156 sportwagons jtd v 2.0ts
Discussion
Right, this is getting a bit frustrating. We are having problems finding a decent 2.4jtd at a decent price. I might therefore go the 2.0ts route as it would seem we should get more choice/better car.
What sort of mpg is the 2.0ts likely to give in daily use? Am I going to be frustrated with the lack of torque?
I ran some sums based on 12000 miles per year, the jtd giving 45mpg (which I think dougal or wombat rick thought was an easy target) and 32 mpg for the petrol, this last figure was a complete guess so I need some clarification.
The difference in fuel cost is about £400 per year.
D
What sort of mpg is the 2.0ts likely to give in daily use? Am I going to be frustrated with the lack of torque?
I ran some sums based on 12000 miles per year, the jtd giving 45mpg (which I think dougal or wombat rick thought was an easy target) and 32 mpg for the petrol, this last figure was a complete guess so I need some clarification.
The difference in fuel cost is about £400 per year.
D
A lot of people say the 2.0TS is the best all round 156 as it has enough ooomph to be fun but is still light and nimble to be a good handler. You will only find the lack of torque frustrating if you drive like my Mum. If you have 4,000 on the clock before you want to overtake it will be fine, and it NEEDS to go to 7,000.
Lots.
It sounds good too. It is a more delicate engine than the relatively simple single overhead cam 2 valve JTD, so you need to make sure cambelt, balancer belt, pulleys and variator have all been changed - and keep changing them every 3 years or 36,000 miles. £400 or so. All 8 plugs at least every 60,000 miles.
Put it this way. When I drive the wife's 2.0 145QV, it's still fun and the rush as you come "on the cam" at 4,500 and the second go again at 6,000 is great. But the JTD is much more relaxing. And quicker.
BTW I think 45mpg is very good going and would need to be on a good cruise. I typically get 35 as an average. The TS will average 30. Or low 20's if your pants are on fire.
Lots.
It sounds good too. It is a more delicate engine than the relatively simple single overhead cam 2 valve JTD, so you need to make sure cambelt, balancer belt, pulleys and variator have all been changed - and keep changing them every 3 years or 36,000 miles. £400 or so. All 8 plugs at least every 60,000 miles.
Put it this way. When I drive the wife's 2.0 145QV, it's still fun and the rush as you come "on the cam" at 4,500 and the second go again at 6,000 is great. But the JTD is much more relaxing. And quicker.
BTW I think 45mpg is very good going and would need to be on a good cruise. I typically get 35 as an average. The TS will average 30. Or low 20's if your pants are on fire.
rick
Thanks, that is interesting. Anyone else want to post MPG?
If I was looking at a 2001 car then the jtd is 135bhp and the 2ts is 155 so it is down to the torque, and lets face it we have a cerbera in case we ever need to go very fast
If it is between 30 for the ts and 35 mpg for the jtd then there is little point handing on...
D
Thanks, that is interesting. Anyone else want to post MPG?
If I was looking at a 2001 car then the jtd is 135bhp and the 2ts is 155 so it is down to the torque, and lets face it we have a cerbera in case we ever need to go very fast
If it is between 30 for the ts and 35 mpg for the jtd then there is little point handing on...
D
I think it's more important to find a good car than be worrying about your mpg to be honest. The money you could "possibly" save in fuel could be offset by ££££ repairs bills every verse end if you buy a mut.
If you could find a mint V6 with a monster warranty, it will be a more economical buy than a JTD dog.
Honest!
If you could find a mint V6 with a monster warranty, it will be a more economical buy than a JTD dog.
Honest!
I have never met a TVR owner with such a big hang up about mpg!!!
It's impossible to say isn't it? Everyone has different driving styles and different routes. My usual journeys are about town and over the moors. So it's usually stop start or clogging it up a 1 in 3. The JTD shows 35 as an average on the computer. On a recent trip to Wales - clear motorway all the way, it averaged 49.5. I know V6 owners with sub 20 averages, and some claiming high 20's. I used to get low 20's from a 2.0TS and my mate gets low 30's.
All I'm saying is that doing 12,000 miles a year it is not the biggest issue with running an Alfa privately!
The four pots have two more very expensive spark plugs than the V6 for instance! They all have air flow meters which pack up at £140 a pop + VAT + Labour. The cambelt situation is dire on the Twin Sparks. And on it goes.
Just buy a good one and make sure all the bits have either been done - and you can prove it, or else get them done quick!!!
Edited because my typing was pants.
>> Edited by wombat rick on Thursday 27th May 17:22
It's impossible to say isn't it? Everyone has different driving styles and different routes. My usual journeys are about town and over the moors. So it's usually stop start or clogging it up a 1 in 3. The JTD shows 35 as an average on the computer. On a recent trip to Wales - clear motorway all the way, it averaged 49.5. I know V6 owners with sub 20 averages, and some claiming high 20's. I used to get low 20's from a 2.0TS and my mate gets low 30's.
All I'm saying is that doing 12,000 miles a year it is not the biggest issue with running an Alfa privately!
The four pots have two more very expensive spark plugs than the V6 for instance! They all have air flow meters which pack up at £140 a pop + VAT + Labour. The cambelt situation is dire on the Twin Sparks. And on it goes.
Just buy a good one and make sure all the bits have either been done - and you can prove it, or else get them done quick!!!
Edited because my typing was pants.
>> Edited by wombat rick on Thursday 27th May 17:22
We've got a 150bhp 2.4 JTD SW, we don't hang around, ie motorway driving is fast where able, 80-120, acceleration is brisk and it's often loaded up, average MPG over 30k has been 45 MPG, round town we get 39-47 MPG, on runs we get 40-52 MPG (all at 70 MPH or above). We do 20k a year and it has saved us loads of money in petrol, we had a Honda CTR (did 20-30MPG, so similar to most nippy 2.0ltr 4 pots)before and the difference in what goes out of my account each month on petrol and insurance is very noticeable.
Not had a problem with the car yet, nice to drive, relatively quick, looks good and comfy to be in.
Cheaper to buy than it's German equivalent, so money lost in depreciation is pretty similar, as are parts, but servicing is more frequent than VAG units, not that 12k is that bad a service interval.
Wombat!! what the bloody hell are you doing with your right foot to 35MPG average? I've only managed to get that low on a journey once, it was a short fast blast to show someone how well it went.
Not had a problem with the car yet, nice to drive, relatively quick, looks good and comfy to be in.
Cheaper to buy than it's German equivalent, so money lost in depreciation is pretty similar, as are parts, but servicing is more frequent than VAG units, not that 12k is that bad a service interval.
Wombat!! what the bloody hell are you doing with your right foot to 35MPG average? I've only managed to get that low on a journey once, it was a short fast blast to show someone how well it went.
dougal said:
Wombat!! what the bloody hell are you doing with your right foot to 35MPG average? I've only managed to get that low on a journey once, it was a short fast blast to show someone how well it went.
I do lots of town driving. Lots of 5 miles trips. Start. Stop. Go up a big hill. Stop again. Bit grim really. So it tends to be 1st - 2nd. Stop. 1st - 2nd etc etc.
I saw 16.5 on the instant readout overtaking up a big hill once.
But as you say, as soon as you get into a good cruise you are well into the high 40's.
wombat rick said:
But as you say, as soon as you get into a good cruise you are well into the high 40's.
Bloody hell, as soon as I get the cerbera into a good cruise I get into the low 20's
. I nearly talked myself into the idea that a v6 was a good idea, from there it was a short step to a GTA. Thanks for bringing me back to the idea of a JTD
D
Davidd, like you I've got the tiv for balls out driving, but out of all the cars we have had as shopping cars, general mile munchers, the JTD has been the best. We have had Scoobies and a CTR, which are fast, capable and reliable, but none of them were as nice a place to be as the Alfa, the Alfa can almost be as much fun on the twisties too. We just found that 90MPH on the motorway is the same boring event in any car so may as well make it comfy and economical without being mundane(o).
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