Don't go with .........
Discussion
Just a heads up for anyone thinking of moving to "mail me for more info" and their 8Mbps service - there isn't one. Or at least it doesn't work. You'll be lucky to get 400Kbps out of it and the packet loss makes some web sites completely fail to load. They are apparently trying to fix it but it's been like this for quite a while it seems. I was sold their 8Mbps service only to find I got as little as 20Kbps and was lucky to better 400Kbps.
You have been warned!
please dont violate the "No Naming and Shaming policy"
thankyou
>> Edited by on Saturday 11th February 11:58
You have been warned!
please dont violate the "No Naming and Shaming policy"
thankyou
>> Edited by on Saturday 11th February 11:58
Hi Greg,
Two points for you:
1. You shouldn't naming and shaming on the forums, as it's against the rules.
3. ADSL is rate-adaptive. Most people are not expected to understand this, but it is pretty simple to understand. The further you are from the exchande the more loss you will get. So even though you have been sold an 8Mb/sec service, you may not get the full whack. Even if you are sat on the exchange you still not get the full service, as it is NOT as the crow flies (obviously cables can't be laid in a straight line all the time). Additionally, your ADSL provider will have said in the T+Cs that this is the case, and you are stuck unless you have a get out clause.
Its a common misconception that if your ISP says that you can get 8mB/sec (or whatever) that that is the speed that you will receive.
When I have been installing high speed connections and wireless high speed connections, everything is SUBJECT TO SURVEY, i.e you might get 8Mb/sec but don't be surprised if you don't.
Obviously ADSL ISPs can't do this, so they keep this bit quiet, trying to get the average Joe Bloggs who doesn't understand this.
The ADSL service you receive is also the same WHICHEVER ISP you go with, as it is a resold BT Wholesale product (unless you live in an area where you may receive services from an ISP who has Local Loop Unbundled your exchange). Ultimately whoever you buy it from, the end result will be the same.
Hopefully this helps clear up your ADSL understanding.
Neil
Two points for you:
1. You shouldn't naming and shaming on the forums, as it's against the rules.
3. ADSL is rate-adaptive. Most people are not expected to understand this, but it is pretty simple to understand. The further you are from the exchande the more loss you will get. So even though you have been sold an 8Mb/sec service, you may not get the full whack. Even if you are sat on the exchange you still not get the full service, as it is NOT as the crow flies (obviously cables can't be laid in a straight line all the time). Additionally, your ADSL provider will have said in the T+Cs that this is the case, and you are stuck unless you have a get out clause.
Its a common misconception that if your ISP says that you can get 8mB/sec (or whatever) that that is the speed that you will receive.
When I have been installing high speed connections and wireless high speed connections, everything is SUBJECT TO SURVEY, i.e you might get 8Mb/sec but don't be surprised if you don't.
Obviously ADSL ISPs can't do this, so they keep this bit quiet, trying to get the average Joe Bloggs who doesn't understand this.
The ADSL service you receive is also the same WHICHEVER ISP you go with, as it is a resold BT Wholesale product (unless you live in an area where you may receive services from an ISP who has Local Loop Unbundled your exchange). Ultimately whoever you buy it from, the end result will be the same.
Hopefully this helps clear up your ADSL understanding.
Neil
Most suppliers provide a free availability checking service which predicts the maximum line speed from the phone number and post code, what speed does this give you? I'd expect them to do a line check while provisioning the service, and if your line doesn't support the full rate you asked for then I'd expect them to offer you the highest speed that it can actually support. Surely their entry level package isn't 8MB?
On the other hand it may be a problem at your end caused by poor/missing filters, poor quality phone cable (the standard cheap ally phone cables aren't much good for this sort of thing, you need copper cables), IDC connectors not fitted properly etc. Worth reducing your phone system to the simplest possible setup and see if it works any better. Also I'm assuming that it is the broadband that is the limiting factor and not a wireless network hanging on by its fingernails. If you're using wireless then test it again with a wired connection.
On the other hand it may be a problem at your end caused by poor/missing filters, poor quality phone cable (the standard cheap ally phone cables aren't much good for this sort of thing, you need copper cables), IDC connectors not fitted properly etc. Worth reducing your phone system to the simplest possible setup and see if it works any better. Also I'm assuming that it is the broadband that is the limiting factor and not a wireless network hanging on by its fingernails. If you're using wireless then test it again with a wired connection.
First, apologies for the naming and shaming - I did not realise this was forbidden.
Neil, whilst I appreciate your generous efforts to "clear up my ADSL understanding", this is not a simple case of "idiot punter doesn't realise that you can't get 8Mbps everywhere". I understand the concepts involved, especially since I work in IT. I know it's distance dependant and I know what contention ratios are and I know it depends on a survey. The facts are that I was PROMISED 8Mbps, on the basis that I would get 4x whatever my current speed was, which was a rock solid 2Mbps. Being cynical and experienced, I did grill the sales person for about 5 minutes on this but he assured me that the way RADSL worked I would get 4x whatever I was currently able to get on ADSL. And it is an LLU exchange, so it's not the same for all ISPs. You might have guessed that LLU was involved since we're talking about 8Mbps. The issue is a known issue with ***'s links to the Easynet LLU network.
Secondly, the ISP in question has well-known technical issues with their LLU based service which means that for months now existing customers have had a near-useless service (terrible packet loss and bandwidth as low as 40Kbps). My main bone of contention is that they should not be taking new orders for a service they KNOW they cannot provide due to technical issues which will hopefully be resolved when they switch to Juniper kit.
And then to add insult to injury, having sold me something they knew they could not deliver, they don't even have the common courtesy of refunding the money I have already paid them. This beggars belief - how can you sell something you cannot provide and then refuse to give someone their money back??
>> Edited by gregwatson on Sunday 12th February 10:34
Neil, whilst I appreciate your generous efforts to "clear up my ADSL understanding", this is not a simple case of "idiot punter doesn't realise that you can't get 8Mbps everywhere". I understand the concepts involved, especially since I work in IT. I know it's distance dependant and I know what contention ratios are and I know it depends on a survey. The facts are that I was PROMISED 8Mbps, on the basis that I would get 4x whatever my current speed was, which was a rock solid 2Mbps. Being cynical and experienced, I did grill the sales person for about 5 minutes on this but he assured me that the way RADSL worked I would get 4x whatever I was currently able to get on ADSL. And it is an LLU exchange, so it's not the same for all ISPs. You might have guessed that LLU was involved since we're talking about 8Mbps. The issue is a known issue with ***'s links to the Easynet LLU network.
Secondly, the ISP in question has well-known technical issues with their LLU based service which means that for months now existing customers have had a near-useless service (terrible packet loss and bandwidth as low as 40Kbps). My main bone of contention is that they should not be taking new orders for a service they KNOW they cannot provide due to technical issues which will hopefully be resolved when they switch to Juniper kit.
And then to add insult to injury, having sold me something they knew they could not deliver, they don't even have the common courtesy of refunding the money I have already paid them. This beggars belief - how can you sell something you cannot provide and then refuse to give someone their money back??
>> Edited by gregwatson on Sunday 12th February 10:34
Yes I believe one of the big names is currently going through the courts.
Thing that irritates me is that I was very sceptical regarding the 8Mbps claims which is why I discussed it at length with the ISP before going ahead. And truth be told, if I had only ended up with 5 or 6 meg I'd probably have been satisfied. But they have major problems with their network that means LLU customers (like me) get speeds as low as 50Kbps!!!
It's just not right to sell someone something that you know doesn't work - and even worse to refuse to refund their money.
Thing that irritates me is that I was very sceptical regarding the 8Mbps claims which is why I discussed it at length with the ISP before going ahead. And truth be told, if I had only ended up with 5 or 6 meg I'd probably have been satisfied. But they have major problems with their network that means LLU customers (like me) get speeds as low as 50Kbps!!!
It's just not right to sell someone something that you know doesn't work - and even worse to refuse to refund their money.
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