Reliability issues - just a load of old news?
Discussion
I've today got back from holiday at the wife's parents place in the South of France. Nothing unusual there for this time of year, however one of their neighbours down there has just sold his new shape Lancia Delta and replaced it with:
Pretty much identical to that anyway!
Anyway, long and short of it is that i've taken a major shine to this car having had the chance to have a good nosey at it over the last few days.
Plan is to try and get a test drive in soonish before i go back to my German/VAG ways and re-set my heart on something from Germany.
Was chatting to the father in law about this in France and he kept referring to Top Gear and that they knew what they're taking about - but just wondering really - is this a load of OLD tosh?
I've had Peugeot's in the past and folks always used to say they were crap! Of the 3 i had, only 1 let me down - and it waited til 77k/3.5 yrs before doing this. The other 2 never, EVER, missed a beat! One was a 2000 model, the other 2003, so it's not like they're more old-school stuff.
Just wondering if the whole Alfa 'reputation' is based on the likes of the 33 or 145 even? Or whether they're still not a great buy for someone likely to cover 30k per yr. I do remember my old boss looking at a Brera at a show and telling the sales guy he wasn't interested because of the reputation he'd heard of and the sales chap told him anything produced after 2004 (or at least new models produced after 2004) used different systems (not sure what exactly - seemed very vague) and as result, they were massively more reliable.
Anything considered would probably be a diesel!
For what it's worth, the JD Power 2010 doesn't consider Alfa at all.
All help/opinion/experiences appreciated!
Pretty much identical to that anyway!
Anyway, long and short of it is that i've taken a major shine to this car having had the chance to have a good nosey at it over the last few days.
Plan is to try and get a test drive in soonish before i go back to my German/VAG ways and re-set my heart on something from Germany.
Was chatting to the father in law about this in France and he kept referring to Top Gear and that they knew what they're taking about - but just wondering really - is this a load of OLD tosh?
I've had Peugeot's in the past and folks always used to say they were crap! Of the 3 i had, only 1 let me down - and it waited til 77k/3.5 yrs before doing this. The other 2 never, EVER, missed a beat! One was a 2000 model, the other 2003, so it's not like they're more old-school stuff.
Just wondering if the whole Alfa 'reputation' is based on the likes of the 33 or 145 even? Or whether they're still not a great buy for someone likely to cover 30k per yr. I do remember my old boss looking at a Brera at a show and telling the sales guy he wasn't interested because of the reputation he'd heard of and the sales chap told him anything produced after 2004 (or at least new models produced after 2004) used different systems (not sure what exactly - seemed very vague) and as result, they were massively more reliable.
Anything considered would probably be a diesel!
For what it's worth, the JD Power 2010 doesn't consider Alfa at all.
All help/opinion/experiences appreciated!
I think the newer models, post 156/147 in large stopped using the Alfa TS engines, which were reputed to have cambelt/variator issues and I believe make up the major part of the reputation of models from that (pre 2004?) era. I think they went onto the JTS engines and now onto something else.
On my 156 the main issues have been electrical related, MAF, AICV, airbag, bulbs, rev counter, aircon etc, although none have caused my car to break down. All are thanks to Bosch and Magneto Marelli. Bushes are also supposed to be a weak point. Maybe these areas have been addressed too with the advent of the 159?
On my 156 the main issues have been electrical related, MAF, AICV, airbag, bulbs, rev counter, aircon etc, although none have caused my car to break down. All are thanks to Bosch and Magneto Marelli. Bushes are also supposed to be a weak point. Maybe these areas have been addressed too with the advent of the 159?
I'm now on my second, and both have been virtually trouble free. The biggest flaw with reputations is that they are so easy to gain and so incredibly difficult to shake off. The Germans managed to carve themselves a reputation for quality, and what is the outcome of this? A BMW breaks down and it's a one off, a freak occurrence. It happens to an Alfa, and it's the "same old story."
To be honest, even if you are unlucky and you have your fair share of issues, the positives far outweigh the negatives, from the avenues of engine noise, the beauty both internally and externally, the beautiful steering feel and the character that seems to ooze from every orifice.
To be honest, even if you are unlucky and you have your fair share of issues, the positives far outweigh the negatives, from the avenues of engine noise, the beauty both internally and externally, the beautiful steering feel and the character that seems to ooze from every orifice.
sider said:
Anything considered would probably be a diesel!
For what it's worth, the JD Power 2010 doesn't consider Alfa at all.
I've had my 1.9 diesel 159 ti Sportwagon for just over two years, and the issues I've had are:For what it's worth, the JD Power 2010 doesn't consider Alfa at all.
Driver's door needed re-aligned, it was rubbing slightly on the b-pillar.
Front-end respray for excessive stone-chipping, a problem with Alfa Red paint.
Internal latch on the estate door needed replaced, the microswitch was broken so the interior lights didn't come on when it was opened.
In my experience, having owned seven Alfas and various other makes, the unreliability thing is largely a myth - of course some of them have some faults, as with any make of car. A lot of the reputation dates to the 70s / 80s cars, but some of the blame has to go to the 156-era cars when Alfa specified an unrealistically long service interval for the cambelt, resulting in broken belts and broken engines.
The secondary problem with that is that many of the dealers were rubbish, so if something did go wrong then it became a major headache. A couple of years ago the worst of the dealers were culled so now the majority of the dealers are pretty good, most of the time. Again, it's like any make - some dealers are better than others.
I don't put a great deal of faith in surveys like JD Power, preferring to go on my own first-hand experience, but for what it's worth Alfa were second in the 2009 JD Power in Germany - equal with Mercedes and ahead of BMW and Toyota.
Edited by jamieboy on Thursday 30th September 07:16
Interesting stuff - thanks for the response folks. Did make me think - when was the last time i saw an Alfa on the hard shoulder with driver stood on the embankment on his/her mobile awaiting the orange or yellow van!
I've only ever driven an Alfa once, it was a GTV Cup 3.0 V6 that belonged to my mate, and as it happens, is for sale in the PH classifieds! An absolute hoot to drive but obviously im aware that a 1.9 diesel is going to be completely different to that!
My initial thoughts are a 159, probably an estate because of the young family - as the one i saw was simply stunning but i think most Alfas are beautiful cars. I'd certainly consider a 5 dr 147 Ducati Corse model, and wife-permitting (if i can keep her in the family car a bit longer so i can have a 'toy') a Brera or GT wouldn't be out of the question.
A Guilietta is certainly very high on the list but budget wise at the moment, not so. Lets see how their prices go.
Thanks again.
I've only ever driven an Alfa once, it was a GTV Cup 3.0 V6 that belonged to my mate, and as it happens, is for sale in the PH classifieds! An absolute hoot to drive but obviously im aware that a 1.9 diesel is going to be completely different to that!
My initial thoughts are a 159, probably an estate because of the young family - as the one i saw was simply stunning but i think most Alfas are beautiful cars. I'd certainly consider a 5 dr 147 Ducati Corse model, and wife-permitting (if i can keep her in the family car a bit longer so i can have a 'toy') a Brera or GT wouldn't be out of the question.
A Guilietta is certainly very high on the list but budget wise at the moment, not so. Lets see how their prices go.
Thanks again.
sider said:
Interesting stuff - thanks for the response folks. Did make me think - when was the last time i saw an Alfa on the hard shoulder with driver stood on the embankment on his/her mobile awaiting the orange or yellow van!
I've only ever driven an Alfa once, it was a GTV Cup 3.0 V6 that belonged to my mate, and as it happens, is for sale in the PH classifieds! An absolute hoot to drive but obviously im aware that a 1.9 diesel is going to be completely different to that!
My initial thoughts are a 159, probably an estate because of the young family - as the one i saw was simply stunning but i think most Alfas are beautiful cars. I'd certainly consider a 5 dr 147 Ducati Corse model, and wife-permitting (if i can keep her in the family car a bit longer so i can have a 'toy') a Brera or GT wouldn't be out of the question.
A Guilietta is certainly very high on the list but budget wise at the moment, not so. Lets see how their prices go.
Thanks again.
I have lots of friends with 1.9 GT's and 159's...I've only ever driven an Alfa once, it was a GTV Cup 3.0 V6 that belonged to my mate, and as it happens, is for sale in the PH classifieds! An absolute hoot to drive but obviously im aware that a 1.9 diesel is going to be completely different to that!
My initial thoughts are a 159, probably an estate because of the young family - as the one i saw was simply stunning but i think most Alfas are beautiful cars. I'd certainly consider a 5 dr 147 Ducati Corse model, and wife-permitting (if i can keep her in the family car a bit longer so i can have a 'toy') a Brera or GT wouldn't be out of the question.
A Guilietta is certainly very high on the list but budget wise at the moment, not so. Lets see how their prices go.
Thanks again.
If you are anywhere near ST Helens pop in and see Gus At Alfatune, he can (for not much money) take you to just shy of 200bhp, increase MPG and monster the torque figures....
I drive a 1991 75 Twinspark which dates from Alfa's "unreliable" period.
I commute 90 miles a day and in the last two and a bit years that I've owned this one it's done 60,000 miles. It's now on 158,000 and has just been on an 1850 mile trip around Europe which included 8 laps of the Nordschleife.
During that time I've changed the oil, filter and plugs put a new set of discs and pads on it (previous owner had fitted horrible Tarox grooved discs which I didnt like) a pair of track rod ends and an alternator.
That's it apart from the odd light bulb.
I commute 90 miles a day and in the last two and a bit years that I've owned this one it's done 60,000 miles. It's now on 158,000 and has just been on an 1850 mile trip around Europe which included 8 laps of the Nordschleife.
During that time I've changed the oil, filter and plugs put a new set of discs and pads on it (previous owner had fitted horrible Tarox grooved discs which I didnt like) a pair of track rod ends and an alternator.
That's it apart from the odd light bulb.
waynedear said:
I have lots of friends with 1.9 GT's and 159's...
If you are anywhere near ST Helens pop in and see Gus At Alfatune, he can (for not much money) take you to just shy of 200bhp, increase MPG and monster the torque figures....
Will call in - St Helens is less than 4 miles from where i live.If you are anywhere near ST Helens pop in and see Gus At Alfatune, he can (for not much money) take you to just shy of 200bhp, increase MPG and monster the torque figures....
sider said:
waynedear said:
If you are anywhere near ST Helens pop in and see Gus At Alfatune, he can (for not much money) take you to just shy of 200bhp, increase MPG and monster the torque figures....
Will call in - St Helens is less than 4 miles from where i live.Gus took my '99 GTV 3.0 24v from the village garage who were decent enough to admit they couldn't really do the work needed and the potential for high costs for me as a result.
He fitted a new cambelt, new radiator, new thermostat, new headgaskets, new head bolts (or at least tightened them properly, the cause of the overheating in the first place) and replaced all relevant fluids etc for less than 25% of the cost that a main agent (Mangoletsi being nearest to me) would charge.
The car was on the borderline of being about to cost far more than I paid for it and becoming a real disappointment but instead I collected a car that is every bit as good and properly Alfa-eccentric as they can be though I haven't taken him up on any of his performance enhancement ideas. Yet...
So, Alfatune is recommended by me and here's my GTV a few days post-Gus:
Edited by XXVIII on Sunday 3rd October 22:33
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