ok - macbook pro... decision almost made...
Discussion
Sorry guys to keep dragging this up. Almost nearly made choice of going for the macbookpro - it seems i can get the dualcore 1.83GHz for just under the price quoted for a new powerbook 15" with a few upgrades that i wanted (basically Aus$4000 for MBP instead of $4150 for PB).
This is ahead of me going to my local mac store when i next fly home on R&R next week. Have a few questions...
1) Given the price comparison above, is it worth going for the new macbook over powerbook. My love of new technology says yup, but my occasional sensible side wants to check it woudn't be better to stick with more tried and tested stuff for the time being, given that i am looking to buy in the next few weeks (i.e. i will be in the trial period!)...
2) Has anyone else bought one yet? Or am i out on my own here..?
3) My mac knowledge is very limited, i just fancy converting. Principally i need the computer for email, web access, web design (personal but i want it to look half decent!), word processing (office products) as i have to produce my masters thesis this year, digital camera stuff etc etc. What packages do i need to get? According to the Aus Apple site i should get with the machine Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger (Spotlight search technology, handy Dashboard widgets etc), Safari 2, Mail 2, Address Book 4, iChat AV 3, iCal 2, Font Book 2, DVD Player 4.5, Preview 3, Xcode 2, iLife ’06, iWork ’06 Trial, Front Row & Photo Booth.
Any more needed?
That all seems pretty exetensive, but like i say i am an apple virgin. Does it come with all i need or shall i have to buy extra packages to do what i want with it? I would like a bit of insider knowledge before i head off to the store so i can see some of it in action. I think i will purchase the MS Office version for it - i think i can get a discount for being a masters student...
4) Will the web design packages compare well with ones done on a windows computer? I think my mate uses MS Frontpage? We share the website now but he has been updating it all. When i get the new machine i would becontributing to them again. Will changing between two hardware formatscause it any drama? Web design (at our basic level) all seems WYSIWYG programming so i am guessing it should be ok. I used to use dreamweaver on my old PC and there isn't too many problems between that and MSFP - although i think dreamweaver can run on both PC and Mac?
5) with an intel chip would it emulate any MS based applications..? Its not too important, but possibly as part of my thesis i may have to use some 3D modelling packages that i know run on windows, but which at least one doesn't run on macs (i asked the designer) and the others i am not sure about. Its not definite, and probably i would be able to get around it by using computers at work etc, so its not essential, but this is the only reason i have found not to change over. I reckon for all other things a mac would do me top notch. I was wondering if it had intel chip, whether at some point there might be a cross-over... Just curious really.
Thanks a lot for the assistance - just trying to make the big convert as less painful as possible!
>> Edited by Buffalo on Saturday 21st January 03:36
This is ahead of me going to my local mac store when i next fly home on R&R next week. Have a few questions...
1) Given the price comparison above, is it worth going for the new macbook over powerbook. My love of new technology says yup, but my occasional sensible side wants to check it woudn't be better to stick with more tried and tested stuff for the time being, given that i am looking to buy in the next few weeks (i.e. i will be in the trial period!)...
2) Has anyone else bought one yet? Or am i out on my own here..?
3) My mac knowledge is very limited, i just fancy converting. Principally i need the computer for email, web access, web design (personal but i want it to look half decent!), word processing (office products) as i have to produce my masters thesis this year, digital camera stuff etc etc. What packages do i need to get? According to the Aus Apple site i should get with the machine Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger (Spotlight search technology, handy Dashboard widgets etc), Safari 2, Mail 2, Address Book 4, iChat AV 3, iCal 2, Font Book 2, DVD Player 4.5, Preview 3, Xcode 2, iLife ’06, iWork ’06 Trial, Front Row & Photo Booth.
Any more needed?
That all seems pretty exetensive, but like i say i am an apple virgin. Does it come with all i need or shall i have to buy extra packages to do what i want with it? I would like a bit of insider knowledge before i head off to the store so i can see some of it in action. I think i will purchase the MS Office version for it - i think i can get a discount for being a masters student... 4) Will the web design packages compare well with ones done on a windows computer? I think my mate uses MS Frontpage? We share the website now but he has been updating it all. When i get the new machine i would becontributing to them again. Will changing between two hardware formatscause it any drama? Web design (at our basic level) all seems WYSIWYG programming so i am guessing it should be ok. I used to use dreamweaver on my old PC and there isn't too many problems between that and MSFP - although i think dreamweaver can run on both PC and Mac?
5) with an intel chip would it emulate any MS based applications..? Its not too important, but possibly as part of my thesis i may have to use some 3D modelling packages that i know run on windows, but which at least one doesn't run on macs (i asked the designer) and the others i am not sure about. Its not definite, and probably i would be able to get around it by using computers at work etc, so its not essential, but this is the only reason i have found not to change over. I reckon for all other things a mac would do me top notch. I was wondering if it had intel chip, whether at some point there might be a cross-over... Just curious really.
Thanks a lot for the assistance - just trying to make the big convert as less painful as possible!
>> Edited by Buffalo on Saturday 21st January 03:36
1) Get the MacBook. Whilst Apple's 4x faster may be optimistic it is much much faster!
2) I ordered mine the second the store was back up (i.e. as soon as they were announced).
3) If you need Office stuff (Word, Excel etc) you will need to buy MS Office (for the Mac). Text Edit (think Wordpad but good) can open Word documents and gets better every release of OSX but it's not word. It can do basic word processing (up to tables). If you want to do web work you can either write all the HTML buy hand, rely on iWeb or buy something more professional.
iWeb is OK but a bit basic. You are totally constrained to Apples templates. If you want something more powerful Dreamweaver is available (at a cost).
4) Frontpage is not available but Dreamweaver is.
5) It's not as simple as the CPU. Windows is Windows because of the APIs that MicroSoft supply. OSX does not supply these APIs so Windows programs cannot run. There are companies who produce products that allow Windows programs to run on Linux on Intel and they are working on porting their products to OSX. Even with this native programs are better as Windows programs do not work like OSX ones.
2) I ordered mine the second the store was back up (i.e. as soon as they were announced).
3) If you need Office stuff (Word, Excel etc) you will need to buy MS Office (for the Mac). Text Edit (think Wordpad but good) can open Word documents and gets better every release of OSX but it's not word. It can do basic word processing (up to tables). If you want to do web work you can either write all the HTML buy hand, rely on iWeb or buy something more professional.
iWeb is OK but a bit basic. You are totally constrained to Apples templates. If you want something more powerful Dreamweaver is available (at a cost).
4) Frontpage is not available but Dreamweaver is.
5) It's not as simple as the CPU. Windows is Windows because of the APIs that MicroSoft supply. OSX does not supply these APIs so Windows programs cannot run. There are companies who produce products that allow Windows programs to run on Linux on Intel and they are working on porting their products to OSX. Even with this native programs are better as Windows programs do not work like OSX ones.
1). I'd buy the new one every time. The only possible issue for me would be how it performs running non native apps under rosetta, although this would only be temporally as software was updated to native. In some ways you will be a guinea pig and there will be a few teething problems but, hopefully, short lived as the software and hardware vendors upgrade drivers etc. to run on Intel macs.
2). I will be buying one.... as soon as some professional apps I use can run native.
3). The Apple apps are all very useful straight out of the box. I would imagine the iLife suite will be very useful to you without buying any other packages. They all work well together, and although not 'professional are surprisingly good. Miles better than anything MS has to offer. If you get Office (which is apparently even better than the windoze version) you will be covered for everything. You can also run OpenOffice under X11, which is free and compatible with MS Office. www.openoffice.org
4). iLife now has iWeb which I'm sure will produce very nice results but it's not Dreamweaver. Then again Frontpage isn't either. I don't know how they would compare. Designing web pages is the same whether you do it on PC or Mac, as long as you adhere to the rules. Dreamweaver is available for Mac.
5). Good question. I don't know the answer. You can run virtual PC ( it's not supported on the Intel macs... yet) on a mac but for 3D it would be painfully slow anyway. There is all sorts of talk about possibly installing Windows on an Intel mac, also visa versa, installing OSX on a PC, but it's all just talk... at the moment. However, why you would want any MS apps (apart from Office maybe) on you mac is another question. If you really want MS apps buy a PC. Studio Max is one of the most popular 3D apps unavailable to Mac. Whether Apples move to Intel will make it easier to port the app will remain to be seen. However, there are plenty of other equally capable 3D apps for the Mac i.e. Cinema 4D or Maya.
A useful review here:
www.macintouch.com/imacintel/review.html
HTH
2). I will be buying one.... as soon as some professional apps I use can run native.
3). The Apple apps are all very useful straight out of the box. I would imagine the iLife suite will be very useful to you without buying any other packages. They all work well together, and although not 'professional are surprisingly good. Miles better than anything MS has to offer. If you get Office (which is apparently even better than the windoze version) you will be covered for everything. You can also run OpenOffice under X11, which is free and compatible with MS Office. www.openoffice.org
4). iLife now has iWeb which I'm sure will produce very nice results but it's not Dreamweaver. Then again Frontpage isn't either. I don't know how they would compare. Designing web pages is the same whether you do it on PC or Mac, as long as you adhere to the rules. Dreamweaver is available for Mac.
5). Good question. I don't know the answer. You can run virtual PC ( it's not supported on the Intel macs... yet) on a mac but for 3D it would be painfully slow anyway. There is all sorts of talk about possibly installing Windows on an Intel mac, also visa versa, installing OSX on a PC, but it's all just talk... at the moment. However, why you would want any MS apps (apart from Office maybe) on you mac is another question. If you really want MS apps buy a PC. Studio Max is one of the most popular 3D apps unavailable to Mac. Whether Apples move to Intel will make it easier to port the app will remain to be seen. However, there are plenty of other equally capable 3D apps for the Mac i.e. Cinema 4D or Maya.
A useful review here:
www.macintouch.com/imacintel/review.html
HTH
Buffalo said:
Yeah, cheers fellas, useful review too (although i must confess to not fully getting it all, but only really becaue i am unfamiliar with apples)...
Will be going to the local store this coming week so will post up what goes on!
Thanks again Buff
If you are going to try one out/see what it looks like don't waste your time. Stores don't have them yet (not even demo units) and won't till mid feb.
In terms of software:
- Web authoring: it sounds like you should get Dreamweaver (unless the related Contribute would suit your needs). iWeb is too restrictive and basic at the moment.
- Office apps: It is probably worth getting these. However Keynote (part of iWork) is a very good alternative to PowerPoint, and it can import and export (though losing some of its better features) to PowerPoint. Pages (the other part of iWork) is compatible with Word, but more based on DTP, and generally regarded as not yet fully developed. However it might be worth playing with it.
- Internet use: you are well covered with Mail, Safari, and built-in FTP. You could also use Firefox/Thunderbird, grab a late copy of IE (now discontinued), and you get Entourage email in Office, if you want alternatives. I would get the browser alternatives, as some MS-centric sites (particularly banks, for some reason), are not very Mac-friendly, and it's useful to have an alternative on hand (the odds are one of the three will give you a workaround).
- Utilities: OSX is pretty good at repairing itself. it's probably not worth a Norton package. CD/DVD authoring is a doddle.
- Security: OSX has a good firewall. You might want to get AntiVirus though to date there still hasn't been a single viable OSX virus. Do make use of the Software Update function, but a good tip is to wait a week after an update is posted - occasionally they screw up.
- Hardware support: Generally pretty good. But check for special drivers for you printer/scanner/PDA before you buy. Most major brands (HP, Epson, Canon) support OSX well. A lot of other items are supported by Apple's own drivers.
- Graphics: Default is of course Photoshop/illustrator, of you really need it, or P'Shop Elements. iPhoto can do some work. But a very useful extra is Graphic Converter (lemkesoft.com, $30 shareware cost removes a 30" startup delay). It can do all the basics (crop, resize, change resolution, plus pen tools, fill, magic wand) and it can save into almost any graphics format ever - useful if you urgently need an image for your Commodore 64.
For more specialist stuff, try Apple.com, and also versiontracker.com. You may find a Mac version, and often there is a compatible alternative (e.g. you can't get MS Access, mainly because Filemaker has always been a better app).
- Web authoring: it sounds like you should get Dreamweaver (unless the related Contribute would suit your needs). iWeb is too restrictive and basic at the moment.
- Office apps: It is probably worth getting these. However Keynote (part of iWork) is a very good alternative to PowerPoint, and it can import and export (though losing some of its better features) to PowerPoint. Pages (the other part of iWork) is compatible with Word, but more based on DTP, and generally regarded as not yet fully developed. However it might be worth playing with it.
- Internet use: you are well covered with Mail, Safari, and built-in FTP. You could also use Firefox/Thunderbird, grab a late copy of IE (now discontinued), and you get Entourage email in Office, if you want alternatives. I would get the browser alternatives, as some MS-centric sites (particularly banks, for some reason), are not very Mac-friendly, and it's useful to have an alternative on hand (the odds are one of the three will give you a workaround).
- Utilities: OSX is pretty good at repairing itself. it's probably not worth a Norton package. CD/DVD authoring is a doddle.
- Security: OSX has a good firewall. You might want to get AntiVirus though to date there still hasn't been a single viable OSX virus. Do make use of the Software Update function, but a good tip is to wait a week after an update is posted - occasionally they screw up.
- Hardware support: Generally pretty good. But check for special drivers for you printer/scanner/PDA before you buy. Most major brands (HP, Epson, Canon) support OSX well. A lot of other items are supported by Apple's own drivers.
- Graphics: Default is of course Photoshop/illustrator, of you really need it, or P'Shop Elements. iPhoto can do some work. But a very useful extra is Graphic Converter (lemkesoft.com, $30 shareware cost removes a 30" startup delay). It can do all the basics (crop, resize, change resolution, plus pen tools, fill, magic wand) and it can save into almost any graphics format ever - useful if you urgently need an image for your Commodore 64.
For more specialist stuff, try Apple.com, and also versiontracker.com. You may find a Mac version, and often there is a compatible alternative (e.g. you can't get MS Access, mainly because Filemaker has always been a better app).
When it comes to running Windows on a MacTel machine, you might want to look at this WinTel 2.0.1 which has just been released. I don't know it that well, but it has been optimised for the Intel chips. At $25 (assuming you have a spare Windows CD available), it wouldn't seem a huge risk.
>> Edited by HiRich on Tuesday 24th January 17:15
>> Edited by HiRich on Tuesday 24th January 17:15
Yup as posted there were no new MBPs for me to trial. Aparently their test bed comes in this monday but i am back on site until well into next week (
). Still i spec'd up the machine including modems, basic software, warranty etc. Incidently on the quotation they gave me the top spec MBP for the lower spec price - i wonder if they'll honour that when i actually buy 
Looking at end of Feb/early March for purchase, but pretty much set on this model now, so looking forward. Quite excited actually. Should be able to get discount due to student bits too, plus fringe tax benefits, which will be a welcome bonus to the package!
Cheers all for assistance, but i suspect you're not all free yet!
). Still i spec'd up the machine including modems, basic software, warranty etc. Incidently on the quotation they gave me the top spec MBP for the lower spec price - i wonder if they'll honour that when i actually buy Looking at end of Feb/early March for purchase, but pretty much set on this model now, so looking forward. Quite excited actually. Should be able to get discount due to student bits too, plus fringe tax benefits, which will be a welcome bonus to the package!
Cheers all for assistance, but i suspect you're not all free yet!
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