Advice with negotiation

[Ben-imhe8]

Hello

I’m contracted to 44 hours/5 days a week and my salary is £23,000.

I’ve found that I don’t need that amount of hours in order to complete my line of work, instead I could it over 4 days, 10 hours a day.

This would also work in the company’s favour as it would cut out a lot of travelling which means less fuel and less wear and tear on the vehicle.

I would not work over 4 days if it meant I had to fulfil my contracted 44 hours as 11 hours a day would mean I wouldn’t finish in time to collect my child from school , neither does essentially losing those 4 hours a week pay (£2k per year)

Do you think the company would entertain meeting in the middle, I.e a £1k cut, 40 hour contract over 4 days, bearing in mind the work still gets completed at less cost to them in both wages and travelling costs.

I know it may seem bizarre me suggesting a pay cut for myself, however the prospect of 3 day weekends and less travelling suits me entirely, just not with a 2k cut!

[V8mate]

Would your productivity be affected? i.e. will you be achieving a smaller output?

If not, why offer a salary reduction?

[Ben-imhe8]

No, my work output would literally be the same, im employed to carry out safety visits to the companies 50 premises each month,throughout the country, these would still be completed on time.

The reason for the pay cut suggestion is because I’m not sure the company would bother entertaining it otherwise.

It’s not a small company, I believe there are 12,000 employees, I’m the only person in my field.

[V8mate]

If you're a limited resource, they may value your availability to the business across the full working week.

[Pit Pony]

Ask for a pay rise.
When they say no. Say well how about paying me the same as now, and I'll try and see if I can do the same work in less hours.
Be careful. I know 95% of managers who would give you more work to fill the time you have spare..

[Jasandjules]

Just put in a request and set out your proposal... They can only say no. You don't say "I have nothing to do" but "I want to work four days a week so I can spend more quality family time and I am willing to work 10 hours a day Mon-Thurs to do so. The company will get the work done by me.....

[martinbiz]

Jasandjules said:

Just put in a request and set out your proposal... They can only say no. You don't say "I have nothing to do" but "I want to work four days a week so I can spend more quality family time and I am willing to work 10 hours a day Mon-Thurs to do so. The company will get the work done by me.....

OP as this above, J and J know their stuff. I deal with a fair amount of HR stuff at my work, I am by no means an expert but have dealt with several similar requests over the years, an employer cannot just give a blanket no to a request to change your working practice, hours, flexibiliy etc, any request must be fully and properly condsidered by your employer and they may need to demonstrate valid reasons, commercial or otherwise why such a request cannot be granted. You are not asking to reduce your hours by very much, but increase your hours per day to allow a 4 day week which does not sound unreasonable, especially if most of your work is out in the field

I am not sure why you say it would reduce the company's travel costs though, if you are visting 50 customers per month now, then you still will be, just more in a day

[Ben-imhe8]

Thank for the advice so far

I’ve done the maths/planning behind it, e.g

Currently

Day 1

Home >site 1> site 2> site 3> Home

Day 2

Home > site 4>site 5> site 6> home

Day 3

Home > site 7> site 8> site 9 >site 10> home

Suggestion

Day 1

Home > site 1 > site 2> site 3> site 4> site 5 > Home

Day 2

Home > site 6> site 7> site 8> site 9> site 10 > home

It’s an over simplification but hopefully you get my point, I’ve cut the travelling to and from home, I’ve done the man maths and over the course of the month I’ve worked out I cut around 1500 miles.

Edited by Ben-imhe8 on Saturday 27th February 22:19

[Drawweight]

Then put it to the company that you’ve found a brilliant way to save them money on travelling costs.

Don’t dwell on the benefits to you but the benefit it will bring to them.

[67Dino]

My understanding is that a company is legally bound to consider flexible working options if the work can still be done.

As mentioned earlier though, they may want someone around 5 days a week for cover. I also wonder if the extended hours suit those you are visiting so well. Also the employer may wonder if the new approach was less resilient to problems, such as weather and traffic. Finally, they may worry if that’s too many hours to be driving safely, and if it sets a precedent for others.

But as others have said, you can only ask. I wouldn’t offer a salary reduction, I’d just propose the alternative working pattern, mention the fuel saving (be worth calculating), and see what they say. At the least it’s got to be positive that an employee is being proactive in coming up with novel ways to do things.

[Matt_E_Mulsion]

Would you be in danger of them suggesting that your site safety visits are not thorough enough if you've got time to spare???

[jimmydash]

The golden rule of negotiation - "The answer is always no if you don't ask"

[Ben-imhe8]

The safety checks im required to carry out are only in a specific area, it’s done properly and to the letter as it’s my signature on the paperwork after all!

However As someone’s mentioned, having my request rejected and then opening the can of worms in terms of spare time and possibility of creating myself more work has me cautious, it wouldn’t surprise me if my manager was part of that 95%

[Mr Pointy]

If some days you are only doing three site inspections is that because that's all that can be fitted into the day or because that's all that has been booked in - do you sometime finish early? Your plan would mean that the company would have to book five jobs a day which might not be possible.

Will all clients be available for the 10 hour window you want to work? They might not be around early in the morning or late in the afternoon. Does the current daily quota allow for jobs to run late & still allow you to finish the last one? Might that be an issue if you have more jobs per day - is there a danger you couldn't do the last one in the day?

You're limiting the flexibility the company has - they have to fill more slots in the day & they can't take bookings on Fridays so why would they want to change the current arrangement?

[Ben-imhe8]

Mr Pointy said:

If some days you are only doing three site inspections is that because that's all that can be fitted into the day or because that's all that has been booked in - do you sometime finish early? Your plan would mean that the company would have to book five jobs a day which might not be possible.

Will all clients be available for the 10 hour window you want to work? They might not be around early in the morning or late in the afternoon. Does the current daily quota allow for jobs to run late & still allow you to finish the last one? Might that be an issue if you have more jobs per day - is there a danger you couldn't do the last one in the day?

You're limiting the flexibility the company has - they have to fill more slots in the day & they can't take bookings on Fridays so why would they want to change the current arrangement?

I do my own planning, no booking required it’s just a turn up and away you go, the buildings are available 0600-21:00.

I plan them in geographically, when I first started i brought up the fact that most days there’s not enough work and was told to just go home once finished, new manager knocked that on the head and I’ve been dragging it out ever since

[Mr Pointy]

Ben-imhe8 said:

I do my own planning, no booking required it’s just a turn up and away you go, the buildings are available 0600-21:00.

I plan them in geographically, when I first started i brought up the fact that most days there’s not enough work and was told to just go home once finished, new manager knocked that on the head and I’ve been dragging it out ever since

That last bit is going to be a problem isn't it? You already can't fill some days & you're proposing that Friday is not available so how can you guarantee that you'll be able to fill the remaining four days so the business see the same amount of income? If you can suddenly fill the four days someone might ask why you weren't doing that before.

[bigandclever]

What would your response be if they say ‘Great, but it’s Mon & Tue and Thur & Fri you’ll be working. Weds are all yours’?

[omniflow]

One point you could concede on (if required) is to vary the day of the week when you don't work according to demand / circumstances. It doesn't give you a guaranteed 3 day weekend, but it's still probably better than working 5 days.

[Ben-imhe8]

Mr Pointy said:

That last bit is going to be a problem isn't it? You already can't fill some days & you're proposing that Friday is not available so how can you guarantee that you'll be able to fill the remaining four days so the business see the same amount of income? If you can suddenly fill the four days someone might ask why you weren't doing that before.

I’ve been attending sites based on location, and trying to cut out unnecessary travel

Example

3 jobs in Birmingham, closest jobs to here is Lincoln where there’s another 2 jobs

I would travel to Birmingham, complete the 3 jobs there and return home

Rather than travelling to Lincoln after Birmingham and only fitting in one of the jobs and so having to return to Lincoln another day (overtime isn’t paid), with a longer day I would be able to fit in the second job in Lincoln.

The business receives income for me attending all 50 of the premises, in theory it doesn’t matter how many sites I attend on a certain day aslong as by months end all jobs are complete, it’s also the same charge regardless of how long I’m on site for

[V8mate]

Working five days each week gives your schedule - and the company's income - a bit of redundancy though, so you get everything done, even if one day there's a nightmare on the roads, or you take a day off sick etc.