These fifty grand loans
Discussion
StevieBee said:
Exactly that. The administrator took over the company and brought it to an end. They deemed it was indeed insolvent and that we weren't pulling a fast one.
Our only creditor at the time was the bank for the remainder of the BBL. They didn't dispute anything and that was the end of that. The only outcome is that an otherwise solid company that I spent 20 odd years building folded as a result of the very institution that lent us the money asking for other money they gave us two years earlier, back, and abandoning projects that we had secured that would have enabled us to repay the loan in full.
Sounds very much like typical government thinking. Our only creditor at the time was the bank for the remainder of the BBL. They didn't dispute anything and that was the end of that. The only outcome is that an otherwise solid company that I spent 20 odd years building folded as a result of the very institution that lent us the money asking for other money they gave us two years earlier, back, and abandoning projects that we had secured that would have enabled us to repay the loan in full.
StevieBee said:
skwdenyer said:
JiggyJaggy said:
And what was the outcome in terms of you paying or not paying that?
Why would he pay? The ltd company was the borrower.Our only creditor at the time was the bank for the remainder of the BBL. They didn't dispute anything and that was the end of that. The only outcome is that an otherwise solid company that I spent 20 odd years building folded as a result of the very institution that lent us the money asking for other money they gave us two years earlier, back, and abandoning projects that we had secured that would have enabled us to repay the loan in full.
REDC (R&D tax credit)..
Or did HMRC effectively fold you without recourse./hindsight/foresight?
F****ing wrong on all accounts from them BTW.
Not good for HMG/bank/taxpayers eh!
Keep well
X
Inbetween the day job and half term for the kids..
I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
Deesee said:
Inbetween the day job and half term for the kids..
I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
First one I looked at was 1/2 a mile away from me and had a bounce back loan which bought nearly £50k of gold... didn't realise that neighbourhood was quite so exciting...I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
my favourite is: "disposed of £561,310 to the detriment of HMRC and other creditors by gambling causing his insolvency," quite incredible what some people do... though also a tinge of sadness that anyone is so caught by gambling...
akirk said:
Deesee said:
Inbetween the day job and half term for the kids..
I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
First one I looked at was 1/2 a mile away from me and had a bounce back loan which bought nearly £50k of gold... didn't realise that neighbourhood was quite so exciting...I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
my favourite is: "disposed of £561,310 to the detriment of HMRC and other creditors by gambling causing his insolvency," quite incredible what some people do... though also a tinge of sadness that anyone is so caught by gambling...
Brinks Matt!! Seriously where in your neighbourhood could you turn up and buy 50k of gold (I’ll assume your not in central london).
2nd one
No that’s owe the drug dealers money, here’s a ltd company, & yes you spent it all on gambling, “yeh I know u owe me 10 grand, but I really need 500k washing’ ,thanks.. lol…
Deesee said:
akirk said:
Deesee said:
Inbetween the day job and half term for the kids..
I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
First one I looked at was 1/2 a mile away from me and had a bounce back loan which bought nearly £50k of gold... didn't realise that neighbourhood was quite so exciting...I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
my favourite is: "disposed of £561,310 to the detriment of HMRC and other creditors by gambling causing his insolvency," quite incredible what some people do... though also a tinge of sadness that anyone is so caught by gambling...
Brinks Matt!! Seriously where in your neighbourhood could you turn up and buy 50k of gold (I’ll assume your not in central london).
2nd one
No that’s owe the drug dealers money, here’s a ltd company, & yes you spent it all on gambling, “yeh I know u owe me 10 grand, but I really need 500k washing’ ,thanks.. lol…
akirk said:
A respectable part of Bristol!
Money laundering centre of the West Country.
A. There’s a really reputable bullion dealer in Bristol, that deals with the population of Bristol.
B. Took the cash.. & deal with scrag ends with 50k cash in there pocket.. gave them a 20% discount and made a 40% margin..
Better than Brinks Matt. Totally legal..
Deesee said:
Money laundering centre of the West Country.
A. There’s a really reputable bullion dealer in Bristol, that deals with the population of Bristol.
B. Took the cash.. & deal with scrag ends with 50k cash in there pocket.. gave them a 20% discount and made a 40% margin..
Better than Brinks Matt. Totally legal..
Deesee said:
StevieBee said:
skwdenyer said:
JiggyJaggy said:
And what was the outcome in terms of you paying or not paying that?
Why would he pay? The ltd company was the borrower.Our only creditor at the time was the bank for the remainder of the BBL. They didn't dispute anything and that was the end of that. The only outcome is that an otherwise solid company that I spent 20 odd years building folded as a result of the very institution that lent us the money asking for other money they gave us two years earlier, back, and abandoning projects that we had secured that would have enabled us to repay the loan in full.
REDC (R&D tax credit)..
Or did HMRC effectively fold you without recourse./hindsight/foresight?
F****ing wrong on all accounts from them BTW.
Not good for HMG/bank/taxpayers eh!
Keep well
X
They were made aware.
StevieBee said:
Around a week after the administrator had been appointed, we received a letter from the bank that beggared belief. It was one rung away from saying "pay up toe-rag or we'll do your knee caps". It was by far, the most unprofessional correspondence I think I've ever seen and smacked of panic on behalf of the bank. I've got a copy somewhere and will scan and share if I can find it.
Post up the letter (redacted obvs).I can well believe that the bank wasn't looking forward to reclaiming the money from the government.
StevieBee said:
The company of which I was a Director succumbed to Covid with £30k of the £50k outstanding (ironically, what did for the company was the abandoning of two public sector projects that had previously been put on hold and HMRC clawing back a sizeable R&D tax credit that they erroneously awarded us two year priors all of which was not known to us at the point of application.... so a case of the government shooting themselves in the foot. Either way its demise was entirely genuine and unwelcome).
Around a week after the administrator had been appointed, we received a letter from the bank that beggared belief. It was one rung away from saying "pay up toe-rag or we'll do your knee caps". It was by far, the most unprofessional correspondence I think I've ever seen and smacked of panic on behalf of the bank. I've got a copy somewhere and will scan and share if I can find it.
How did HMRC erroneously award you an R&D credit? Do you mean you erroneously claimed it? Around a week after the administrator had been appointed, we received a letter from the bank that beggared belief. It was one rung away from saying "pay up toe-rag or we'll do your knee caps". It was by far, the most unprofessional correspondence I think I've ever seen and smacked of panic on behalf of the bank. I've got a copy somewhere and will scan and share if I can find it.
2 GKC said:
StevieBee said:
The company of which I was a Director succumbed to Covid with £30k of the £50k outstanding (ironically, what did for the company was the abandoning of two public sector projects that had previously been put on hold and HMRC clawing back a sizeable R&D tax credit that they erroneously awarded us two year priors all of which was not known to us at the point of application.... so a case of the government shooting themselves in the foot. Either way its demise was entirely genuine and unwelcome).
Around a week after the administrator had been appointed, we received a letter from the bank that beggared belief. It was one rung away from saying "pay up toe-rag or we'll do your knee caps". It was by far, the most unprofessional correspondence I think I've ever seen and smacked of panic on behalf of the bank. I've got a copy somewhere and will scan and share if I can find it.
How did HMRC erroneously award you an R&D credit? Do you mean you erroneously claimed it? Around a week after the administrator had been appointed, we received a letter from the bank that beggared belief. It was one rung away from saying "pay up toe-rag or we'll do your knee caps". It was by far, the most unprofessional correspondence I think I've ever seen and smacked of panic on behalf of the bank. I've got a copy somewhere and will scan and share if I can find it.
jammy-git said:
It's not uncommon for businesses to apply for R&D tax credits, for HMRC to accept the claim and pay out, only to then reject the claim further down the line and request the money back.
It would only be rejected if erroneously claimed. It seems a bit naive for a Director of a “sound” business to suggest it was erroneously awarded and its repayment was a major factor in bringing a business down. Deesee said:
akirk said:
Deesee said:
Inbetween the day job and half term for the kids..
I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
First one I looked at was 1/2 a mile away from me and had a bounce back loan which bought nearly £50k of gold... didn't realise that neighbourhood was quite so exciting...I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
my favourite is: "disposed of £561,310 to the detriment of HMRC and other creditors by gambling causing his insolvency," quite incredible what some people do... though also a tinge of sadness that anyone is so caught by gambling...
Brinks Matt!! Seriously where in your neighbourhood could you turn up and buy 50k of gold (I’ll assume your not in central london).
2nd one
No that’s owe the drug dealers money, here’s a ltd company, & yes you spent it all on gambling, “yeh I know u owe me 10 grand, but I really need 500k washing’ ,thanks.. lol…
jammy-git said:
2 GKC said:
StevieBee said:
The company of which I was a Director succumbed to Covid with £30k of the £50k outstanding (ironically, what did for the company was the abandoning of two public sector projects that had previously been put on hold and HMRC clawing back a sizeable R&D tax credit that they erroneously awarded us two year priors all of which was not known to us at the point of application.... so a case of the government shooting themselves in the foot. Either way its demise was entirely genuine and unwelcome).
Around a week after the administrator had been appointed, we received a letter from the bank that beggared belief. It was one rung away from saying "pay up toe-rag or we'll do your knee caps". It was by far, the most unprofessional correspondence I think I've ever seen and smacked of panic on behalf of the bank. I've got a copy somewhere and will scan and share if I can find it.
How did HMRC erroneously award you an R&D credit? Do you mean you erroneously claimed it? Around a week after the administrator had been appointed, we received a letter from the bank that beggared belief. It was one rung away from saying "pay up toe-rag or we'll do your knee caps". It was by far, the most unprofessional correspondence I think I've ever seen and smacked of panic on behalf of the bank. I've got a copy somewhere and will scan and share if I can find it.
I find it beyond incredible that HMRC adopt such a policy but they do.
Chrisgr31 said:
Deesee said:
akirk said:
Deesee said:
Inbetween the day job and half term for the kids..
I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
First one I looked at was 1/2 a mile away from me and had a bounce back loan which bought nearly £50k of gold... didn't realise that neighbourhood was quite so exciting...I’ve had a quick look at the insolvency services latest personal banning’s today..
Very little vat/carousel type fraud.. all bounce back loans buying gold etc.. no Rolexes but plenty of gambling debts repaid..
Here’s the list with the additional restrictions..
https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabas...
Gold purchase = settling drug debts
Gambling debts = settling drug debts
Enjoy!
my favourite is: "disposed of £561,310 to the detriment of HMRC and other creditors by gambling causing his insolvency," quite incredible what some people do... though also a tinge of sadness that anyone is so caught by gambling...
Brinks Matt!! Seriously where in your neighbourhood could you turn up and buy 50k of gold (I’ll assume your not in central london).
2nd one
No that’s owe the drug dealers money, here’s a ltd company, & yes you spent it all on gambling, “yeh I know u owe me 10 grand, but I really need 500k washing’ ,thanks.. lol…
StevieBee said:
I've documented my story on the R&D thread but this is exactly what happened. Approached by a reputable R&D rebate claim company - made an initial assessment and concluded that we qualified. They helped with the application which was successful. Unbeknown to us HMRC run a 'pay now - check later' policy and when they checked later, they found our claim was not valid. At no point verbally or anywhere written was there any mention of this being a possibility and we did potentially have a legal claim against the R&D rebate claim company but they went bust shortly before us.
I find it beyond incredible that HMRC adopt such a policy but they do.
Agreed. One business owner I know makes significant claims each year because his view is why not, if they have to repay any, so be it. It’s a free spin of the wheel. Bizarre.I find it beyond incredible that HMRC adopt such a policy but they do.
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