always on windows pc . . .

[khushy]

hi - in our business, we use a very old windows database system that is absolutely FANTASTIC (for us) and we have been using it for over 30 years without any issues at all.

It's called cardbox and is a client/server type of DB - www.cardbox.com

Currently I have put the "server" on a virtual machine with a hosting company and a dedicated IP address and it all works perfectly and is quick enouygh over fibre BB too - but having looked at how I use it - it could just be used on a local/in-office machine that seves our office for our business www.kapz.com as i rarely use it away from KAPZ HQ!

I want to build/buy a dedicated machine just for cardbox that is always on - ideally windows 11 pro and it doesn't have to be hugely powerful - the server program is only 5mb lol

I have set up the server to do 3 x backups every day to dropbox - so a meltdown is never an issue either.

Is a Geek type device good enough - what else do I need to consider for an always on machine - or am I barking up the wrong tree?

Budget up to £500'ish!

THANKS ALL!

[eeLee]

I would get any decent PC from a good brand and a model where you can get replacements should you need to (PSU, etc).
Running 24x7 is no issue, I have some machines in a riser that sit there on permanently. Cooling and airflow will be important.

[Dave.]

A couple of thin clients would be my suggestion, low power and available dirt cheap second hand.

Eg https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=hp+t630

(Second one as a backup just in case)

[eeLee]

Dave. said:

(Second one as a backup just in case)

Running a third of my load on a Dell Micro, I can agree with this. Especially this bit.....

A little fiddly to repair (been there, done that) and limited in upgrade possibilities.

But I would get one again. And again. I am actually hoping my employer replaces the current thin clients they have (erm, Dell Micros) and sell some....

[captain_cynic]

If it's already a virtual machine keep it that way and find a box that will run the VM.

Putting your business critical database on bare metal sitting in an office in an industrial estate in Swindon is really just asking for trouble. Fire, flood, thieves, power surges, Dorris being clumsy with coffee.

Keeping the database portable as a VMWare, Promox, et al. VM means you only have to get hardware that is compatible with the hypervisor rather than the software running on it.

[ThunderSpook]

I bought a 2nd hand HP Z600 about 8 years ago to run as my plex server. For the first 4 years it ran in the loft and now it sits under my desk. It runs 24/7/365 and has never so far let me down. I'm not a huge fan of HP equipment, but this has been brilliant. I'd imagine you'll get the same from a Dell Precision.

[khushy]

thanks for all the help and key points, which are really useful - I will look for a suitable mahine and report back :-)

have a great week!

[TimmyMallett]

captain_cynic said:

Putting your business critical database on bare metal sitting in an office in an industrial estate in Swindon is really just asking for trouble. Fire, flood, thieves, power surges, Dorris being clumsy with coffee.

it.

Do you live near Groundwell perchance, Nostradamus?

[captain_cynic]

TimmyMallett said:

captain_cynic said:

Putting your business critical database on bare metal sitting in an office in an industrial estate in Swindon is really just asking for trouble. Fire, flood, thieves, power surges, Dorris being clumsy with coffee.

it.

Do you live near Groundwell perchance, Nostradamus?

No... But I've had a lot of people come crying to me after their back office server hosting a critical application befell some accident.

Do you have anything to add or are just being stupid.

[Mr Pointy]

khushy said:

thanks for all the help and key points, which are really useful - I will look for a suitable mahine and report back :-)

have a great week!

Look at ebay refurbished Dell Optiplex Micro format PCs as well. You can get two 7070s for £400ish.

[megaphone]

It says Cardbox server can run on Linux, might be a better option than Windows.

[blackscooby]

Mr Pointy said:

Look at ebay refurbished Dell Optiplex Micro format PCs as well. You can get two 7070s for £400ish.

I run a Dell MFF 7070 as my home desktop, bought from eBay as a 2nd hand business machine. Stuck in some extra memory and a bigger m.2 SSD. It's a fab machine that doesn't cost the earth to run, just sits there 24x7. Rarely powered off.

[TimmyMallett]

captain_cynic said:

No... But I've had a lot of people come crying to me after their back office server hosting a critical application befell some accident.

Do you have anything to add or are just being stupid.

Wind it in, there was an explosion on a industrial estate in Swindon last night.

[biggiles]

I'd vote for putting it on a Proxmox server, keep it as a VM.

Any PC should be able to handle it, do you have any spare HP Elitedesk or Dell Optiplex machines around the office which are under 5 years old?

[Durzel]

captain_cynic said:

If it's already a virtual machine keep it that way and find a box that will run the VM.

Putting your business critical database on bare metal sitting in an office in an industrial estate in Swindon is really just asking for trouble. Fire, flood, thieves, power surges, Dorris being clumsy with coffee.

Keeping the database portable as a VMWare, Promox, et al. VM means you only have to get hardware that is compatible with the hypervisor rather than the software running on it.

Agere with this. If it's a VM already it makes no sense to regress to bare metal. Keep it as a VM and then its hardware agnostic.

The question as always with this stuff is - how long would the company survive if it died? And what would it do? Right now you're dependant on the SLA of the hosting company, which you're paying them for. When it's being run on a server hosted on your premises - you're the SLA.

A "normal" PC tends to have single points of failure - PSU, hard drives, etc. See above on "how long can this be down for".

Have you actually tested the backups you've done to Dropbox? What are they a backup of? Just the data or the VM itself?

[Mr Pointy]

Durzel said:

captain_cynic said:

If it's already a virtual machine keep it that way and find a box that will run the VM.

Putting your business critical database on bare metal sitting in an office in an industrial estate in Swindon is really just asking for trouble. Fire, flood, thieves, power surges, Dorris being clumsy with coffee.

Keeping the database portable as a VMWare, Promox, et al. VM means you only have to get hardware that is compatible with the hypervisor rather than the software running on it.

Agere with this. If it's a VM already it makes no sense to regress to bare metal. Keep it as a VM and then its hardware agnostic.

The question as always with this stuff is - how long would the company survive if it died? And what would it do? Right now you're dependant on the SLA of the hosting company, which you're paying them for. When it's being run on a server hosted on your premises - you're the SLA.

A "normal" PC tends to have single points of failure - PSU, hard drives, etc. See above on "how long can this be down for".

Have you actually tested the backups you've done to Dropbox? What are they a backup of? Just the data or the VM itself?

You can't say a VM at a hosting company is the best solution until you know the annual cost. It might be much more cost effective for the company to host it locally.

[Durzel]

Mr Pointy said:

Durzel said:

captain_cynic said:

If it's already a virtual machine keep it that way and find a box that will run the VM.

Putting your business critical database on bare metal sitting in an office in an industrial estate in Swindon is really just asking for trouble. Fire, flood, thieves, power surges, Dorris being clumsy with coffee.

Keeping the database portable as a VMWare, Promox, et al. VM means you only have to get hardware that is compatible with the hypervisor rather than the software running on it.

Agere with this. If it's a VM already it makes no sense to regress to bare metal. Keep it as a VM and then its hardware agnostic.

The question as always with this stuff is - how long would the company survive if it died? And what would it do? Right now you're dependant on the SLA of the hosting company, which you're paying them for. When it's being run on a server hosted on your premises - you're the SLA.

A "normal" PC tends to have single points of failure - PSU, hard drives, etc. See above on "how long can this be down for".

Have you actually tested the backups you've done to Dropbox? What are they a backup of? Just the data or the VM itself?

You can't say a VM at a hosting company is the best solution until you know the annual cost. It might be much more cost effective for the company to host it locally.

Where did I say staying with the hosting company was the best solution?

[captain_cynic]

Mr Pointy said:

You can't say a VM at a hosting company is the best solution until you know the annual cost. It might be much more cost effective for the company to host it locally.

I dont think myself or Durzel is advocating that. I'm certainly not given my experience. Declouding, departing from hosted providers due to costs, is very much a thing I deal with.

So I understand where the OP is coming from, doubly so in this day and age of belt tightening.

All we're saying is keep it virtual. Hardware is a weak point and virtualization is a good way to minimise your risk. Your DR (Disaster Recovery) plan goes from days to source hardware and set up the software before deploying the backups to just find anything that'll run ESXi/Promox/HyperV and deploy the last backup of the VM (and maybe then do a more recent DB backup)... Which can be done in under an hour by a skilled operator.