Two Way Radio/PMR?
Discussion
Chaps,
Looking to equip team PH with some reasonable walkie talkies for our forthcoming road trip to Le Mans. I've had a quick look on Amazon and there doesn't seem to be much choice to be had.
Anyone got any recommendations of either specific models/brands to go for (or avoid!) and a reputable online shop?
Cheers
Stuart
Looking to equip team PH with some reasonable walkie talkies for our forthcoming road trip to Le Mans. I've had a quick look on Amazon and there doesn't seem to be much choice to be had.
Anyone got any recommendations of either specific models/brands to go for (or avoid!) and a reputable online shop?
Cheers
Stuart
try Maplin http://www.maplin.co.uk/Search.aspx?criteria=pmr&a...
I have a pair of the midland G7s and they do the job rather well, and have a socket for a handsfree kit
I have a pair of the midland G7s and they do the job rather well, and have a socket for a handsfree kit
I've tried PMR for car convoys and events. It works really well in the field but if you lose sight of one car you've pretty much lost radio, also it is not easy to use.
What you want is CB radio. Range is 5 miles even with a small antenna, 10 with a long one. Audio quality is much better and it has 38 channels of silence available for you to use. It is much much better for road trips.
As an added bonus you can buy the sets for peanuts on ebay.
What you want is CB radio. Range is 5 miles even with a small antenna, 10 with a long one. Audio quality is much better and it has 38 channels of silence available for you to use. It is much much better for road trips.
As an added bonus you can buy the sets for peanuts on ebay.
We use these around the farm. They work from inside the Land Rover back to the house about 1.5 miles away, so should be fine for a road trip I would have thought. They are one of the most powerful sets you can buy in the UK and are good for a fair few miles. But, if you venture onto eBay, you can pick up sets which are sent from America and go up to around 30km range. Not strictly legal to use here, but nobody will notice if you do...
Edited by wiffmaster on Sunday 26th April 20:25
I've got these, although not from Maplin - I got them for £30 from somewhere. They seem to be pretty good for the price and they're easy to use.
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=21793...
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=21793...
Note that (I think) the "privacy codes" are CTCSS/DCS which act as filters - say you're on channel 2 without a code in use, you hear all transmissions on channel 2. Let's say you enable CTCSS code 1. Now, you can only hear transmissions from other people using channel 2, code 1 so you filter out all the other traffic on that channel. However, anyone not applying a code to channel 2 can still hear you. Second, it doesn't get around the problem of a congested channel insofar as a channel is still a single frequency, so 2 people can't talk at the same time. So if your group is on channel 2 and another group of people are on channel 2, even if the 2 groups are using different privacy codes, you could miss transmissions from your group if the other group are transmitting at the same time.
One way around this is to get radios that have the LPD band as well as PMR. PMR only has 8 channels, LPD has 69. LPD is not legal to use in the UK, but is in Europe. You can still legally buy the handsets in the UK. I believe the frequency (433Mhz) is used for car alarm remotes, garage door openers, that kind of thing but the power is so low that you're unlikely to cause issues. The downside of LPD is that power is limited to 10mW so range is likely to be less than with PMR.
So if you want range: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=22754... - these are 500mW which is the max permitted on PMR. However if range isn't an issue but channel crowding is, get combined PMR/LPD - I recommend these as I have some: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=47345 - these also transmit at 500mW on PMR but for some reason the manufacturers only claim 5km range whereas the Motorola ones claim 10km. Also the Motorolas have both CTCSS and DCS codes, the Midland ones only have CTCSS codes.
One way around this is to get radios that have the LPD band as well as PMR. PMR only has 8 channels, LPD has 69. LPD is not legal to use in the UK, but is in Europe. You can still legally buy the handsets in the UK. I believe the frequency (433Mhz) is used for car alarm remotes, garage door openers, that kind of thing but the power is so low that you're unlikely to cause issues. The downside of LPD is that power is limited to 10mW so range is likely to be less than with PMR.
So if you want range: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=22754... - these are 500mW which is the max permitted on PMR. However if range isn't an issue but channel crowding is, get combined PMR/LPD - I recommend these as I have some: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=47345 - these also transmit at 500mW on PMR but for some reason the manufacturers only claim 5km range whereas the Motorola ones claim 10km. Also the Motorolas have both CTCSS and DCS codes, the Midland ones only have CTCSS codes.
munky said:
Note that (I think) the "privacy codes" are CTCSS/DCS which act as filters - say you're on channel 2 without a code in use, you hear all transmissions on channel 2. Let's say you enable CTCSS code 1. Now, you can only hear transmissions from other people using channel 2, code 1 so you filter out all the other traffic on that channel. However, anyone not applying a code to channel 2 can still hear you. Second, it doesn't get around the problem of a congested channel insofar as a channel is still a single frequency, so 2 people can't talk at the same time. So if your group is on channel 2 and another group of people are on channel 2, even if the 2 groups are using different privacy codes, you could miss transmissions from your group if the other group are transmitting at the same time.
One way around this is to get radios that have the LPD band as well as PMR. PMR only has 8 channels, LPD has 69. LPD is not legal to use in the UK, but is in Europe. You can still legally buy the handsets in the UK. I believe the frequency (433Mhz) is used for car alarm remotes, garage door openers, that kind of thing but the power is so low that you're unlikely to cause issues. The downside of LPD is that power is limited to 10mW so range is likely to be less than with PMR.
So if you want range: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=22754... - these are 500mW which is the max permitted on PMR. However if range isn't an issue but channel crowding is, get combined PMR/LPD - I recommend these as I have some: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=47345 - these also transmit at 500mW on PMR but for some reason the manufacturers only claim 5km range whereas the Motorola ones claim 10km. Also the Motorolas have both CTCSS and DCS codes, the Midland ones only have CTCSS codes.
Very helpful post. Thanks Munky One way around this is to get radios that have the LPD band as well as PMR. PMR only has 8 channels, LPD has 69. LPD is not legal to use in the UK, but is in Europe. You can still legally buy the handsets in the UK. I believe the frequency (433Mhz) is used for car alarm remotes, garage door openers, that kind of thing but the power is so low that you're unlikely to cause issues. The downside of LPD is that power is limited to 10mW so range is likely to be less than with PMR.
So if you want range: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=22754... - these are 500mW which is the max permitted on PMR. However if range isn't an issue but channel crowding is, get combined PMR/LPD - I recommend these as I have some: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=47345 - these also transmit at 500mW on PMR but for some reason the manufacturers only claim 5km range whereas the Motorola ones claim 10km. Also the Motorolas have both CTCSS and DCS codes, the Midland ones only have CTCSS codes.
Licence Free in the UK means you're stuck with CB or PMR. I don't know the EU rules for CB but I know PMR is accepted in most of the EU. The rules for manufacturers making PMR means the units are stuck with irreplaceable antenna (there are some where the letter of the law means you can actually change the antenna but not many), and they're stuck at 0.5 Watts which has the penetrating power in a city of a water pistol through a nuclear bunker.
I use PMR because we go throughout Western Europe and, well we didn't look into CB (we probably should have). My choice is the Vertex VX146 because these can be boosted with PC software to 5 Watts. This is illegal but so is speeding.
At 5 Watts these have much better penetration. In convoy in suburbia, you can expect a good solid mile. In open country we have tested to 21 miles (line of sight).
Two problems with the Vx146:
1. They are no longer made (but pop up on Ebay from time to time)
2. The software you need is a hack only (which I have and would happily email to anyone).
You'll need a CT42 cable which is freely available on Ebay or other channels.
If I'm honest and we were starting again with our purchases, I'd look a bit more into CB. There's a lot more that can be done to achieve range/penetration with CB.
I use PMR because we go throughout Western Europe and, well we didn't look into CB (we probably should have). My choice is the Vertex VX146 because these can be boosted with PC software to 5 Watts. This is illegal but so is speeding.
At 5 Watts these have much better penetration. In convoy in suburbia, you can expect a good solid mile. In open country we have tested to 21 miles (line of sight).
Two problems with the Vx146:
1. They are no longer made (but pop up on Ebay from time to time)
2. The software you need is a hack only (which I have and would happily email to anyone).
You'll need a CT42 cable which is freely available on Ebay or other channels.
If I'm honest and we were starting again with our purchases, I'd look a bit more into CB. There's a lot more that can be done to achieve range/penetration with CB.
Good advice by Watchman. To be honest if you're going to be in a convoy then PMR may well do all you need, hopefully you won't all be that far apart. If you go the CB route then you might all need external antennae unless you're using handhelds, in which case you'll not get that much more range than PMR, power doesn't equal range. PMR is the cheapest route, you'll also be able to use them while at Le Mans.
I'm a licensed amateur and use a Yaesu VX-8D when mobile, but use some Binatone Action 950s with my unlicensed other half and find them great, the batteries seem to last forever too.
I'm a licensed amateur and use a Yaesu VX-8D when mobile, but use some Binatone Action 950s with my unlicensed other half and find them great, the batteries seem to last forever too.
If all things are equal, and you increase power then you will increase range but only for the transmitting radio. Unless everyone in your convoy has a similarly boosted radio, then the communication will become a bit one-sided as you increase the distance between cars.
This is why CB might be inherently a better solution - you can experiment with longer antenna. I used to tour with a group of Se7ens so mounting an antenna on the rollbar would have been easy. With the group of TVRs I subsequently toured with, this would have been a problem... nowhere to mount an external antenna - not even a magnetic base would help with a fibreglass shell.
This is why CB might be inherently a better solution - you can experiment with longer antenna. I used to tour with a group of Se7ens so mounting an antenna on the rollbar would have been easy. With the group of TVRs I subsequently toured with, this would have been a problem... nowhere to mount an external antenna - not even a magnetic base would help with a fibreglass shell.
Quick google says they have the vertex in stock
http://www.apexradio.co.uk/vertex-standard-vx-146-...
http://www.apexradio.co.uk/vertex-standard-vx-146-...
£149..!! 
I only paid £120 for mine when they were still in production.
Ebay for £89.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vertex-Standard-VX-146-U...
... although you can get them for as little as £15 on Ebay (I have 5 now - bought 4 off Ebay never paying more that £30 for any of them).
I only paid £120 for mine when they were still in production.Ebay for £89.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vertex-Standard-VX-146-U...
... although you can get them for as little as £15 on Ebay (I have 5 now - bought 4 off Ebay never paying more that £30 for any of them).
munky said:
try Maplin http://www.maplin.co.uk/Search.aspx?criteria=pmr&a...
I have a pair of the midland G7s and they do the job rather well, and have a socket for a handsfree kit
Seconded... There are some "Tweeks" you can do too (but dont tell anyone... to up the power to 4 watts and also open the LPD Channels) ... I have a pair of the midland G7s and they do the job rather well, and have a socket for a handsfree kit
(Message me if you want to know how)Ive tested the Ranges on both LPD and PMR on open countryside and you can get about 2-4 miles with PMR and maybe 4/5 with LPD. this drops off sharply though if there are hills around you
In the car, 1/2 mile is about the norm
Edited by JVaughan on Wednesday 28th August 11:29
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