Annual pay reviews
Discussion
My company reviews salaries on an annual basis at company year end (also bonuses paid, pension contributions reviewed etc.). The company is a subsidiary of a very well known company in financial services but 'independantly run'.
I have changed roles since the last pay review and management are saying that they won't touch my pay until the next review which is months away. I'm thinking of walking out of protest as i think this is grossly unfair and feel like i'm working for free. Not to mention the fact that i could easily go and earn much more doing a similar role elsewhere!
Views welcome and appreciated.
I have changed roles since the last pay review and management are saying that they won't touch my pay until the next review which is months away. I'm thinking of walking out of protest as i think this is grossly unfair and feel like i'm working for free. Not to mention the fact that i could easily go and earn much more doing a similar role elsewhere!
Views welcome and appreciated.
My advice would be to get your head down and do well at your new expanded role. When it does come to pay review time you'll then be in good standing and able to argue that your pay should match your increased responsibility and workload - and that you have shown that you can do the job.
Pretty much this is how it works.
1) Your role expands. Your work gets harder. You now have a more responsible job.
2) Months pass.
3) Now you are doing the job and succeeding at it you press, at your annual review, for proper recognition that you have a more responsible role than before.
4) You get the "grade" - and, in due course, the pay rise that goes with it.
Every last firm I've ever worked for has been the same. You don't get promoted and given a pay rise until you are already doing the job you will be promoted into - and have been for some months proving yourself.
Head down. And congratulations on getting the *opportunity to be promoted*. You are almost certainly doing something right.
BTW: Its HR's job to slow down and frustrate every possible means by which your managers can promote you quickly. This is because their job is to get the maximum amount of work from the workforce for the minimum possible cost. They aren't, of course, allowed to know this because if they did they would know that *they too* are doing the maximum amount of work for the minumum possible cost and would get pissed off. At the top of every HR organisation there is a single Director who knows the truth. His name may vary, "Catbert", "Don Hughes" and "Satan" for example but its the same guy underneath.
You just have to live with it...
Pretty much this is how it works.
1) Your role expands. Your work gets harder. You now have a more responsible job.
2) Months pass.
3) Now you are doing the job and succeeding at it you press, at your annual review, for proper recognition that you have a more responsible role than before.
4) You get the "grade" - and, in due course, the pay rise that goes with it.
Every last firm I've ever worked for has been the same. You don't get promoted and given a pay rise until you are already doing the job you will be promoted into - and have been for some months proving yourself.
Head down. And congratulations on getting the *opportunity to be promoted*. You are almost certainly doing something right.
BTW: Its HR's job to slow down and frustrate every possible means by which your managers can promote you quickly. This is because their job is to get the maximum amount of work from the workforce for the minimum possible cost. They aren't, of course, allowed to know this because if they did they would know that *they too* are doing the maximum amount of work for the minumum possible cost and would get pissed off. At the top of every HR organisation there is a single Director who knows the truth. His name may vary, "Catbert", "Don Hughes" and "Satan" for example but its the same guy underneath.
You just have to live with it...
I know the situation well!! Resonsibility by stealth is the motto at my place!
I came up with 3 options:
a) Threaten to quit unless immediate increase - prompting a P45 or a counter offer/raise. Risky.
b) As Don says, get on with it and hope for the best. Sensible.
c) Work you way into the position until you are invaluable, then option A.
I came up with 3 options:
a) Threaten to quit unless immediate increase - prompting a P45 or a counter offer/raise. Risky.
b) As Don says, get on with it and hope for the best. Sensible.
c) Work you way into the position until you are invaluable, then option A.
Don said:
... "Catbert"
Magnificent end to great post 
! Remember a sketch when Catbert and pointy hair'd boss together with Catbert stood on table of boss.
Boss was looking at paper saying how bad the job market was.
Catbert remarks on how that meant their power to abuse the staff was growing by the day. Catbert then did the "evil dance" !!
RichardD said:
Don said:
... "Catbert"
Magnificent end to great post ! Remember a sketch when Catbert and pointy hair'd boss together with Catbert stood on table of boss.
Boss was looking at paper saying how bad the job market was.
Catbert remarks on how that meant their power to abuse the staff was growing by the day. Catbert then did the "evil dance" !!
"Catbert The Evil HR Director".
When my firm expanded to the point we had to (officially) have a Director in charge of HR I got given the role and was allowed to find out "the truth".
Since then Catbert has been my inspiration! 
Mattt said:
I know the situation well!! Resonsibility by stealth is the motto at my place!
I came up with 3 options:
a) Threaten to quit unless immediate increase - prompting a P45 or a counter offer/raise. Risky.
b) As Don says, get on with it and hope for the best. Sensible.
c) Work you way into the position until you are invaluable, then option A.
I came up with 3 options:
a) Threaten to quit unless immediate increase - prompting a P45 or a counter offer/raise. Risky.
b) As Don says, get on with it and hope for the best. Sensible.
c) Work you way into the position until you are invaluable, then option A.
I agree with this, some good advice.
My only view from the 'other side' of the employment negotiation table is that seeing it from the employers point of view is a bit different. Lets say employee 'A' is doing well and wants to move up through the company. Someone leaves a higher role and needs to be filled. The company can either recruit elsewhere and fill the role in a 'like for like' way or give the chance to up and coming 'A' who should be able to learn the new skills and get experience for the job. However, it may not be right for them and the risk is that up and coming 'A' does not suit the role and a replacement needs to be brought in, and secondly 'A' does not want to get a downgrade from what their pay has just been put up to and their new pay structure does not fit in with their old role. Bright spark 'A' is lost to the company and goes somewhere else, wants to sue the company, or at very least loses heart in their job.
So you have a mid-way solution in that 'A' starts the role and when their ability in the role is proved their pay would be around on a par with the exiting employee in the role.
If 'A' cannot do the job, there is no big retraction of terms/pay and 'A' can perhaps be better suited to a different advancement prospect in the company.
It is obvious that the OP wants the advancement - in that case either the employee or the employer has to take a leap of faith in that things will end up fairly in that the employer either pays someone the full wage whilst they are learning the role or the employee works for the same money whilst they take on more work.
It comes down to who calls the shots. Its usually the employer, as *they* offer wages and advancement. However, if you want to stick your proverbial balls in the wind and fight for the extra, be prepared to have them cut off! Whether they are or not depends on how big they are - or more frequently how big *they think* they are.
Don said:
RichardD said:
Don said:
... "Catbert"
Magnificent end to great post ! Remember a sketch when Catbert and pointy hair'd boss together with Catbert stood on table of boss.
Boss was looking at paper saying how bad the job market was.
Catbert remarks on how that meant their power to abuse the staff was growing by the day. Catbert then did the "evil dance" !!
"Catbert The Evil HR Director".
When my firm expanded to the point we had to (officially) have a Director in charge of HR I got given the role and was allowed to find out "the truth".
Since then Catbert has been my inspiration! Awwp.... There he is people.... STONE HIM.
(You might want to watch out!!)
Don said:
BTW: Its HR's job to slow down and frustrate every possible means by which your managers can promote you quickly. This is because their job is to get the maximum amount of work from the workforce for the minimum possible cost. They aren't, of course, allowed to know this because if they did they would know that *they too* are doing the maximum amount of work for the minumum possible cost and would get pissed off. At the top of every HR organisation there is a single Director who knows the truth. His name may vary, "Catbert", "Don Hughes" and "Satan" for example but its the same guy underneath.
You just have to live with it...
Worked in HR department for 18 months, and this is sooo true. I think I was chased out when I found ou the secret...Mattt said:
I
a) Threaten to quit unless immediate increase - prompting a P45 or a counter offer/raise. Risky.
a) Threaten to quit unless immediate increase - prompting a P45 or a counter offer/raise. Risky.
back in the dark days of being a permie corporate slave I twice got into the position where i wanted to re negotiate things...
the first one was I only wanted to work 4 days a week with same total hours same pay. first answer NO, ok i'll leave then, erm ok
2nd time now i only want to work 2 days a week on half full salary. No . ok i'll leave. Erm ok then how about 2 year fixed term contract, if we ask you anything outside the 2 days its 1 hour at double time for each time we call, and if you stay the 2 years you can have 10% of total pay inc overtime as a bonus..
bugger i really wanted to leave, but such a good deal... I had to stay on for a bit longer....
and all that was almost 10 years ago in local goverment !!!
You can push really hard, but you have to be prepared to walk if they dont play ball.
G
Edited by Graham on Friday 23 March 11:25
Mattt said:
I know the situation well!! Resonsibility by stealth is the motto at my place!
I came up with 3 options:
a) Threaten to quit unless immediate increase - prompting a P45 or a counter offer/raise. Risky.
b) As Don says, get on with it and hope for the best. Sensible.
c) Work you way into the position until you are invaluable, then option A.
I came up with 3 options:
a) Threaten to quit unless immediate increase - prompting a P45 or a counter offer/raise. Risky.
b) As Don says, get on with it and hope for the best. Sensible.
c) Work you way into the position until you are invaluable, then option A.
I am following option (b) & (c) at the moment! and my review is appraisal is next week and i will be taking in the job discription for the job i want with proof of why they should promote me and give me more pay. I have been getting my head down fo r 9month in my new role and now want the reward for doing that. I have also taken on more responsibility for the back office running of the business unit of 300 people, If i dont get what i want then i will be doing option (a)
Good luck with your review though
Mattt said:
Conspiracy? 
Of course!
Remember: only the HR Director knows the secret but his evil minions/henchmen still have to do his bidding: to get the maximum possible amount of work out of the workforce for the minimum possible cost.
I've done the head down thing followed by the surprise, surprise I want to be promoted to reflect the job I'm actually doing thing. It can and does work if you are firm, polite and right about how good you are. Be prepared to be patient - it takes the Managing Director to overrule the HR Director. Depending on how far above you that is there can be a lot of layers for an "unusual HR request" to get through before someone powerful enough to make a decision actually gets to notice the issue and consider a solution. Remember - actually giving anyone more money and more benefits is EXACTLY what HR are there to PREVENT (except they aren't allowed to know this).
Once you know the "secret" though you can see through all the utter bollox spouted by HR and amuse yourself thinking up entertaining games to put them through.
At the end of the day it takes someone with authority to make a business decision: Are you worth the new money or would they be better off with someone else.
If you're going to get into a review that seeks to answer this very question - be sure, absolutely certain, you are worth the new money. Or else you will be fired.
I've had the chance to be the hirer and the firer as well as the employee and I can assure you - this is how it is.
What you do with the information is up to you!
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