Eric Mc said:

No.

No what? If the employer still has to pay the wages, how does that help any cash flow situation?

It all depends on how quickly the cash comes through. We simply don't know anything about how this scheme will operate yet to be able to criticise what we think its shortcomings might be.

I am pretty sure that the one thing the government will NOT be doing is paying money directly into individual furloughed employee bank accounts. That would simply be a nightmare to administer. Even more so when you consider that many furloughed employees may not even have bank accounts. Would they be expected to queue up at Post Offices to collect their "government subsidised salary" each month? I very much doubt it.

Im not criticising, I'm just speculating like everyone else

[sleepezy]

I had a detailed look yesterday - HMRC's site specifically stated that the employer pays the employee and then recovers the supported value.

It did say that they were pulling together the mechanism as quickly as possible - and further said that there was no mechanism to pay employees directly.

Cut and past jobbie:

---

Support for businesses through the Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme
Under the Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme, all UK employers will be able to access support to continue paying part of their employees’ salary for those employees that would otherwise have been laid off during this crisis.

Eligibility
All UK businesses are eligible.

How to access the scheme
You will need to:

designate affected employees as ‘furloughed workers,’ and notify your employees of this change - changing the status of employees remains subject to existing employment law and, depending on the employment contract, may be subject to negotiation
submit information to HMRC about the employees that have been furloughed and their earnings through a new online portal (HMRC will set out further details on the information required)
HMRC will reimburse 80% of furloughed workers wage costs, up to a cap of £2,500 per month. HMRC are working urgently to set up a system for reimbursement. Existing systems are not set up to facilitate payments to employers.

If your business needs short term cash flow support, you may be eligible for a Coronavirus Business Interruption Loan.

---

Link
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidanc...

[Mr Overheads]

This is the new Govt portal for all these schemes:
https://www.businesssupport.gov.uk/coronavirus-bus...

[KrissKross]

chrispmartha said:

I'm just speculating like everyone else

Which is what we need less of.

[jammy-git]

chrispmartha said:

Eric Mc said:

No.

No what? If the employer still has to pay the wages, how does that help any cash flow situation?

Because it's aimed at bigger companies. Car plants, factories, leisure centres, travel agents, etc that are shutting down and would have otherwise laid off people.

If you think any of these measures have been brought in to help small businesses, think again.

[sociopath]

KrissKross said:

chrispmartha said:

I'm just speculating like everyone else

Which is what we need less of.

I think we also need less people trying to play the system and end up better off

[GT03ROB]

I think anybody who is furloughed & paid by the government should be at the governments disposal to use as they see fit in this crisis.

[Kiribati268]

sociopath said:

I think we also need less people trying to play the system and end up better off

Hope that's not aimed at me?

Certainly not trying to play the/any system, but to use skills that are required rather than sat on my arse doing nothing. And to keep me sane.

I'm not deliberately trying to profiteer from the current situation, i'm aware just how much of a mess the economy is in and many, many businesses have failed as a result.

I already do odd work on the side (you can go back through my posts from a couple of years ago if you want), and was wondering if I can still do it.

Edited by Kiribati268 on Tuesday 24th March 15:17

[TheK1981]

I arrived here to ask the same question.

I have a full time job that pays the bills and things, and a 2nd job to pay for extra like holidays.

I survived round 1 of the furlough today, but there is more next week, if I had to just survive on 80% plus my part time things would get tight, so I need to know if I did get furloughed what the deal would be.

Its good that it was announced quickly, but there will always be us people that are outside the standard template.

[Dixy]

Just imagine what st you would be in if they had not done the 80%.
If you want to do something then do it for free and give rather than taking.

[jammy-git]

Dixy said:

Just imagine what st you would be in if they had not done the 80%.
If you want to do something then do it for free and give rather than taking.

Until the end of April, absolutely no difference. Companies still have to find the cash to pay employees until then.

[Grrbang]

jammy-git said:

Until the end of April, absolutely no difference. Companies still have to find the cash to pay employees until then.

A Goldman Sachs survey of small businesses (in the US) suggests that the end of April may be too late. They found that 25% only had enough reserves to survive for about 2 weeks, should income disappear abruptly. These were typically hospitality and restaurants.

Our restaurants and hotels have already been closed for nearly a week, and were suffering well before that. We need something right now.