Buying a pub - Anyone done it - Any Landlords around?
Discussion
Hi all,
Does anyone have experience of:
Being a landlord and/or buying a pub and being a landlord/selling a pub. I'm after experiences, anecdotes, pit-falls, advice - anything and everything really. How much work is it (I've heard it's a lot of hard work!), how likely is failure "statistically". Buying somewhere with mainly wet sales and looking to introduce food - do-able? Sensible?!
We've just started wondering whether it's something we'd like to do and have a quick shufty on t'internet at some places for sale around our area.
Can you earn good money as a landlord or is it just really hard work? We're looking at it as a "lifestyle" change - and I don't mean so we can sit around and do nothing all day, just we'd like to get out of the rat-race and start doing something for ourselves.
Cheers in advance for any advice or knowledge!
Phil.
Does anyone have experience of:
Being a landlord and/or buying a pub and being a landlord/selling a pub. I'm after experiences, anecdotes, pit-falls, advice - anything and everything really. How much work is it (I've heard it's a lot of hard work!), how likely is failure "statistically". Buying somewhere with mainly wet sales and looking to introduce food - do-able? Sensible?!
We've just started wondering whether it's something we'd like to do and have a quick shufty on t'internet at some places for sale around our area.
Can you earn good money as a landlord or is it just really hard work? We're looking at it as a "lifestyle" change - and I don't mean so we can sit around and do nothing all day, just we'd like to get out of the rat-race and start doing something for ourselves.
Cheers in advance for any advice or knowledge!
Phil.
freddies_dad said:
Hi all,
Does anyone have experience of:
Being a landlord and/or buying a pub and being a landlord/selling a pub. I'm after experiences, anecdotes, pit-falls, advice - anything and everything really. How much work is it (I've heard it's a lot of hard work!), how likely is failure "statistically". Buying somewhere with mainly wet sales and looking to introduce food - do-able? Sensible?!
We've just started wondering whether it's something we'd like to do and have a quick shufty on t'internet at some places for sale around our area.
Can you earn good money as a landlord or is it just really hard work? We're looking at it as a "lifestyle" change - and I don't mean so we can sit around and do nothing all day, just we'd like to get out of the rat-race and start doing something for ourselves.
Cheers in advance for any advice or knowledge!
Phil.
Does anyone have experience of:
Being a landlord and/or buying a pub and being a landlord/selling a pub. I'm after experiences, anecdotes, pit-falls, advice - anything and everything really. How much work is it (I've heard it's a lot of hard work!), how likely is failure "statistically". Buying somewhere with mainly wet sales and looking to introduce food - do-able? Sensible?!
We've just started wondering whether it's something we'd like to do and have a quick shufty on t'internet at some places for sale around our area.
Can you earn good money as a landlord or is it just really hard work? We're looking at it as a "lifestyle" change - and I don't mean so we can sit around and do nothing all day, just we'd like to get out of the rat-race and start doing something for ourselves.
Cheers in advance for any advice or knowledge!
Phil.
Years ago, my friend's parents bought a pub, a nice one in the countryside.
They make a comfortable enough living from it, you'll never ever ever get rich from it. Oh, and they work about 70+ hour weeks. Plus, living there, you're always 'at work'.
Plotloss said:
Take your working week, including commuting and add 50% again and you're probably in the same sort of ball park.
Never mix business and pleasure.
Put off yet?
Never mix business and pleasure.
Put off yet?
90 hours a week!
But what about if a bar manager were employed by us?
And are the hours just "hours at work" rather than 90 back breaking hours a week?
To be honest - the number of hours doesn't scare me. What scares me more is working really hard for someone else for the rest of my life!
Surely if it were as bad as that - no one would be in the game... surely?!
freddies_dad said:
To be honest - the number of hours doesn't scare me. What scares me more is working really hard for someone else for the rest of my life!
I fully support that outlook as you know.
We looked into it a few years ago as 'er indoors has experience in the field (she ran the off licence where I met her - shameful I know) and an Aunt of mine was a director of a big independant chain of pubs.
Theres good money in it if you're prepared to work bloody hard and constantly pile the profits back in to buy more pubs and get to a point where the margin on a few pays for a lifestyle without working the huge hours.
But then theres good money in lots of things if you're willing to put the work in.
When I looked after one in Brizzle it was tough. We put a band on every night and two on Sundays (lunch and eve). There was one legit delivery and a couple of 'extra's' a week opening hours were 11 till 11 - 11 till 10.30 on Sun. We'd get up at 8/9am to let the cleaners in and do the cellar - meticulously clean and beer kept properly/staff rota's/daily takings/ordering booze and food(there's the kitchen bit as well - a whole business in itself!!), finish off what the cleaners left/mend the lights in the ladies/hire staff/fire staff/phone staff to cover other poorly staff/confirm bands/rebook cancelled bands ...(bleedin staff!!!), stock the fridges, restock the display of crisps/nuts/pork scratchings then open... normally it was OK then, always keeping an eye out for fights, drunks, domestics, staff shagging in the glass washing bit, staff fighting in the glass washing bit, other pubs in the area nicking glasses from the outside bit...
Do you want me to go on...
I loved it.
Do you want me to go on...
I loved it.
Plotloss said:
I fully support that outlook as you know.
Plotloss said:
(she ran the off licence where I met her - shameful I know)
Plotloss said:
But then theres good money in lots of things if you're willing to put the work in.
Very, very true - but the difficulty is finding the thing that you want to put the hours in to. If I think of most things within the realm of my "experience" - I feel incredibly deflated!! Nothing interests me or excites me about IT - not the area that I have experience of, anyway!! I feel that I could put the hours in to running a pub - mostly for the challenge and not for the free drinks at the end of the night.
And I think I'd like to run a pub empire... a sort of Sir John Harvey Jones with a larger, redder nose perhaps?
I think it's possibly telling that I know of only 1 landlord who's ever frequented this site and I don't think he does anymore!
I'd still be interested in anyone who's had direct experience of the "game".
(thanks for your input so far though chaps!)
Edited by freddies_dad on Wednesday 4th April 16:19
freddies_dad said:
I think it's possibly telling that I know of only 1 landlord who's ever frequented this site and I don't think he does anymore!
Very I've only had (quite a bit) of experience wrt bar and cellar work, where its a case of you do your hours and then go home.
From what I've seen, actually running the place is a lot of hard graft for relatively little reward (unless the food side takes off) and an almost complete lack of a normal social life (unless you happen to get on very very well with your regulars).
Plotloss said:
What you need is a redundancy payment.
Nothing sharpens the mind like the concept of poverty.
I know the golden handcuffs feeling all to well.
Nothing sharpens the mind like the concept of poverty.
I know the golden handcuffs feeling all to well.
Yep - though sadly not viable with me being a contractor.
pdV6 said:
and an almost complete lack of a normal social life
I'm not sure how much that'd bother me, tbh. But I think I'd be silly not to at least acknowledge the fact. spdpug98 said:
I work on the Pub Company (Lease/Tenanted) side of the business and will be happy to answer any questions if I can, but probably better via mail - PM me if you need any advice
That would be most welcome. I'll PM you. Thanks!
Was thinking of buying a management run pub. My accountant talked me out of it.
Too much to go into here, but basically said they attract the wrong sort of staff. Generally always problems with it being a cash industry, trust is a huge issue.
Just noise to me, but I went a different route anyway.
ETA: From what I've been told statistically kids from a pub environment don't tend to fare so well at school.
Too much to go into here, but basically said they attract the wrong sort of staff. Generally always problems with it being a cash industry, trust is a huge issue.
Just noise to me, but I went a different route anyway.
ETA: From what I've been told statistically kids from a pub environment don't tend to fare so well at school.
Edited by magic torch on Wednesday 4th April 16:27
Plotloss said:
Oh, didnt realise you were a proper IT type, always had you down as a permanoid for some reason.
fully paid-up geek. magic torch said:
Was thinking of buying a management run pub. My accountant talked me out of it.
Too much to go into here, but basically said they attract the wrong sort of staff. Generally always problems with it being a cash industry, trust is a huge issue.
Just noise to me, but I went a different route anyway.
Would you mind if I PM'd you about it? Too much to go into here, but basically said they attract the wrong sort of staff. Generally always problems with it being a cash industry, trust is a huge issue.
Just noise to me, but I went a different route anyway.
magic torch said:
ETA: From what I've been told statistically kids from a pub environment don't tend to fare so well at school.
Hmmm - that could be a biggy in the whole decision stakes.
At last a thread I know something about.
Are you planning on getting a freehold pub?? If so you will be fine and if it goes tits up you can just re sell it.
If you are getting a lease this is more risky. You will have to think this through, why is it up for sale how much notice do you have to give and who is the lease with are very important. Also if you get a lease the people who are advertising the lease can make a big diffence.
You can make a lot of money from pubs. I bought my firt lease in 2001 for £3000 then sold it a few years later for £125,000. Which was good, then I bough 2 Freehold pubs in South London for a bargain price and sold them on to a big chain after only a year and made a lot of money, which has paid for a very nice lifestyle for me and the missus
Are you planning on getting a freehold pub?? If so you will be fine and if it goes tits up you can just re sell it.
If you are getting a lease this is more risky. You will have to think this through, why is it up for sale how much notice do you have to give and who is the lease with are very important. Also if you get a lease the people who are advertising the lease can make a big diffence.
You can make a lot of money from pubs. I bought my firt lease in 2001 for £3000 then sold it a few years later for £125,000. Which was good, then I bough 2 Freehold pubs in South London for a bargain price and sold them on to a big chain after only a year and made a lot of money, which has paid for a very nice lifestyle for me and the missus
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